Who is still glad we didn't end up with McCain?
- Thread starter olosto
- Start date
TheBrutalTruth
Well-Known Member
Not likely, there are no choices for those that are on Medicare in the region where Palmetto is the contractor. If they have Medicare in those regions they go through Palmetto, no options...
Stalin was only speaking half of the truth. Fascism is Capitalism in decline towards Socialism.
CrackerJax
New Member
Govt. health care would not PLUMMET in pricing. Just the opposite. One merely needs to look at medicare and medicaid to see the outrageous cost overruns.
Look ppl, the govt. can't run anything with fiscal responsibility. Nothing the govt. does ever ends up in the black, and certainly not any GIGANTIC programs which is what's coming.
The govt. carries no risk aversion nor any heed to a bottom line as in the private sector. We are going broke as a nation and Argentina is just up ahead. There is no need to hit the accelerator and get there quicker.
Look ppl, the govt. can't run anything with fiscal responsibility. Nothing the govt. does ever ends up in the black, and certainly not any GIGANTIC programs which is what's coming.
The govt. carries no risk aversion nor any heed to a bottom line as in the private sector. We are going broke as a nation and Argentina is just up ahead. There is no need to hit the accelerator and get there quicker.
Rob Roy
Well-Known Member
One could also argue as a member of a FREE society you are obligated to leave others the fuck alone...
In a free society the one who makes and is responsible for keeping your obligations is you, the individual.
When another person or group of people obligates you against your will, what are you then?
Do you like somebody making your decisions for you at the point of a gun?
If I refuse to participate in this wonderful "free health care" will society
punish me, rob me anyway?
what... huh?
Active Member
And I humbly submit the V.A. If it is good enough for our soldiers, it is good enough for me.
The USPS is in the black.
Courts turn a profit too.
Licensing depts make money (passports, business licenses... etc).
Being 90% disable i use the VA all the time. Its great, no not like a normal Hospital. If the doctor thinks you need an xray..u go to the xray dept sign in (first come first served) then if the doctor think you need blood work, (same day) you go to the lab sign in get it done. then back to the doctor.. Its awsome...Do I advocate free health for everyone...it might not be for everyone. people seem to be afraid of the VA, the press is to blame for that. Its good health care. But if I had something real serious I would go and get a second opinon..Outside the VA
CrackerJax
New Member
The VA does NOT run a profit altho I agree it does good works. It is also a minute sampling of the general population.
As for the UPSP, great, but you are not counting the BILLIONS already lost. Nice job on getting their yearly house in order, but that is not even comparable to the horrendous losses we will incur with a national health care system.
I know I am swinging at windmills here, so we will all find out together just how right I am, much to everyone's dismay....
P.S. we are already out of money now.
As for the UPSP, great, but you are not counting the BILLIONS already lost. Nice job on getting their yearly house in order, but that is not even comparable to the horrendous losses we will incur with a national health care system.
I know I am swinging at windmills here, so we will all find out together just how right I am, much to everyone's dismay....
P.S. we are already out of money now.
TheBrutalTruth
Well-Known Member
1. The VA
The care we provide for our veterans should be better than that which we provide for regular bums like you, politicians and other citizens.
MOOT POINT
2. USPS -
2008 - Operating Income -2.8 Billion (2008 Annual Report)
2007 - Operating Income -5.3 Billion (2007 Annual Report)
2006 - Operating Income 966 Million (2006 Annual Report)
2005 - Operating Income 1.6 Billion (2005 Annual Report)
2004 - Operating Income 3.1 Billion (2004 Annual Report)
2003 - Operating Income 4.6 Billion (2003 Annual Report)
2002 - Operating Income -676 Million (2002 Annual Report)
2001 - Operating Income -1.6 Billion (2002 Annual Report)
2000 - Operating Income -199 Million (2002 Annual Report)
So, while it might have capital reserves, it is most definitely not operating in the black. Furthermore the USPS is an abusive monopoly protected by the state that has a history of abusing its monopoly position in ways that would lead it to be hauled up in Anti-trust courts if it was in fact a private corporation.
Total Net Income 2000 - 2008 - -309 Million (Loss of 309 Million)
FALSE POINT
3. Courts - Abusive Monopolies just like the USPS, so whether or not they are making a profit is a moot point, but for the sake of refuting it, seeings as how they are an organ of the state and not independent entities if the state they are in, or the community they are in, is operating in the red then they are in the red too, as their income is not preserved just for their own benefit.
That, and seeings as how you don't have any references to any annual reports provided by a court system, I'm also going to say that you are full of it on this point, too. Unless you want to cough up some references.
IRRELEVANT/POSSIBLY FALSE POINT
CrackerJax
New Member
The PUBLIC sector will NEVER outperform the PRIVATE (under capitalism).
It is the govt. INTERFERENCE in capitalism which is the real problem...not capitalism itself.
It is the govt. INTERFERENCE in capitalism which is the real problem...not capitalism itself.
medicineman
New Member
God I hope so. People as selfish as you appear to be, need to be robbed periodically just to bring you back to reality. Geeze, you are so dramatic. Single payer health care would leave you with private care if you so choose, who knows, it may even let you opt out of paying the extra tax. If it works anything like VA health care, you would be assigned a primary care doctor, generally you have a choice of 5-6 different ones. Then, after consultation with your primary care Dr, you would be assigned a specialist to assist you in your problems. VA uses local doctors for specialist care, I believe you can choose which one you want to see as long as they are participants in the VA program.
what... huh?
Active Member
I agree it should be better for vets. No argument... Well except the bum part. I run a small business employing 6 people. I'm doing my part.
Ill get back to the usps.
I am on the city council here... And I could easily demonstrate that WE make money on courts... And is the basis of my presumption... But I will get back to you with national numbers.
Lastly... Why are so many people here dicks if they disagree with you? Are we all not of the same mind on the ONE issue which draws us here? You guys suck at being hippies.
After I feel the mods up a little more I will put my game face on... But really I have been doing battle on bbs's since before the mouse was invented. I am bored with baseless grenade lobbing... Even if it is entertaining to read.
Lastly, no. Public will never outperform private, but it can do more good. I am also not for a public only system.
Ill get back to the usps.
I am on the city council here... And I could easily demonstrate that WE make money on courts... And is the basis of my presumption... But I will get back to you with national numbers.
Lastly... Why are so many people here dicks if they disagree with you? Are we all not of the same mind on the ONE issue which draws us here? You guys suck at being hippies.
After I feel the mods up a little more I will put my game face on... But really I have been doing battle on bbs's since before the mouse was invented. I am bored with baseless grenade lobbing... Even if it is entertaining to read.
Lastly, no. Public will never outperform private, but it can do more good. I am also not for a public only system.
CrackerJax
New Member
heheh, okay, a couple of points....
I don't see the correlation between the courts "bottom lines" and health care.... Medicare and Medicaid are far better indicators of the future disaster which is looming. Apples to apples my friend.
As for "hippies" being all sweet and peaches, nonsense. they are like anyone else except perhaps in their bathing habits. They are nice to ppl who agree with THEM. One need only look to the embarrassing 60's to see that. This is still true today. Again, just like everyone else....there is no "golden" population.
I also don't agree with the premise that the govt. can do more good. I am quite sure that if Medicaid were private, costs would be much much cheaper than they are today. When private business has massive losses, they go belly up. the govt. does not, it simply squeezes more juice from its citizens....this does not bring about fiscal responsibility.....never has, never will.
The govt. need only GET OUT OF THE WAY and go back to providing us with homeland security and keeping the roads in good shape....we will do the rest.
TheBrutalTruth
Well-Known Member
1. Your claims to running your own business, what's stopping you from doing good on your own. Change begins within, unless you are a mindless drone. Are you a mindless drone?
2. Back to the USPS? What do you mean, back? The fact is that they lost over 300 Million from 2000 - 2008 and are set to resume their trend towards bankruptcy at an even faster rate despite rate hikes as more and more companies start advertising online.
Flawed Model and a lack of requirements for them to move beyond their monopolisitic business model. A private company that saw email (instead of fighting it) would likely have tried to become the internet provider of the internet providers to ensure that they were drawing revenue from e-mail which was destroying their snail mail revenues.
Snail Mail, the only product from the Snails at USPS...
3. You have an opinion, that doesn't actually prove anything. As the courts are a part of the whole they are failing also. Besides, they draw their revenue from coercion and enforcement of laws that violate individual rights, esp. drug laws, anti-smoking laws, and other onerous requirements supported by whiny people that are incapable of seeing that there are other solutions besides stripping another group of their rights.
4. Who said I was a hippy, or even wanted to be associated with hippies?
5. Don't see what the mods have to do with this discussion, as I haven't seen either one of us attacking each other at an individual level, but if you are going to resort to ad hominim attacks save your efforts.
6. See #1 - Change beings with in. If you want to do good, perhaps the best way to do good is to be a good employer that takes decent care of their worker's instead of being the typical hypocritical leftist who believes that it is the "state's" responsibility to solve all the problems caused by their greed.
Don't need the state if people are willing to draw a line between being honorable and successful and being dishonorable and using others as stepping stones...
And seeings as how the money that the state "does good" with is stolen then the "good" that the state is doing is not in fact "good" but is evil, and morally bankrupt. Just because a group of thieves gives a portion of what they steal away does not mean they are not thieves.
Stealing is immoral whether committed by one person, a group of people, or by a few people acting on the behalf of the many.
YEah that how the VA does it...Thanks for puttin it in the words I couldn't find'em
CrackerJax
New Member
except that his opinion is not based in reality. In the beginning the cost will be quite low. This will drain the private sector of its pool (driving costs there UP, further eroding the pool). By the time the Govt. costs start to skyrocket and RATIONING begins, there won't be a private sector to run too, except if you are quite wealthy.
what... huh?
Active Member
LOL... I didn't realize I wasn't doing well. I have health insurance... and am doing just fine. I am discussing the subject of UHC.
God forbid I check your sourceless research.
I don't remember suggesting I proved anything there senorita strawman.
You smell like a libertarian. I can smell the chaos on you. Courts don't strip your rights they protect them.
I didn't say you were a hippie. I said you were a dick.
You introduced yourself to me calling me a bum... presuming I am a failure because I am willing to consider UHC.
I am not a leftist as luck would have it. I believe that basic healthcare should be provided. I would gladly sacrifice welfare, the public school system, social security... Happily.
Not the USPS though.
Wtf are you talking about? If people are willing to not use each other for their own gain? You aren't a mindless drone are you? It is counter-intuitive to suggest that any people are capable of operating outside of self interest. It is a paradox really... Selfishness is in our blood. The only honor is in not allowing your self motivation to impeed the progress of others... unless need be.
You have no respect for the rule of law. You are DEFINITELY an anarchist... er I mean libertarian.
Your entire diatribe presumes that rule of law = theft. I daresay you have yet to make that case. The law exists to preserve basic tennants from being offended. Let me put it a way you can wrap your head around.
It is the place of government to protect me from you, not from me.
what... huh?
Active Member
It was meant to be funny... nothing more.
CrackerJax
New Member
No worries, nothing in these forums phases me. I leave my power posts for other forums....this is recreation. 
what... huh?
Active Member
I have a very deep emotional commitment to this board, and all of you. My self esteem is entirely wrapped up in what box people think of me unfortunately.No worries, nothing in these forums phases me. I leave my power posts for other forums....this is recreation.
I wept openly for nearly an hour at my rejection from other tender souls.
CrackerJax
New Member
3 out of 5 posters will think you are serious..... 