The Pro Miracle Gro Group

PJ Diaz said:

I just assumed that the general convo was supporting this, which is less expensive than Jacks. So if it's just about $$, I ask again, why aren't the pros using it?:

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You’d have to ask some. But I’m guessing the bad rap has a lot to do with it. If there’s pros running the stuff they’re not talking about it much. You have to have a thread here touting it and still get the nonbelievers. Peters has years of rep from professional horticulturists and nursery owners. Going back to the late 40’s. MG has always been aimed at the home gardeners.

I partnered with some fine folks in the Detroit area during the 2012-2016's in a large scale building grow and we used GH mostly because at the time it was the cheapest for a three part system. One of guys decided to try some Heavy 16 full line of products vs the GH three part which the cost was through the roof and a side by side comparison showed no difference. Im sure 90% or higher get the majority of the base in quantity from good ole China and label it whatever anyway. The funny thing about this argument of plant nutrients and safety is 100% of the food we eat (Unless you eat only your own farm food) is poison anyway. So why would it matter what nutrient you use to grow anything?

CashCrops said:

I partnered with some fine folks in the Detroit area during the 2012-2016's in a large scale building grow and we used GH mostly because at the time it was the cheapest for a three part system. One of guys decided to try some Heavy 16 full line of products vs the GH three part which the cost was through the roof and a side by side comparison showed no difference. Im sure 90% or higher get the majority of the base in quantity from good ole China and label it whatever anyway. The funny thing about this argument of plant nutrients and safety is 100% of the food we eat (Unless you eat only your own farm food) is poison anyway. So why would it matter what nutrient you use to grow anything?

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I’ll bet there’s people here who were conceived when their parents were partying and smoking bud we grew using MG turquoise. I’ve carried tons of mix to guerilla sites. Works great for veg. Add something dahlias flower with and we had weed. In the 60’s there wasn’t a lot of choices.

hotrodharley said:

You’d have to ask some. But I’m guessing the bad rap has a lot to do with it.

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I doubt it. Most old school growers used it before there were canna specific lines. It's not like it hasn't grown tons of weed in the past.

Here's the nutes it was in it. Hmm, are we missing anything here?

PJ Diaz said:

I doubt it. Most old school growers used it before there were canna specific lines. It's not like it hasn't grown tons of weed in the past.

Here's the nutes it was in it. Hmm, are we missing anything here?

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Too much nitrogen is the issue when in flower. From my own experiences.

Cal sulfur Mag

hotrodharley said:

Too much nitrogen is the issue when in flower. From my own experiences.

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For sure, although some people love the 3-1-2 ratio all the way through flower, such as DynaGro Foilage Pro users.

@inth3shadowz

buckaclark said:

Cal sulfur Mag

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PJ Diaz said:

For sure, although some people love the 3-1-2 ratio all the way through flower, such as DynaGro Foilage Pro users.

@inth3shadowz

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Back when we didn’t have professional cannabis growers. In Texas it was a felony to possess a roach. I was taught how to top and supercrop by this old freak. After that nobody had any other pro tips. And the supercrop was just to break up the perfect round shape when viewed from the air. Nobody mentioned any other reason. That became apparent when you actually did it.

PJ Diaz said:

I doubt it. Most old school growers used it before there were canna specific lines. It's not like it hasn't grown tons of weed in the past.

Here's the nutes it was in it. Hmm, are we missing anything here?

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Calcium and magnesium which is present in most tap water. Ammonium sulfate is typically 24% sulfur so that isn't lacking. The copper sulfate is close to 60% sulfur.

I wouldn't use that blue stuff although I have in the past for vegetables and they flourished. I do think that there is a stigma attached to anything Miracle Gro by many. Some of it is deserved. But their Performance Organics products are solid. If you were to market them under a different name so nobody knew it was Miracle Gro anyone that actually reads the labels would see the ingredients and not have a problem using it. It even has the OMRI certification.

There is the tie in to Monsanto due to Scotts being the sole distributor for Roundup. I would never use Roundup and I understand why some will never by Miracle Gro products because of that. However, that's a personal choice that has nothing to do with the quality of the product.

Here's a tip.
Stop shopping based on a name and internet hype from "influencers" and shop based on the ingredients to value ratio.

Your plants don't care if it's a company named Jack's or Scott's nor do they care about the artwork.

There has been quite a few side by sides using several companies vs MG 24-8-16 blue salts plant food and everytime the results are the same.... No Difference.

It's just a bro logic regurgitating bro logic and there's nothing wrong with having an opinion to not like something, but to say it's garbage just because your opinionated is not factual or correct.

Guess what im using?
3 weeks from flip

PJ Diaz said:

For sure, although some people love the 3-1-2 ratio all the way through flower, such as DynaGro Foilage Pro users.

@inth3shadowz

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My thought process is this after reading numerous articles...basically I think the reason 3 1 2 ratio is so successful is the low P value. Apparently a bunch of growers were noticing with bloom nutes such as Maxibloom etc 5-15-14 that a high value P resulted in a build up by mid flower. As for the low mag and cal in the foliage pro, in that video I linked you awhile back, some nerd found out that plants only use a tiny amount of micronutrients compared to the rest, so there was no need for them to overload it with cal and mag.

inth3shadowz said:

My thought process is this after reading numerous articles...basically I think the reason 3 1 2 ratio is so successful is the low P value. Apparently a bunch of growers were noticing with bloom nutes such as Maxibloom etc 5-15-14 that a high value P resulted in a build up by mid flower. As for the low mag and cal in the foliage pro, in that video I linked you awhile back, some nerd found out that plants only use a tiny amount of micronutrients compared to the rest, so there was no need for them to overload it with cal and mag.

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I agree on the high P value thing. Other nerds have found that cannabis needs more Cal and Mag than FP has though, and extra Sulfur will increase flavor and aroma.

xtsho said:

Calcium and magnesium which is present in most tap water. Ammonium sulfate is typically 24% sulfur so that isn't lacking. The copper sulfate is close to 60% sulfur.

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It's too bad that they don't list all the nutrient percentages, and you are indeed correct about sulfur. I still feel it's quite lacking in Calcium, even using tap water, especially considering that you never really know what is in tap water unless you have it analyzed.

PJ Diaz said:

I've never questioned your ability to grow plants well, however my initial question persists.

I think it's a fair question too. If MG is on par with other nutes, and is cheaper than something like Jacks, why aren't the pros using it? By "pros", I mean people who are growing cannabis as a profession.

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Mg is actually way more expensive than running jacks....which is why i dont understand people still using it....i think they just like the convienience of walmart and lowes nutrients...

PJ Diaz said:

I doubt it. Most old school growers used it before there were canna specific lines. It's not like it hasn't grown tons of weed in the past.

Here's the nutes it was in it. Hmm, are we missing anything here?

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Lmfao!

stnr420 said:

Mg is actually way more expensive than running jacks....which is why i dont understand people still using it....i think they just like the convienience of walmart and lowes nutrients...

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Please show me your numbers on that, because MG appears to be less expensive to me.

PJ Diaz said:

Please show me your numbers on that, because MG appears to be less expensive to me.

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Go to jacks website and look at prices on 25# bag....look at mg price and weight....look at application rates...divide...etc etc...im not bustin out my calculator....

stnr420 said:

Go to jacks website and look at prices on 25# bag....look at mg price and weight....look at application rates...divide...etc etc...im not bustin out my calculator....

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I did that already. MG appears to be substantially less expensive. A 10-lb bag of MG from Home Depot is $21.50. A 25-lb bag of Jacks is over $95, plus you also have to buy CalNit and Epsom salts. You aren't busting out your calculator, because you are wrong.

PJ Diaz said:

I did that already. MG appears to be substantially less expensive. A 10-lb bag of MG from Home Depot is $21.50. A 25-lb bag of Jacks is over $95, plus you also have to buy CalNit and Epsom salts. You aren't busting out your calculator, because you are wrong.

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Right....sooo...you dont need any calcium or magnesium with mg???? Hmmm...good luck with that

stnr420 said:

Right....sooo...you dont need any calcium or magnesium with mg???? Hmmm...good luck with that

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See, that's kind of my point. People here are saying that MG alone is great, nothing else needed. That's why I'm asking, if it's so great, why aren't the pros using it since it's cheaper? So it seems that you agree with me that MG alone isn't all that great in reality. Thanks for clearing that up. Out of curiosity, what ratio of CalNit to MG do you suggest is needed in order to make it complete?