RAIDED!! EVERYTHING CLOSED! STATE WIDE PUSH!

Dr. Who said:

I'll bet THAT is going to be ending soon too! Uncle Bill is watching!

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... lol... ya he is and he loves what he sees.. that club is so well set up and within the laws its not even funny. they have taken many many many measures to make sure they aren't in the cross hairs of anyone.

HGK420 said:

thats one of the reasons our economy has gotten whacked so bad in the middle.. the customer base is very thick in the 150-200 an ounce range and its forced a lot of people to sell more valuable weed for those prices to try to compete with some of the bigger growers, only people who haven't still hold the MUCH higher quality cuts. now a days its basically gotta be perfect to command more then 200 at the grower level and to get 200 you gotta be bringing the heat too.

problem is tho as the providing end of the equation we can't say "NO buy this stuff for more money its worth more trust" the customer is always right... so now a days we have customers that want cheap weed thats better then regs but not much more expensive then regs... thats a tough game to play but its not impossible, like you say there are some strains that yield A lot and aren't terrible quality so those are the ones you grow to compete in this market.

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Valuable weed can be sold for 150-200 and a lot of growers already do it. Only way I could see top shelf going for higher would of course be at a dispensary. That's because of the overhead, but as the industry learns and grows as a whole that will change. Customers don't want cheap, the people selling want cheap weed and the consumer is deceived. I have talked with budtenders and they have said majority of patients don't know what quality is. The product is dictated by the owner or manager while buying their stock. But you know what when there is a some ACTUAL flame, dank buds on the top shelf, it flies off the shelf!

kingzt said:

Valuable weed can be sold for 150-200 and a lot of growers already do it. Only way I could see top shelf going for higher would of course be at a dispensary. That's because of the overhead, but as the industry learns and grows as a whole that will change. Customers don't want cheap, the people selling want cheap weed and the consumer is deceived. I have talked with budtenders and they have said majority of patients don't know what quality is. The product is dictated by the owner or manager while buying their stock. But you know what when there is a some ACTUAL flame, dank buds on the top shelf, it flies off the shelf!

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i completely agree that most people don't know what they want. I've seen for myself as people get amazingly excited for some BULLSHIT just because of a name they heard once from a hippy 20 years ago or because its a decent price. sitting right next to this bullshit was all kinds of fire for almost the same price.. maybe a 20 dollar an ounce difference and about 1 in 4 buy the bullshit. i was floored.

beyond that I've seen people pick up the most gasoline skunk disgusting funk and say "MMMM FRUITY!" or "OOOO EARTHY!"" everyones taste buds work differently, theres actually tests you can take to find out which kind of a wine taster you are and whatnot. they've really done the science on flavor in the wine world and its widely excepted that theres several different kinds of pallets... so what i think smells awesome some one else might smell cardboard or something soooo.

and believe me i know valuable weed can be sold cheaper I've brought all my recommended donations down for my patients in recent months to keep the overage numbers low, I've had to revert to old tactics of free edibles with donations and all kinds of fun sales.. times are tight.. the fact people grow in dog kennels doesn't help either.. i heard tell of a dude who pulled over 100 big boys in his shitty little genesee county back yard.. dudes on maybe an acre.... tall wood fence and some dog cages AND BOOM there goes the market.... don't gotta pay the sun a dime lol

HGK420 said:

i completely agree that most people don't know what they want. I've seen for myself as people get amazingly excited for some BULLSHIT just because of a name they heard once from a hippy 20 years ago or because its a decent price. sitting right next to this bullshit was all kinds of fire for almost the same price.. maybe a 20 dollar an ounce difference and about 1 in 4 buy the bullshit. i was floored.

beyond that I've seen people pick up the most gasoline skunk disgusting funk and say "MMMM FRUITY!" or "OOOO EARTHY!"" everyones taste buds work differently, theres actually tests you can take to find out which kind of a wine taster you are and whatnot. they've really done the science on flavor in the wine world and its widely excepted that theres several different kinds of pallets... so what i think smells awesome some one else might smell cardboard or something soooo.

and believe me i know valuable weed can be sold cheaper I've brought all my recommended donations down for my patients in recent months to keep the overage numbers low, I've had to revert to old tactics of free edibles with donations and all kinds of fun sales.. times are tight.. the fact people grow in dog kennels doesn't help either.. i heard tell of a dude who pulled over 100 big boys in his shitty little genesee county back yard.. dudes on maybe an acre.... tall wood fence and some dog cages AND BOOM there goes the market.... don't gotta pay the sun a dime lol

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Yeah lots of people do it. Folks in the country or more rural areas of Michigan can't wait for warm weather to get plants in the ground. The thing is there is always a market for quality cannabis. People can grow outdoors and make good money because they rely on quantity. That doesn't mess the market up. Growers with same, high quality cannabis who start to under cut the next person is how the market gets messed up and that is why big business starting mass operations is kind of scary. Nonetheless good growers will always prevail, especially if you know how to market your product and your self. What can you do though, this is a capitalist country and I don't have a problem with capitalism.

HGK420 said:

so you paid $175 for your top shelf I'm assuming? makes sense you'd pay most for what you can earn most on... so you buy an ounce for $175 and get $520 back and you wanna act like a hero?

thats $345 per ounce in PROFIT. so your GROSSING TWICE AS MUCH AS THE GROWER~!~@!@!~@~!~!

ok lets pretend you only get $15 a gram for the stuff you pay $175 for THATS STILL $400 AN OUNCE!!@#!@#!

i bet belle tire gets its tires from kumho for like $30 a piece and is able to sell them for $300 a pop... thats how business works for sure....

NO its called supply and demand and because theres an over abundance of people who have a supply but are to afraid to go build a demand people like yourself are able to take the risk and MAKE MILLIONS $345 at a time.... you said it yourself... your pay $175 per ounce YOU MAKE $520 DOLLARS ON!!!!

basically if the laws weren't so shady and people were able to openly share the fact they have overages the economy would be totally different... the dispensary owners would be shit out of luck if they wanna lowball because if i can openly trade with other patients, a dispensary can go all throatzilla on my backside, end of story.

k sorry got a little rant like... didn't mean to interrupt the QQ session for the guy MAKING $520 AN OUNCE WHEN HE BUYS IT FOR $175!!!!!?!?!?!? wtf..

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Do dispensaries have any overhead? How much would a good lawyer charge a dispensary owner for a retainer? Do dispensaries have employees on payroll? Just wondering where you get your profit numbers.

HGK420 said:

i completely agree that most people don't know what they want. I've seen for myself as people get amazingly excited for some BULLSHIT just because of a name they heard once from a hippy 20 years ago or because its a decent price. sitting right next to this bullshit was all kinds of fire for almost the same price.. maybe a 20 dollar an ounce difference and about 1 in 4 buy the bullshit. i was floored.

beyond that I've seen people pick up the most gasoline skunk disgusting funk and say "MMMM FRUITY!" or "OOOO EARTHY!"" everyones taste buds work differently, theres actually tests you can take to find out which kind of a wine taster you are and whatnot. they've really done the science on flavor in the wine world and its widely excepted that theres several different kinds of pallets... so what i think smells awesome some one else might smell cardboard or something soooo.

and believe me i know valuable weed can be sold cheaper I've brought all my recommended donations down for my patients in recent months to keep the overage numbers low, I've had to revert to old tactics of free edibles with donations and all kinds of fun sales.. times are tight.. the fact people grow in dog kennels doesn't help either.. i heard tell of a dude who pulled over 100 big boys in his shitty little genesee county back yard.. dudes on maybe an acre.... tall wood fence and some dog cages AND BOOM there goes the market.... don't gotta pay the sun a dime lol

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I take exception with that! I've been a hippy much longer.

exactly thats why i said the customers always right. the customer doesn't wanna pay

pothead4life810 said:

Do dispensaries have any overhead? How much would a good lawyer charge a dispensary owner for a retainer? Do dispensaries have employees on payroll? Just wondering where you get your profit numbers.

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I've seen the overhead numbers and if your making $300+ an ounce with 2 ounces a day your paying 4 employees 100 bucks a day and you got $200 for utilities A DAY.... i know for a fact most of these dispensaries move WAYYYY MORE then 2 ounces a day..

the overhead argument is bullshit. so once again belle tire doesn't have overhead? the grocery store doesn't have overhead? for sure the grocery store gets their broccoli for 1 dollar a pound and sells it for 4 dollars a pound?? NOO they have to make due with a very small mark up and WORK EFFICIENTLY.

can't pay 4 bud tenders every day if you don't need them... if you do... you don't have worries about overhead cause your busy as shit and making a boat load....

HGK420 said:

well your feeling is wrong. 2 of my cuts have taken medals.. so ya, IN YOUR FACE! lol.. I'm not the one to start throwing around "awe you suck at this industry" accusations. but besides who cares if i grow the best weed in the world like I've said very few want to spend more then $175 now a days because the middle is super flooded, id rather grow some pretty damn decent smoke that yields better so i can compete for the real customer base... i don't know too many rappers that wanna pay that top shelf dollar around the michigan area....

and I'm not about to try and sell to dispensary owners like you so some bozo that doesn't know how to follow laws can get raided and give up all my information that points to outside the system grey area activity..

why is your industry any different then any other? your competing for the money in the state.... if your an LA dispensary your chances at making money are WAYYYY higher then a michigan dispensary considering theres 30 million people in the greater LA area.. michigan has maybe 10 million ACROSS THE ENTIRE STATE.. with 3 of the poorest cities in the entire country making up a large portion of that population... selling any product is selling any product you only have the money in your area to work with...

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I don't even know anything abut you, but you make yourself seem like a total asshole.
"in your face"?!
calling people you don't know a "bozo"
c'mon man...
I mean you could totally be a stand-up dude... but you paint yourself a poor portrait my friend
Owning my own shop, and hearing some of the things I hear about people complaining about prices and "markup"
ask yourself how much a soda costs to make, helluva lot more just in the can/bottle than the soda itself.
How about cars? Food? Shoes? Clothes?
my labor rate is $90 an hr, people look at that and they think its high...
Tools, electricity, workers comp insurance, cable-internet, smog machines service plans, TAXES, payroll, rent, etc, etc, etc...
I made more when I didn't have my own shop than I do now, I gotta bust my knuckles bloody to even sniff 75k a yr..
it's a lil more complicated than you are implying, and even if it weren't, kicking him when he's down is pretty fucked up man.
we should be on the same team, and NOBODY seems to share that sentiment.
Everybody for themselves...
Give him a break, he just got kicked in the proverbial nutsack and then you go and add insults??

greasemonkeymann said:

I don't even know anything abut you, but you make yourself seem like a total asshole.
"in your face"?!
calling people you don't know a "bozo"
c'mon man...
I mean you could totally be a stand-up dude... but you paint yourself a poor portrait my friend
Owning my own shop, and hearing some of the things I hear about people complaining about prices and "markup"
ask yourself how much a soda costs to make, helluva lot more just in the can/bottle than the soda itself.
How about cars? Food? Shoes? Clothes?
my labor rate is $90 an hr, people look at that and they think it high...
Tools, electricity, workers comp insurance, cable-internet, smog machines service plans, TAXES, payroll, rent, etc, etc, etc...
I made more when I didn't have my own shop than I do now, I gotta bust my knuckles bloody to even sniff 75k a yr..

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... you think i was serious... i said lol right afterwards it was clearly a joke... i even went on to say how growing the best isn't your best route now a days...

if your paying some one $90 dollars an hour to bud tend and have to sell the patients weed for $520 to cover ridiculous over head you deserve to go out of business

Dr. Who said:

You do NOT make $520 a zip smart guy! 1500 a month rent - electrical - insurance - paying employee's - the set up cost alone is more then you will spend on your little grow over the next 3-5 years! there are costs you would never even think of.....it was never a "cake walk" and we sure as HELL aren't like Harborside collective in Cali making 7 figures a year! In fact profit per is LESS then 6 figures *NET*.....so go bitch someplace else!

If you have a kid in a children's hospital or in Make a wish - OUR MONEY is there!

We supplied over 70% of needs by ourselves.....I'm going to be paying for that!

I opened disp. to serve those who choose to NOT to grow or go with a caregiver. There are many who choose that!

Making money is not against the law! Much of that was spent locally and we give graciously to charities.

Screw this

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I am friends with some people that work at kindpeoples collective..
disp here IN CALIFORNIA... where supposedly our market is flooded...
they make WELL into the 7 figures man...
it's lucrative to say the least...
but I still prefer to be completely incognito... small reliable rich clientele and no paper trail..
uhem... uh I mean I grow strictly for personal consumption..

HGK420 said:

... you think i was serious... i said lol right afterwards it was clearly a joke... i even went on to say how growing the best isn't your best route now a days...

if your paying some one $90 dollars an hour to bud tend and have to sell the patients weed for $520 to cover ridiculous over head you deserve to go out of business

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nah man that was an example.
I have an autoshop..
That'd be a helluva damn good trimmer!
and if you were kidding?
I humbly apologize.. but it didn't appear that way at all.
My bad if it was the case.

phil k said:

when your a cancer or true medical patient yes you are forced to buy there.. if you can't grow your forced to buy there if you rent in a area where the owner won't allow grows you are forced to buy there.. trust me if your a patient, can't, doesnt know how or can't afford to get properly setup your forced to buy there.. not sure what your thinking and the patients are the reason those places survive... i know abe isn't pissy about dispensaries he's pissy about the they way treat growers and patients.. they buy so fucking low that most really small time growers can't profit well then they turn around and flip the ounces they buy at 150 for 400-560$.

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Phil, you, like many growers that have never actually ran a business are way off base with your numbers.

80% of MY business is $10 strains - we provide quality medicine to meet the patients needs. You take an oz.... I give a 4g 1/8 for $35. If I get the full 7 out of that I gross $245. Minus the $175 cost that is a $70 profit. If you do the math with Rent, Labor, Security, Utilities, Supplies and the repair costs for the never ending attempted and or successful break ins there is no pot of gold at the end of this rainbow son.

The rest of my sales are about 15% $15 strains and 5% $20 strains. The profit improves there.

As far as people FORCED to shop with me... your reasoning is weak... dispensaries have only been around in the Detroit area for 5-6 years patients found a way before the stores came. I have plenty of patients that are housebound yet find many ways for a cardholder to come get their medicine.

Not to mention you have to put a premium on the ability to browse a wide selection in a safe secure environment as apposed to the kid at the gas station yelling I got the loud or the Craiglist killers that want to come to your house.

I take the risk to own a store, I invested the money to open and keep it running, I provide a service to our community, I provide jobs, I will never be ashamed to make a profit.

Healenz said:

Phil, you, like many growers that have never actually ran a business are way off base with your numbers.

80% of MY business is $10 strains - we provide quality medicine to meet the patients needs. You take an oz.... I give a 4g 1/8 for $35. If I get the full 7 out of that I gross $245. Minus the $175 cost that is a $70 profit. If you do the math with Rent, Labor, Security, Utilities, Supplies and the repair costs for the never ending attempted and or successful break ins there is no pot of gold at the end of this rainbow son.

The rest of my sales are about 15% $15 strains and 5% $20 strains. The profit improves there.

As far as people FORCED to shop with me... your reasoning is weak... dispensaries have only been around in the Detroit area for 5-6 years patients found a way before the stores came. I have plenty of patients that are housebound yet find many ways for a cardholder to come get their medicine.

Not to mention you have to put a premium on the ability to browse a wide selection in a safe secure environment as apposed to the kid at the gas station yelling I got the loud or the Craiglist killers that want to come to your house.

I take the risk to own a store, I invested the money to open and keep it running, I provide a service to our community, I provide jobs, I will never be ashamed to make a profit.

Click to expand...

Doesn't really seem that profitable when you lay it out like that. Black market growers seem like the better option. How often do break ins actually occur?

This whole discussion is why i grow my own meds...for me only. Its cheap and i always have great weed to smoke. Cost for me with a 600w flower room and a 4 bulb t5 veg plus fans and whatnot is about $80 a month in utilities. I get 2 to 3 lbs a year. Im no where close to being in the red. Thats just me though.. ..

kingzt said:

Doesn't really seem that profitable when you lay it out like that. Black market growers seem like the better option. How often do break ins actually occur?

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King, we have been broken into no less than 10 times in the last 18 mo. A new shop down the street was broken into twice and held up at gunpoint all within their first 30 days.

i started my maintenance and construction in ann ann arbor when i was 20 i still own and run it to this day (15 years later) with employees and will till i pass... i started kind soil in 2009 and still run it with two employees. please do not tell me I'm in experienced in business when you not only don't know me but know absolutely nothing about me or what i do. have i ran a dispensary no i don't like fucking patients over.

and quit talking like everyone follows your and dr.whos business practice of selling 35$ eitgths jesus christ your not some saint and your not selling every fucking eight for 35$ nor are you selling every med in your store as low as you possibly can and all at the exact same damn price. and don't talk to me either about rent and cost, thats another thing i can promise you i spend more on than you do in a little dispensary. what do you pay a whopping 1,000$ for rent? and 10-15$ a hour?? please my employees make 20-35$ an hour in my construction company electric, my warehouse where we do our construction business out of costs me 1,900$ a month just for my warehouse rental for my construction company plus electrical, plus 3 vehicles and vehicle maintenance, we carry 1,000,0000.000 in insurance, 500,000.00 in workman comp and 250,000.00 bond.. then we put countless thousands into materials and hourly wages until those jobs are complete. you don't even fucking pay taxes! your not a business

we also employ 2 people part time with our soil company so please don't ever come back and act like your somehow this big business man and i or no one else knows what were talking about cause I've ran a business much much longer than you and your dispensary.

i don't have daily walk in customers to my business that drops cash because we are the closest maintenance/soil company around we work for our business and my construction company alone has 4x the overhead cost you will ever experience with a dispensary and what we do takes knowledge we don't middle man weed to people sorry.

and to say my reason are weak for people coming in is stupid .. thats the truth.. if you can't grow, don't know how, don't have the money, aren't allowed in your home, have kids and don't want to where the hell else are you getting your meds? the street corner? OH lets get on craigslist and meet someone we don't know have no clue how their meds are... etc..

Healenz said:

Phil, you, like many growers that have never actually ran a business are way off base with your numbers.

80% of MY business is $10 strains - we provide quality medicine to meet the patients needs. You take an oz.... I give a 4g 1/8 for $35. If I get the full 7 out of that I gross $245. Minus the $175 cost that is a $70 profit. If you do the math with Rent, Labor, Security, Utilities, Supplies and the repair costs for the never ending attempted and or successful break ins there is no pot of gold at the end of this rainbow son.

The rest of my sales are about 15% $15 strains and 5% $20 strains. The profit improves there.

As far as people FORCED to shop with me... your reasoning is weak... dispensaries have only been around in the Detroit area for 5-6 years patients found a way before the stores came. I have plenty of patients that are housebound yet find many ways for a cardholder to come get their medicine.

Not to mention you have to put a premium on the ability to browse a wide selection in a safe secure environment as apposed to the kid at the gas station yelling I got the loud or the Craiglist killers that want to come to your house.

I take the risk to own a store, I invested the money to open and keep it running, I provide a service to our community, I provide jobs, I will never be ashamed to make a profit.

Click to expand...

kingzt said:

Doesn't really seem that profitable when you lay it out like that. Black market growers seem like the better option. How often do break ins actually occur?

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thats the god damn point he's just saying stuff to make it look like theres so much that goes into it.. they aren't kicking in all your windows to get in they are breaking a door or window and should that happen once and you don't replace it with polycarbonate or better window thats your problem as a business owner. you get broken into once fool me you get broken into 10 x ... your the fool.. i would think after the first you'd have either a safe in place that can't be messed with

Healenz said:

Phil, you, like many growers that have never actually ran a business are way off base with your numbers.

80% of MY business is $10 strains - we provide quality medicine to meet the patients needs. You take an oz.... I give a 4g 1/8 for $35. If I get the full 7 out of that I gross $245. Minus the $175 cost that is a $70 profit. If you do the math with Rent, Labor, Security, Utilities, Supplies and the repair costs for the never ending attempted and or successful break ins there is no pot of gold at the end of this rainbow son.

The rest of my sales are about 15% $15 strains and 5% $20 strains. The profit improves there.

As far as people FORCED to shop with me... your reasoning is weak... dispensaries have only been around in the Detroit area for 5-6 years patients found a way before the stores came. I have plenty of patients that are housebound yet find many ways for a cardholder to come get their medicine.

Not to mention you have to put a premium on the ability to browse a wide selection in a safe secure environment as apposed to the kid at the gas station yelling I got the loud or the Craiglist killers that want to come to your house.

I take the risk to own a store, I invested the money to open and keep it running, I provide a service to our community, I provide jobs, I will never be ashamed to make a profit.

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and what are you talking about i am the one who said dispensaries sell more 10$ grams than 20$

i would like to hear from patients/caregivers that can state you sell 4 gram 35$ eights all day every day and id love to know the growers who can state they are paid 175$ per ounce all the way up with every grower that comes in and can come back in to your shop and see the same bud they sold for 175$ on the rack at 35$ for 4 grams.. can someone verify that?

Healenz said:

Phil, you, like many growers that have never actually ran a business are way off base with your numbers.

80% of MY business is $10 strains - we provide quality medicine to meet the patients needs. You take an oz.... I give a 4g 1/8 for $35. If I get the full 7 out of that I gross $245. Minus the $175 cost that is a $70 profit. If you do the math with Rent, Labor, Security, Utilities, Supplies and the repair costs for the never ending attempted and or successful break ins there is no pot of gold at the end of this rainbow son.

The rest of my sales are about 15% $15 strains and 5% $20 strains. The profit improves there.

As far as people FORCED to shop with me... your reasoning is weak... dispensaries have only been around in the Detroit area for 5-6 years patients found a way before the stores came. I have plenty of patients that are housebound yet find many ways for a cardholder to come get their medicine.

Not to mention you have to put a premium on the ability to browse a wide selection in a safe secure environment as apposed to the kid at the gas station yelling I got the loud or the Craiglist killers that want to come to your house.

I take the risk to own a store, I invested the money to open and keep it running, I provide a service to our community, I provide jobs, I will never be ashamed to make a profit.

Click to expand...

cause your breaking down numbers on your lowest priced and profit item apparently and your acting like you sell 1-2 ounces a day.. maybe you do if thats the case clearly your business isn't thriving.

Healenz said:

King, we have been broken into no less than 10 times in the last 18 mo. A new shop down the street was broken into twice and held up at gunpoint all within their first 30 days.

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whats your dispensary?