Biden is clever enough to still be running circles around the world dictators' attempts to trigger world war 3.

cannabineer said:

Don’t we also have a treaty with Ukraine pledging them security when they gave up their nukes? I could be wrong.

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My guess is that this was similar to the Iran deal and was not a actual signed into law like we have with Isreal. I am not really familiar with it at all though, but I am guessing if we had a actual mutual defense treaty with Ukraine like we do with Nato, Putin would not have attacked them.

https://www.brookings.edu/articles/the-trilateral-process-the-united-states-ukraine-russia-and-nuclear-weapons/

hanimmal said:

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but……..but he’s Jewish?

lemondroptrichomes said:

but……..but he’s Jewish?

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That’s okay. Jesus will treat him the same as anybody else.

lemondroptrichomes said:

but……..but he’s Jewish?

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I remember talking to people from another country that were figuring out our language when at school and they kept saying how religious we were as a society and how it was kind of odd.

I was pretty much like sure I can see it, but didn't think much of it, when one day I picked up on them thinking I was too and them being surprised when I said I am really not.

Turns out they were confused why we kept saying prayers, and that was what they were thinking was why we were so religious. It was really funny when they were told it was just something we say when people sneeze. Here in Michigan in fall/winter/spring there is pretty much always someone around with a cold so they were hearing it everywhere and didn't get that 'bless you' is just some automatic response lol.

cannabineer said:

That’s okay. Jesus will treat him the same as anybody else.

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I mean my first response was it reminds me of a south park episode lol. You have to admit it’s a little crass. I’m not particularly religious (or well - I don’t think the masculine monotheistic religions only a few thousand years old have all the answers) but imagine if someone said that to the leader of India or Iran. It would probably not go over too well.

hanimmal said:

I remember talking to people from another country that were figuring out our language when at school and they kept saying how religious we were as a society and how it was kind of odd.

I was pretty much like sure I can see it, but didn't think much of it, when one day I picked up on them thinking I was too and them being surprised when I said I am really not.

Turns out they were confused why we kept saying prayers, and that was what they were thinking was why we were so religious. It was really funny when they were told it was just something we say when people sneeze. Here in Michigan in fall/winter/spring there is pretty much always someone around with a cold so they were hearing it everywhere and didn't get that 'bless you' is just some automatic response lol.

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nothing wrong with a bless you or my favorite “bless your heart”

Come to Jesus is one I haven’t really used in passing though

lemondroptrichomes said:

I mean my first response was it reminds me of a south park episode lol. You have to admit it’s a little crass. I’m not particularly religious (or well - I don’t think the masculine monotheistic religions only a few thousand years old have all the answers) but imagine if someone said that to the leader of India or Iran. It would probably not go over too well.

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Jesus accepts them too.

lemondroptrichomes said:

I mean my first response was it reminds me of a south park episode lol. You have to admit it’s a little crass. I’m not particularly religious (or well - I don’t think the masculine monotheistic religions only a few thousand years old have all the answers) but imagine if someone said that to the leader of India or Iran. It would probably not go over too well.

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I thought his 'illegals' comment was off-putting myself.

Idk actually, I don't study religion or anything, but you pick stuff up. But I think Jesus is a historical figure in the Jewish religion and others too. But it is not like Biden is not a old ass white guy. Him talking shit about a dictator who is messing up hard and a murdering rapist is not the end of the world.

lemondroptrichomes said:

I mean my first response was it reminds me of a south park episode lol. You have to admit it’s a little crass. I’m not particularly religious (or well - I don’t think the masculine monotheistic religions only a few thousand years old have all the answers) but imagine if someone said that to the leader of India or Iran. It would probably not go over too well.

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It would be a little crass to say something like that to a stranger who is Jewish. But Biden knows Netanyahu well enough to know how he would take that. It probably would not go over well if Biden said the same to Modi or whoever it is that now controls Iran. Then again, Biden hasn't.

If one looks at how Biden interacts with people, he plays the part of the politician -- looking for a connection with each person. He even interacted with Ms Green on a personal basis. She showed up in regalia that was intended to provoke and Biden reacted with an exaggerated expression as if to say, "look at you", and made a positive interaction out of it. A good chuckle is always better than a scowl. So, IDK if we should read very much into that hot mic moment. Biden seems to know how to deal with people, including those who disagree with him over an important issue, without alienating them.

I don't pretend to be a war buff, and before Trump really did not have a lot of bandwidth earmarked towards foreign affairs, but I do tend to understand trolling pretty well, and how they bait people into shit.

So I just had a random thought.

Russia is at a point that they are building weapons faster than we are thanks to Republican obstructing defense bills. We have treaties with Isreal that would mean we have to break the law for Biden to stop selling them arms (pretty sure, willing to be corrected if I am wrong).

So I can see a scenario where Netanyahu, being the dictator avoiding justice that is what Trump wants, pushing as much as he can to get us to break our laws freeing him up to buy weapons from Russia (who is also funding the gangs that have been giving Netanyahu his reason to continue the war), and once that tie is cut (Netanyahu can blame us for breaking our treaties freeing him up to do whatever), they get to take the land away from the Palestanians the right wing hate mongers in Isreal want, China gets to turn up the heat and take Taiwan, and Russia (with the help of say a Hungry stalling NATO) can push harder to take over Ukraine with the rest of the free world distracted.

hanimmal said:

I don't pretend to be a war buff, and before Trump really did not have a lot of bandwidth earmarked towards foreign affairs, but I do tend to understand trolling pretty well, and how they bait people into shit.

So I just had a random thought.

Russia is at a point that they are building weapons faster than we are thanks to Republican obstructing defense bills. We have treaties with Isreal that would mean we have to break the law for Biden to stop selling them arms (pretty sure, willing to be corrected if I am wrong).

So I can see a scenario where Netanyahu, being the dictator avoiding justice that is what Trump wants, pushing as much as he can to get us to break our laws freeing him up to buy weapons from Russia (who is also funding the gangs that have been giving Netanyahu his reason to continue the war), and once that tie is cut (Netanyahu can blame us for breaking our treaties freeing him up to do whatever), they get to take the land away from the Palestanians the right wing hate mongers in Isreal want, China gets to turn up the heat and take Taiwan, and Russia (with the help of say a Hungry stalling NATO) can push harder to take over Ukraine with the rest of the free world distracted.

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+
Thinking about North Korea's burr up their dictators' ass(es) about (again I am naive) both South Korea and Japan, and their historical ties to China (and I guess proximity, and now since Ukraine war ((at least I think)) ties to their other neighbor, Russia) combined with willingness to be what Iran is in the Middle East, verbal aggression towards Japan and South Korea. I could see how they would be the trigger to distract America from that portion of the planet, while Russia hits it from the Ukrainian/EU front, while pot-shot'ing North America from Antartica.

Then with all the Russian and Chinese bullshit going on in Africa, that would be the last habitable continent that would be sucked in.

India has always been the one nation that I think has a real shot at outpacing America if they get their shit together and wipe out corruption/nepatism/classism/racism) the shit holding them back as far as I know is hanging back from deciding (although I think their leader wants a promotion to Dear Leader, I don't think that the people agree).

Anyways, may we live in interesting times I guess. Maybe it is just at some point every lifespan of humanity tends to have interesting times. It just happens that we are starting to have longer memories and are starting to get at the end of ww2's.

hanimmal said:

I don't pretend to be a war buff, and before Trump really did not have a lot of bandwidth earmarked towards foreign affairs, but I do tend to understand trolling pretty well, and how they bait people into shit.

So I just had a random thought.

Russia is at a point that they are building weapons faster than we are thanks to Republican obstructing defense bills. We have treaties with Isreal that would mean we have to break the law for Biden to stop selling them arms (pretty sure, willing to be corrected if I am wrong).

So I can see a scenario where Netanyahu, being the dictator avoiding justice that is what Trump wants, pushing as much as he can to get us to break our laws freeing him up to buy weapons from Russia (who is also funding the gangs that have been giving Netanyahu his reason to continue the war), and once that tie is cut (Netanyahu can blame us for breaking our treaties freeing him up to do whatever), they get to take the land away from the Palestanians the right wing hate mongers in Isreal want, China gets to turn up the heat and take Taiwan, and Russia (with the help of say a Hungry stalling NATO) can push harder to take over Ukraine with the rest of the free world distracted.

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I'll start by saying I do think the world is on a trajectory for another great war, but I think it centres around China.

Netanyahu is a criminal grifter, but is far from stupid and hasn't really shown to be an extreme ideological compared to many others he has needed for political survival thus far - so to think he would really attempt anything that threatens US support of Israel is extremely unlikely, as long as Iran still exists. In addition to the Persians wanting to eliminate Israel, do you think the Arabs would still be open to normalizing relations with Israel if there was no US relationship? It's certainly possible that Arab nations would want to try and keep the peace, but the Middle East is awfully complex and I wouldn't be at all surprised if Israel would be in serious trouble without US (and other Western) support.

Both Hungary and Türkiye can be a thorn in NATO at times, but everything I have read about them being an irritant inside NATO should be seen as not much more than that, an irritant. They seem to understand how far they can push things to try and gain something but know they lose everything if they go too far, and have always done what was expected of them.

There has been enough said by Western (not just US) military leaders to believe that there is a reasonable expectation, or at least a strong possibility of a much larger war in 2025. In my completely uneducated opinion, Western military leaders are using Russia as the excuse to (try and) get the war machine ramped up in a way that doesn't provoke the People's Republic of China. This assumes anyone other than TFFG is leading the US in 2025.

CANON_Grow said:

I'll start by saying I do think the world is on a trajectory for another great war, but I think it centres around China.

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I still put us as the big dog in the fight, I do think that China is the other big dog in the fight that the smaller dogs are hoping will have their back when shit hits the fan to keep us occupied.

CANON_Grow said:

Netanyahu is a criminal grifter, but is far from stupid and hasn't really shown to be an extreme ideological compared to many others he has needed for political survival thus far - so to think he would really attempt anything that threatens US support of Israel is extremely unlikely, as long as Iran still exists.

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Unless Iran is in Putin's pocket, and they have a back room alliance with them to keep Netanyahu's criminal ass in power so that he doesn't go to jail and the right wing hate mongers get to do what they want to the Palestinians is pretty much what I'm bullshitting in my post. I don't think there is much difference between Hammas using the Palestinian people as human shields that they are willing to let die for them to maintain power as there is for Bibi.

CANON_Grow said:

In addition to the Persians wanting to eliminate Israel, do you think the Arabs would still be open to normalizing relations with Israel if there was no US relationship? It's certainly possible that Arab nations would want to try and keep the peace, but the Middle East is awfully complex and I wouldn't be at all surprised if Israel would be in serious trouble without US (and other Western) support.

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I think it is more about a couple of dictators willingness to screw over America than it is about the population as a whole.

And Isreal has enough firepower to fuck their worlds up, so outside of pop shots at the vulnerable from terrorist proxies, I don't think that they are that willing to actually try for all out war against Isreal anytime soon. At least until they are desperate enough because the hate mongering 'royalty' is about to lose their power, which again my ignorance in their nation is something that is fuzzy to me to know enough about (outside of Iranians really not being happy with it the last decade).

CANON_Grow said:

I'll start by saying I do think the world is on a trajectory for another great war, but I think it centres around China.

Netanyahu is a criminal grifter, but is far from stupid and hasn't really shown to be an extreme ideological compared to many others he has needed for political survival thus far - so to think he would really attempt anything that threatens US support of Israel is extremely unlikely, as long as Iran still exists. In addition to the Persians wanting to eliminate Israel, do you think the Arabs would still be open to normalizing relations with Israel if there was no US relationship?

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I do not disagree. But I am just separating Netanyahu's calculus of his own best interest from the Isreali people's best interest. Just like I do Trump watching out for Trump before the American people's.

CANON_Grow said:

Both Hungary and Türkiye can be a thorn in NATO at times, but everything I have read about them being an irritant inside NATO should be seen as not much more than that, an irritant. They seem to understand how far they can push things to try and gain something but know they lose everything if they go too far, and have always done what was expected of them.

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I will admit I do not know much about these countries outside of one of the leaders being a dictator that got away with beating on protesters here in America, and the other being in charge of a nation that I had a very good friend tell me he preferred dictatorships over democracy.

So for real I think what I am saying has a very high chance of being complete bullshit. I am just tossing spaghetti at the wall atm.

CANON_Grow said:

There has been enough said by Western (not just US) military leaders to believe that there is a reasonable expectation, or at least a strong possibility of a much larger war in 2025.

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I really hope Biden and his team continue to be humble enough to keep us out of it. It sucks that the Republicans in office are not all in on doing the same.

CANON_Grow said:

In my completely uneducated opinion, Western military leaders are using Russia as the excuse to (try and) get the war machine ramped up in a way that doesn't provoke the People's Republic of China. This assumes anyone other than TFFG is leading the US in 2025.

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If it wasn't for Brexit, Ukraine, Seria, there involvement with Iran and N Korea, and their constant attack on our citizens/infrastructure I would agree. I was one of the ones nodding their head to Obama's mistaken negging of Romney saying they are our biggest adversary in the 2012 election.


And I was wrong, a year or two later, the dickhead Snowden (with the help of Assange) smuggled the equivalent to the new millenniums nuclear bomb to Putin which he has been using to great effect to tear our nation apart. Which is how TFFG was able to sneak into power in 2016 in the first place. Obama was right about Romeny's social and economic policies being crap though, so 2 out of 3.

hanimmal said:

I still put us as the big dog in the fight, I do think that China is the other big dog in the fight that the smaller dogs are hoping will have their back when shit hits the fan to keep us occupied.



Unless Iran is in Putin's pocket, and they have a back room alliance with them to keep Netanyahu's criminal ass in power so that he doesn't go to jail and the right wing hate mongers get to do what they want to the Palestinians is pretty much what I'm bullshitting in my post. I don't think there is much difference between Hammas using the Palestinian people as human shields that they are willing to let die for them to maintain power as there is for Bibi.

I think it is more about a couple of dictators willingness to screw over America than it is about the population as a whole.

And Isreal has enough firepower to fuck their worlds up, so outside of pop shots at the vulnerable from terrorist proxies, I don't think that they are that willing to actually try for all out war against Isreal anytime soon. At least until they are desperate enough because the hate mongering 'royalty' is about to lose their power, which again my ignorance in their nation is something that is fuzzy to me to know enough about (outside of Iranians really not being happy with it the last decade).

I do not disagree. But I am just separating Netanyahu's calculus of his own best interest from the Isreali people's best interest. Just like I do Trump watching out for Trump before the American people's.

I will admit I do not know much about these countries outside of one of the leaders being a dictator that got away with beating on protesters here in America, and the other being in charge of a nation that I had a very good friend tell me he preferred dictatorships over democracy.

So for real I think what I am saying has a very high chance of being complete bullshit. I am just tossing spaghetti at the wall atm.

I really hope Biden and his team continue to be humble enough to keep us out of it. It sucks that the Republicans in office are not all in on doing the same.

If it wasn't for Brexit, Ukraine, Seria, there involvement with Iran and N Korea, and their constant attack on our citizens/infrastructure I would agree. I was one of the ones nodding their head to Obama's mistaken negging of Romney saying they are our biggest adversary in the 2012 election.

And I was wrong, a year or two later, the dickhead Snowden (with the help of Assange) smuggled the equivalent to the new millenniums nuclear bomb to Putin which he has been using to great effect to tear our nation apart. Which is how TFFG was able to sneak into power in 2016 in the first place. Obama was right about Romeny's social and economic policies being crap though, so 2 out of 3.

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I rather doubt the average Iranian is ok with what their authoritarian leaders are doing. It’s important to distinguish between official channels and actual popular sentiment.

cannabineer said:

I rather doubt the average Iranian is ok with what their authoritarian leaders are doing. It’s important to distinguish between official channels and actual popular sentiment.

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I didn't think that needed to be clarified. This applies to all authoritarian leaders, war with PRC doesn't mean there is an issue with the citizens, rather the CCP and specifically Xi. War with Russia is because of Putin, not the average citizen. War with North Korea would be because Kim Jong Un, etc.

hanimmal said:

I really hope Biden and his team continue to be humble enough to keep us out of it. It sucks that the Republicans in office are not all in on doing the same.

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I'll disagree with you on this - not confronting the issue was tried before, see WW2.