DWC Root Slime Cure aka How to Breed Beneficial Microbes
- Thread starter Heisenberg
- Start date
Olympus Mons
Well-Known Member
Bud Candy contains sucrose (sugar), you don't want that or any other sweetener like molassas in DWC. The Lucas Formula requires no additives at all. I am a AN fan as well and have used Big Bud in the past with mixed results. It seems like if I don't over do it I won't get the slime, but for the small benefit it gives it's not really worth it.
Enzyme products like Hygrozyme have been proven to cause slime in DWC. I've tested them myself. Hygrozyme won't even release the ingredients in their product but all of those bottles contain organic proteins. For Lucas DWC I use AN's Micro, Bloom and only add the tea. Works great and keeps the roots and res nice and clean. Good luck!
Heisenberg
Well-Known Member
Just an FYI, fungi perfecti is once again selling the soluble myco mix which is comparable to great white. They had removed it from their site for a while but apparently only during reconstruction. This product combined with ancient forest is all you need to fight slime.
http://www.fungi.com/product-detail/product/mycogrow-soluble-1-oz.html $6/oz
Endomycorrhizal fungi
Glomus intraradices, Glomus mosseae, Glomus aggregatum, Glomus monosporum, Glomus clarum, Glomus deserticola, Gigaspora margarita, Gigaspora brasilianum, Gigaspora etunicatum
Ectomycorrhizal fungi
Rhizopogon villosullus, Rhizopogon luteolus, Rhizopogon amylopogon, Rhizopogon fulvigleba, Pisolithus tinctorius, Scleroderma cepa, Scleroderma citrinum
**Cannabis uses no ecto's
Trichoderma
Trichoderma harzianum, Trichoderma konigii
Beneficial Bacteria
Bacillus subtillus, Bacillus licheniformis, Bacillus azotoformans, Bacillus megaterium, Bacillus coagulans, Bacillus pumlis, Bacillus thuringiensis, Bacillus stearothermiphilis, Paenibacillus polymyxa, Paenibacillus durum, Paenibacillus florescence, Paenibacillus gordonae, Azotobacter polymyxa, Azotobacter chroococcum, Sacchromyces cervisiae, Streptomyces griseues, Streptomyces lydicus, Pseudomonas aureofaceans, Deinococcus erythromyxa
http://www.fungi.com/product-detail/product/mycogrow-soluble-1-oz.html $6/oz
Endomycorrhizal fungi
Glomus intraradices, Glomus mosseae, Glomus aggregatum, Glomus monosporum, Glomus clarum, Glomus deserticola, Gigaspora margarita, Gigaspora brasilianum, Gigaspora etunicatum
Ectomycorrhizal fungi
Rhizopogon villosullus, Rhizopogon luteolus, Rhizopogon amylopogon, Rhizopogon fulvigleba, Pisolithus tinctorius, Scleroderma cepa, Scleroderma citrinum
**Cannabis uses no ecto's
Trichoderma
Trichoderma harzianum, Trichoderma konigii
Beneficial Bacteria
Bacillus subtillus, Bacillus licheniformis, Bacillus azotoformans, Bacillus megaterium, Bacillus coagulans, Bacillus pumlis, Bacillus thuringiensis, Bacillus stearothermiphilis, Paenibacillus polymyxa, Paenibacillus durum, Paenibacillus florescence, Paenibacillus gordonae, Azotobacter polymyxa, Azotobacter chroococcum, Sacchromyces cervisiae, Streptomyces griseues, Streptomyces lydicus, Pseudomonas aureofaceans, Deinococcus erythromyxa
johnnyblaze313
Active Member
n/m I found the answer
deman81
Member
Hi Heisenberg
I just have one quick question after reading your recipe. You mention NOT to use AN products as the bacteria and fungi bases but all I have on hand right now are Tarantula and Piranha by AN. Will these work to brew a tea or should I find replacement products
Regards
I just have one quick question after reading your recipe. You mention NOT to use AN products as the bacteria and fungi bases but all I have on hand right now are Tarantula and Piranha by AN. Will these work to brew a tea or should I find replacement products
Regards
Heisenberg
Well-Known Member
If you use the mycogrow by itself with young plants you will get almost no results because there is nothing to wake up the bennies or give them a home. If you use it by itself on older plants with a large root base you will get moderate results IF you are sure to inoculate the roots as opposed to simply dumping the product in the res and letting it settle. Older roots will produce exudes and provide housing which will wake up some of the microbes. This would be fine for someone who is not fighting slime. To combat slime, or to be sure all of the microbes are active, brew the product in a tea first.
I have never heard of anyone having trouble with these products when brewed first. The problems come when the products are used directly in the res. They will often worsen or even trigger a slime outbreak. The formulas probably have some sort of 'food' included which ends up feeding the slime. Brewing should take care of it.
If you use the mycogrow by itself with young plants you will get almost no results because there is nothing to wake up the bennies or give them a home. If you use it by itself on older plants with a large root base you will get moderate results IF you are sure to inoculate the roots as opposed to simply dumping the product in the res and letting it settle. Older roots will produce exudes and provide housing which will wake up some of the microbes. This would be fine for someone who is not fighting slime. To combat slime, or to be sure all of the microbes are active, brew the product in a tea first.
Heinsberg is this true in soil also?
Heinsberg is this true in soil also?
Heisenberg
Well-Known Member
Looks like it would do a fine job however it I don't see anything to indicate that it does a better job than bubbling with airstones.
Heisenberg
Well-Known Member
Soil should have plenty of organic compounds that will wake up the microbes, although brewing a tea first is still the best way to get a diverse and immediately active population.
Heisenberg
Well-Known Member
Molasses starts the process. Microbes 'wake up' in the presents of food or in some cases housing. (mycos wont germinate until they contact root material) Molasses wakes up many microbes, and then these microbes trigger others to awaken.
How often you change your res wont matter to the microbes because we constantly replace them. When you change your res will have more to do with your nute schedule and your strains. I change my water every two weeks for most strains. The exception is the two TGA strains I have, 3D and Ace, which grow so fast that they need to be changed every 7-10 days or else they start to show deficiency. Ace is currently the best strain that has ever entered my garden.
A PPM meter and record keeping will tell you a lot about how much your strain is eating and when to change the res.
Heisenberg your tea is amazing , I must of tried everything that's possible to try and beat root rot and your method is the only one that worked , I want to thank you a million. Now I'm in week 2 of flowering and my leaves are showing some signs of root rot I believe cause I've been through this on 3 different occasions. I'm using h&g a&b roots excel ,multi zen and drip clean. Not sure if multi zen is the problem or roots excel , cause I just read that you would only use root excel in your brew and not straight into your system. I checked the roots ,I do see brown roots and it's root rot for sure . I have lots of healthy roots, way mOre than the roots that are rotted. Is the multi zen causing this? Roots Excel? I read that you said to steer away from using enzymes. When I google what products of h&g have enzymes it seems like every single one of there product has them in em. Please get back to me I'm stuck trying to figure out what it is
Thanks
P.s I'm using under current system
I will also start using bud xl , algean extract and shooting powder very soon. I just want to know what not to use that affects the tea .
Thanks
P.s I'm using under current system
I will also start using bud xl , algean extract and shooting powder very soon. I just want to know what not to use that affects the tea .
tallen
Well-Known Member
After getting Slimmed a while back I started using this tea in my rdwc. Worked great at first, but I didn't keep up the maintenance doses like I should, only once a week at best. Then ph started dropping and roots browning (no slime). So I brewed some tea and was sure to dose every 3 days this time, but it didn't beat the rot-just slowed it down. If my ph stabilized it would be for a day at best, and never a sign of white roots. Read about pondzyme and aquasheild and tried that. Same results. Been battling this for over a month now.
Read a couple threads about using bleach in your rez and even tried that a couple days ago(1/2 ml. per gal). Seems to be working somewhat in one of my flowering systems (the other ones empty waiting for me to cure my girls in veg). In my veg system the girls wilted for a day and gave me a scare (but the ph stabilized that day). Second day with bleach in the system checked on them and they looked happy, until I looked in on the roots. SLIME
So I drained the system, washed the girls off and gave them plain water with pondzyme and aquashield, oh and ZHO. Then started a batch of tea. My recipe is the mycogrow soluble and ancient forest and add zho to the rez with the tea.
Temps are a steady 68-69 and I have no light leaks that I can find (even place poly over the hydroton) I'm at my wits end in beating my root problems. I'm adding 20-30 ml a day of ph up just to keep it in range and it's becoming "not fun" anymore. I'm close to giving up and going to soil.
What am I doing wrong? I have everything else pretty close to dialed in, but my root problems won't go away no matter what I've tried. H2O2, tea, pondzyme, aquashield, bleach- it all slows it down but nothing seems to defeat it! Remember, I'm talking about non-slime rot here, the tea defeated the slime when I had it before. I'm open to suggestion (which is pretty obvious since I even tried bleach!!). Please help!! I love my rdwc and don't want to give it up!
Read a couple threads about using bleach in your rez and even tried that a couple days ago(1/2 ml. per gal). Seems to be working somewhat in one of my flowering systems (the other ones empty waiting for me to cure my girls in veg). In my veg system the girls wilted for a day and gave me a scare (but the ph stabilized that day). Second day with bleach in the system checked on them and they looked happy, until I looked in on the roots. SLIME
So I drained the system, washed the girls off and gave them plain water with pondzyme and aquashield, oh and ZHO. Then started a batch of tea. My recipe is the mycogrow soluble and ancient forest and add zho to the rez with the tea.Temps are a steady 68-69 and I have no light leaks that I can find (even place poly over the hydroton) I'm at my wits end in beating my root problems. I'm adding 20-30 ml a day of ph up just to keep it in range and it's becoming "not fun" anymore. I'm close to giving up and going to soil.
What am I doing wrong? I have everything else pretty close to dialed in, but my root problems won't go away no matter what I've tried. H2O2, tea, pondzyme, aquashield, bleach- it all slows it down but nothing seems to defeat it! Remember, I'm talking about non-slime rot here, the tea defeated the slime when I had it before. I'm open to suggestion (which is pretty obvious since I even tried bleach!!). Please help!! I love my rdwc and don't want to give it up!
Just one more noob question for the moment, I promise (Edit: Okay, two). I recently started adding fulvic acid to the reservoirs, and the plants seemed to like it a lot. I am concerned however, that it may be pathogen food in the res. Should I maybe break it down in the tea first? My current situation would indicate that it's not a problem. One of my 6-bucket rdwc's took a shit today, and emptied the res. out on the floor, via one of the buckets. I picked up the plant/ lid and found an absolute 5 gallon bucket mold of snow white roots. Seems the biggest problem with winning the war on root rot in rdwc is how to keep the bucket drain clear of roots! Any suggestions on that one would be equally appreciated!
Finally, I want to say thank you again, for the thousandth time Mr.Heisenberg. You surely haven't heard it every time, because it's usually uttered under my breath, as I watch my grow improve. It's taken around 6 weeks to get to this point, but adherence to the tea program has definitely been the key to the winning hand. I know I('m not totally out of the woods yet, nor will I ever be, but I'm definitely back on the crest of the wave, with about 85% of the credit going to the tea, and your "preaching" it.
I believe DWC to be one of the most productive models for hydroponics, but it simply won't work without a viable plan to beat the pathogens. Heisenberg, I see that you have put countless hours into personal research, trials, posting, answering, etc. , and it doesn't go unappreciated my friend. I put everything I had into this system, and it would have been nothing but a waste if I hadn't found this thread. You have absolutely saved my world. Thank you x1001.
Grow well,
B.B.
Finally, I want to say thank you again, for the thousandth time Mr.Heisenberg. You surely haven't heard it every time, because it's usually uttered under my breath, as I watch my grow improve. It's taken around 6 weeks to get to this point, but adherence to the tea program has definitely been the key to the winning hand. I know I('m not totally out of the woods yet, nor will I ever be, but I'm definitely back on the crest of the wave, with about 85% of the credit going to the tea, and your "preaching" it.
I believe DWC to be one of the most productive models for hydroponics, but it simply won't work without a viable plan to beat the pathogens. Heisenberg, I see that you have put countless hours into personal research, trials, posting, answering, etc. , and it doesn't go unappreciated my friend. I put everything I had into this system, and it would have been nothing but a waste if I hadn't found this thread. You have absolutely saved my world. Thank you x1001.
Grow well,
B.B.
Heisenberg
Well-Known Member
Your problem probably comes from the roots excel. As long as you see healthy new root growth, things are on track. Use the roots excel in the tea and you'll be fine. It does give the tea a nice boost. One of the best ways to fight root rot is to increase dissolved oxygen. I would suggest striping things back to the very basics and then reintroducing additives one at a time to see which give you problems. Same advice applies with adding new products. I have not heard of the ones you mentioned causing problems, but anything with organic food, vitamins or hormones is likely to aggravate slime. A system stabilized with bennies will tolerate some use of these products.
As long as you have microbes, you will have enzymes. The problem comes when we try to use enzymes without beneficial microbes. The enzymes break down material and with no bennies to feed off it, the slime or other pathogens thrive. In DWC, it's best to let the microbes produce their own enzymes and not add any ourselves. Don't worry too much about products which contain enzymes, just don't use a super enzyme like hygrozyme.