Understanding and Calculating Nutrient PPM

Mrgippy said:

For the ideal ratios. Is that for throughout the whole cycle or for veg? I've seen people say go 0-3-2 for late flower. So if I'm using GH Flora series should I not use micro/gro since it has nitrogen? What do you do for late flower?

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Renfro said:

I don't really use their mix, just make what my plants want. I've used a LOT of mixes over the years, you can do pretty much anything with the trio.

Right now I am playing with the Chem-Gro 4-20-39 stuff, it's locally made and cheap as fuck. Figured I would take a stab at it and see how it performs.

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Renfro said:

so about 840 ml RO h2o and 60 grams 4-20-39 on the stir plate. Initially looks ok but after a few minutes its all milky looking. letting it settle out now.

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PJ Diaz said:

I've seen their site before and wondered about them. Are you mixing with CalNit and Epsom salts like Jacks 3-2-1?

I'm using Jacks 3-2-1 now, and am mixing concentrates of Jacks in almost that exact same ratio, except that I also add 20g of Epsom along with the 60g of Jacks to the quart of water. I just shake it up a few times, and let it sit for an half-hour or so, then come back and shake it again. Good to go. I do a separate concentrate of 40g of CalNit, so there's a part A of Jacks+Epsom and part B of CalNit. No particulates.

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PJ Diaz said:

I've seen their site before and wondered about them. Are you mixing with CalNit and Epsom salts like Jacks 3-2-1?

I'm using Jacks 3-2-1 now, and am mixing concentrates of Jacks in almost that exact same ratio, except that I also add 20g of Epsom along with the 60g of Jacks to the quart of water. I just shake it up a few times, and let it sit for an half-hour or so, then come back and shake it again. Good to go. I do a separate concentrate of 40g of CalNit, so there's a part A of Jacks+Epsom and part B of CalNit. No particulates.

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twentyeight.threefive said:

I've moved over to Jack's, plant leaves in veg at green, healthy, and silky. How do you mix the concentrated together to hit your target EC?

For now I mix Part A, Epsom salts, and then Part B all in 5 gallon buckets. Eventually will move to large res and automated system.

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twentyeight.threefive said:

I've moved over to Jack's, plant leaves in veg at green, healthy, and silky. How do you mix the concentrated together to hit your target EC?

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PJ Diaz said:

I take my 80x concentrations of part a and part b, and mix them together (plus 50ppm Si added to the RO water first) to make a single concentration which is around 2x higher than my target ec. Then I take that and mix proportionately with RO water (with 25 ppm of Si) into the res to hit my target EC.

It might sound like a lot of mix downs, but it's better than having to weigh out dry salts all the time, and waiting for them to dissolve.

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fancythat said:

Am I crazy thinking that GH Liquid Koolbloom contains magnesium and sulfur? Ingredients on the Label: Magnesium phosphate, potassium phosphate and potassium sulphate. The nutrient calculator doesn't show that, neither does the Label. The label just says 0-10-10

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fancythat said:

Am I crazy thinking that GH Liquid Koolbloom contains magnesium and sulfur? Ingredients on the Label: Magnesium phosphate, potassium phosphate and potassium sulphate. The nutrient calculator doesn't show that, neither does the Label. The label just says 0-10-10

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ttystikk said:

And this is why I fucking hate water bottle nutes; they don't have to tell you fuck all about what's in them besides the N-P-K number.

You will always be guessing until you go with dry nutrient salts.

Hydro-Gardens | Serving the Greenhouse industry since 1968

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Talk to these folks; they're in Colorado and supply lots of dispensaries.

Ask about their 4-20-39 formula or just scroll down the page to their links about it.

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Cabrone said:

You can trust what @ttystikk has to say. I have no experience with the 420 formula he mentioned but, speaking of dry salts, jacks 321 has produced some awesome bud over the years. You might want check it out, if you haven't looked into salts. Way cheaper than bottles.

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2com said:

That's something I'd meant to add for a "want" for it as well, the types; NO4, NH3, and NH2.

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RegularShark said:

Long-time lurker, first-time poster here. What an awesome thread! I was basically trying to put together something like this myself in excel, and it wasn't looking NEARLY as elegant or thorough. LOL

An incredible debt of thanks to Renfro for putting this together, you rock!!



That was the only thing I could think of that was missing from this: a breakdown of nitrogen by type. As I understand it, one wants to keep the NH4+ (ammonia) to no more than about 10% of total nitrogen(?). Most guaranteed analyses at least differentiate between nitrate, ammonia, and urea nitrogen. (I know that urea isn't generally used in hydro, though I note that there is some in the GH FloraMicro Hardwater. Why the heck is that?)

After playing around with the nutrient calculator a while, I figured out that it would not be too hard to separate the N into those 3 values by inserting a couple of extra columns or rows in the appropriate spots. I did so, and went through and split up the nitrogen values appropriately for all the listed nutrients for which I could find the information. I also added a couple of spots on the 'Results' tabs to compare the nitrate to ammonia as a ratio as well as ammonia as a % value of total N.

I'm fairly sure I got everything squared away where that it will calculate everything correctly, but anyone please let me know if you catch any mistakes.

Thanks again to Renfro! This is awesome and you literally saved me quite a lot of hours of work. I toke a bowl in your honor!

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RegularShark said:

Long-time lurker, first-time poster here. What an awesome thread! I was basically trying to put together something like this myself in excel, and it wasn't looking NEARLY as elegant or thorough. LOL

An incredible debt of thanks to Renfro for putting this together, you rock!!



That was the only thing I could think of that was missing from this: a breakdown of nitrogen by type. As I understand it, one wants to keep the NH4+ (ammonia) to no more than about 10% of total nitrogen(?). Most guaranteed analyses at least differentiate between nitrate, ammonia, and urea nitrogen. (I know that urea isn't generally used in hydro, though I note that there is some in the GH FloraMicro Hardwater. Why the heck is that?)

After playing around with the nutrient calculator a while, I figured out that it would not be too hard to separate the N into those 3 values by inserting a couple of extra columns or rows in the appropriate spots. I did so, and went through and split up the nitrogen values appropriately for all the listed nutrients for which I could find the information. I also added a couple of spots on the 'Results' tabs to compare the nitrate to ammonia as a ratio as well as ammonia as a % value of total N.

I'm fairly sure I got everything squared away where that it will calculate everything correctly, but anyone please let me know if you catch any mistakes.

Thanks again to Renfro! This is awesome and you literally saved me quite a lot of hours of work. I toke a bowl in your honor!

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2com said:

It's awesome that someone with the know-how actually came and added that ability, thanks dude. I'll check it out later.

I've made a couple *very* minor changes (because I'm not well versed with excel), just added a few products, and added some other element "ratios" under the ones that were already listed.

Unfortunately, Renfro isn't here anymore.

You're right about the ammonia, and urea, from what I know about. I duno the percentages though.

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Hollatchaboy said:

We need to get Renfro back! His knowledge is always invaluable.

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2com said:

Once you're away from this place for a while, you don't wanna come back.

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