So you 'Juana Cut Corners, eh? Simple Comparison Grow in Progress...

I decided to grow from seed after I botched my last batch of clones, unfortunately that means using two random femmed seed from a buddy (seriously were extra femmed seeds in his purchase that said "free random feminized seed sample"), and two bag seeds. The two bag seeds came from the same bag of something purple that hermied (street bud). The very first plant I ever grew was from one of these bag seeds and I harvested a smoke that was to die for - no shitting gang, total newby luck - but I had to harvest early and always wanted to bring one to full fruition.

I hope to take clippings soon and throw them in the dark for an attempt at sexing. I will of course immediately relay the results! Hope you all have a safe, happy, and high New Year! Peace.

New update on last page of doggies thread mate let me know what u think bro...

Okay gang,

My holiday laziness took my plants through a pH swing that they definitely didn't care for (especially the little tyke). They repaid me with slight nutrient deficiencies (just a lighter green and softer leaf than I'd like at this age), and some leaf curl.

I have been victorious in the adjustment, as my roots today took on bold white growth (sorry no root porn at the moment - it's a bitch to lift a 10 inch netpot and one-hand a decent pic). The foliage isn't yet showing as much promise, but it usually lags a day or two while the new roots take hold - what am I telling you guys this for? Hell, I'm the newb.

Anyway, a few pics that I already know show some signs of poorer health. I'll compare them in a few days, and maybe get my girl to help me snag a root shot or two. Thanks for keeping up with me - I know it isn't twenty plants in a perfect rainforest, but I'm trying!

What are pictures 2/5?

how can you be 'cutting corners' and still use anything but GH Maxibloom?!

That's the ultimate in lazy mans hydro from what I've seen/read.

Looking great though! Now to read the entire thread (just read the first page b4 posting this).

Holy balls gang, sometimes I feel like a naked mole rat could grow herb better than I.

Here's the sitch': after my pH screw up, which didn't sit well with the roots, I used a different feeding chart from GH which listed the nutrient type and amounts in a different order than the one I have been using. I still went in the same order though - fuckin' hell, man, I just don't give myself a break.

So anyway, I flushed them (I use GH FloraKleen in proper amounts and gently pour through top of res several times - loosens and separates old salts). Then I made up all new reservoirs IN PROPER AMOUNTS AND ORDER and did a bit of root pruning (hope not too much; this can't be good for them, but I couldn't put that dark dead crap in their brand new reservoirs!).

Took a few pics (sorry no roots - wish I had a few more arms; leaves tell a story of stress/nutrient deficiencies brought about by my mistakes, but the stalks and stems are quite green and show signs of strength.




Thanks for the input, newcomer! I was actually hoping not to cut corners with this grow, but I realize that on either side of the fence (cutting or no) there will be plenty of folks who surpass my abilities and knowledge. I do feel that (as I myself am an uber newb, in case you couldn't tell), newbs are going to have an easier time not skimping on the nutes, but may have a hard time setting up proper grow room - the location, lights, fans, air and water pumps, the right containers and tubing...yada yada).

C.Indica - alas, my friend, I am growing unknown mutts. Two of the plants (one of which you requested identification (pic 2 in that post)) are random feminized seeds from a sample pack included with a friend's purchase. They are unidentified beyond "Sativa Dominant Hybrid." Picture 5 is of my little runt (started roughly 5 or 6 days after the other three). This plant and the other as of yet unmentioned fourth plant are bag seed from the same bag of hermied purple (Grandaddy perhaps, but I cannot say that with confidence). All plant genders at this time are unconfirmed, and the feminized seeds claim a 99% success rate (but I'm always aware that the grower can hermy a plant through stress - ugh...we'll see).

Happy New Year, everyone, and as always - thanks a ton for popping in on a fairly boring thread. Peace!

thread with plants that will produce dank is never boring mate..keep it up..

Having to restart must have sucked, did you try to revive them before deciding to start over? Im just starting my first grow and trying NOT to cut any corners, but even without cutting corners a noob will make mistakes on their first run. Impressive that you went as far as using DWC on your first grow, thats not a corner cut, I chose to use coco, I know it gets alot of hype but realistically there's no way the roots can get as much air as they do with a true hydro setup. I think that's the one corner I may have cut. Looks like this ones going to turn out really good, Im subbed

Hey thanks a ton for chiming in. I have to say that I've let the advice of too many experienced growers direct my actions thus far - NOT that the advice wasn't good, it was GREAT - but I wasn't ready yet. I hear you about starting out simpler - I wish I had. I've spent a good chunk of dough on this setup of mine and I've yielded shit.

I am confident this time though that I have put myself through some serious trials as a newb, and now I think I just might pull some goods off of these plants (well hopefully most of 'em - sexes pending and all).

To answer your question though, part of taking a serious growers advice (sorry, I tend to ramble) was that I figured I could get a better experience and better yield if I just restarted (and I really had a hard-on to grow from seed - for no logical reason, because I don't even know what these are). In retrospect, I had some VERY viable choices for great clones on those dying girls, and I wish I had taken them.

Alas, I love my plants now, and just for popping in, here are updates from this very evening:

Running at 1.6-1.8 EC at the moment (wowser - like 1120 ppm at 700x or something like that) - no nute burn though, and I'm finally getting the texture on these leaves that I'm looking for. They're starting to stink a little; might have to hook up the ol' filter. A few random pics of the setup in general thrown in for kicks. - Peace.

I have the philosophy that if Im going to spend hundreds of dollars on equipement, I might as well make sure its the best stuff I can get so I wont be looking upgrade later on. It saves you money in the long run, If you start off with 12 cfl's and stuff like that youll have no use for them when you finally buy yourself a HID. So I'm going pretty big right from the starts. I guess I just figured DWC was beyound my plumbing abilities, especially since I was in a hurry, I germinated my seeds 1 day after moving into my new apartment, I was excited! But the timing has been good and now things are moving along on schedule. Looks like your plants are loving that setup, any idea when flower begins? I gotta buy myself a carbon filter pretty damn soon, starting to notice a general aroma throughout the basement. Looks like you have that setup in a basement. Basement temperatures are awesome, Im having a hard time keeping it warm enough with 1000watts of light and 1000w of baseboard heat, plus the ballasts sitting on the floor in the room... kinda silly burning all that power but at least I know I can put more light in there with no trouble. Not sure about summer temps though but basements are pretty stable temperature wise, guess im ranting now. Whats 700x?

To tell the truth, those cfls aren't garbage, they just don't get the job all the way done with the same efficiency as the HIDs. I could definitely put my extra cfls to use in a clone tent, or even a mother cabinet. That said, I love my MH/HPS switchable digi and wouldn't flower under cfl again.

I use EC (electrical conductivity) as the measurement I track nutrient strength by. This number is thrown into an equation by companies that produce PPM meters. PPMs are most often the EC measurement multiplied by a rate of either 500x or 700x. I use a rather nice BluLab Truncheon which provides EC and PPM for both 500x and 700x - this allows me to communicate about nutrient strengths with folks who use varying measurents.

I've done all my math on equipment and power bills and nutes, etc...I'll be square if I can pull full harvests out of four plants (half a pound or a little more or less).

I highly recommend a very simple, non recirculating DWC next time around. Independant 5gal buckets with either six or ten inch net pots and hydroton. Air stones or fluming or both, and you're good to go. Leave central reservoirs alone until you're a root master - easier to isolate root problems. Peace.

Fykshun said:

To tell the truth, those cfls aren't garbage, they just don't get the job all the way done with the same efficiency as the HIDs. I could definitely put my extra cfls to use in a clone tent, or even a mother cabinet. That said, I love my MH/HPS switchable digi and wouldn't flower under cfl again.

I use EC (electrical conductivity) as the measurement I track nutrient strength by. This number is thrown into an equation by companies that produce PPM meters. PPMs are most often the EC measurement multiplied by a rate of either 500x or 700x. I use a rather nice BluLab Truncheon which provides EC and PPM for both 500x and 700x - this allows me to communicate about nutrient strengths with folks who use varying measurents.

I've done all my math on equipment and power bills and nutes, etc...I'll be square if I can pull full harvests out of four plants (half a pound or a little more or less).

I highly recommend a very simple, non recirculating DWC next time around. Independant 5gal buckets with either six or ten inch net pots and hydroton. Air stones or fluming or both, and you're good to go. Leave central reservoirs alone until you're a root master - easier to isolate root problems. Peace.

Click to expand...

I gave the cfls as an example but it was a bad example, I realized right after I typed it that you could easily plug those lights in around your house, but my point was I agree with your going right into DWC off the starts, instead of wasting time learning soil if your inclined to go hydro anyways. Hydro just makes sense when you have everything else dialed in and your giving the plants everything they want the final thing you can do to bump up harvest is let the roots breath, it become the limiting factor in growth when all other factors are met. So might as well get that done properly from the beginning. It does seem pretty simple to do a DWC, do you have to drill any holes into the bucket itself? How much work would it be to maintain 10 plants in 5 gal DWC's? independent reserves for 10 plants sounds like a lot of work, so maybe that is another plus for the coco. I think when I do a true hydro(I dont think of coco as a hydro even though technically it is), I will opt for something that will be able to handle a couple hours of power outage as that is bound to happen someday. Probably an ebb and flow or something similar. what do you do if the power goes out for a while?

Im going to have to look into this 700x or 500x thing. Does this mean everytime someone says a ppm number it doesnt mean anything unless they quote the 700x/500x or the EC as well? Is one measure more common than the others? This sounds like vital information that I havent seen anywhere until now!

it's not vital, and you needn't search far to get a better explanation than I can give. PPM is not meaningless, but yes, meter manufacturers use differing calculations in their digi products, 500 and 700 are just two standards - but it's nothing mystical, just some folks do the dirivitive math, and I don't. A pattern is a pattern, whether tracking EC numbers like 1.6 or PPM like 1120, you'll how your plants react to either number. I simply state it for clarification to readers so that I don't get a 500 PPM guy doing calculations with my 700 PPM measurement and going "uh...dude, your math is all messed up."

We also might be talking about different cfls - I used 3 that ran at 350watts and put out 17000 full spectrum lumens (my MH is 400 watts and puts out 35000 lumens) - these cfls can't fit household sockets. A friend of mine borrowed them and just harvested 70grams from a single sativa - used the lights all the way through.

I don't like holes in my buckets, but some do; meaning you don't need 'em - my girls are proof. I have four buckets and they are enough on independent res. For the number you've got planned, my system would be simply ridiculous. You should check out Sqydro and his fluming recirc (DWC with no air stones). He'll hook you up with some sick knowledge about recirc. - peace.

Oh, and as for power: lights out, air off - I'm hosed.

Peace.

Day 42 - just swapped the bulb, and flipped 'em to 12/12. Sexing time - wish me girls!

They look well vegged and ready, good things to come Im expecting. It must feel like a waste nursing the males this far and then scrapping them now when they show, I am in a similar situation, clone sexing isnt really an option so I will have to weed them out during flower.

You and I are thinking the same thing - gotta' find a way to sex earlier; any ideas so far? I mean, I have a spare cloning bucket, should I top them early in the grow next time, toss the tops in a cloning bucket, and put them in a dark closet until they show?

If topping is the way you want to grow your plants then you could have cloned the tops from when the plants were 5-6 nodes big. You have to let the clones root under a longer light schedule first I beleive and then flip to 12/12, I think the clones need to get at least some roots before you add another source of stress to them. Cuttings take a little while to resume growth again so showing sex wont happen instantly, but its a good option if you dont mind topping your plants. Unfortunately you will need to have 100% cloning success to be able to sex all of your plants but even if you only get 75% success at least you can sex most of them. I did this very thing but I forgot to label which clone came from which mother(wow eh? lol) so there goes that idea...

You could have taken a side branch off and cloned it, but you need to have enough time left in veg to make that worthwhile, if rooting takes 7 days and sexing takes another 14 then you wont know the sex of the plants before flower unless you still have another 21 days left in veg for your plants. For me using coco I need to transplant my vegging plants into a larger size pot already and I havent sexed them yet. Because I have to be in the full size pots before flower this is where it gets really wastefull. Either way the sooner you know the sex the sooner you can stop letting them use your medium/light/space/time.

My plants are a very stretchy strain so I cant veg for very long which makes the cloning/sexing option tricky, I think for me sexing the tops is the only way to do it but I already screwed that up. I am actually getting some preflowers now but nothing conclusive, Im thinking they probably wont really show their sex until I have them in flower but I'm keeping an eye on them anyways. I'm at week 5 now. Do you have preflowers?

Did you keep labelled clones in case of killer production phenos?

I hear you, pickle! And C.indica, I'm not set up for perpetual - one tent, one light, one cycle at a time. I mentioned cloning just as a possible sexing option, but that was just to go straight into a dark closet. Pickle set me straight on that though. But remember guys, I don't even know what kinda plants they are - could be schwag.

On a bright note; the switch went off without a hitch, the switchable ballast worked great and now the tent is filled with the beautiful orange glow of HPS. Peace.