LED Without LEDs -My First T5 Grow

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infinitalus

Active Member
Petflora, for UVB you definitely want minute quantities (he is doing the 5.0) or you will be getting premature maturation of buds.

I found a lot of different reports on UVB usage and decided to try for myself.

Im using 2x reptiglo 10.0 24w CFLs about 10-12" away from my plants. Theyre on a separate timer for 4 hours a day during the middle of the photoperiod. 4 hours without, 4 hours with, 4 hours without. The sugar leaves have gotten darker and shine with resin acting as sun screen. Red hairs appear to be more so on this side of the plant than the other without UVB. Appears to make no difference on trichome production but the resin glands have been swelling quite a bit. For my knee pain, I like a little more CBD so it works out well.

Using polys method of T12 UVB will work as long as it goes on a timer and isnt TOO close to the plants.
 
FilthyFletch

FilthyFletch

Mr I Can Do That For Half
I know this is old but even back then the issue wasnt they didnt grow well they break down the thc and grow nice buds with a low thc count..
 
hyroot

hyroot

Well-Known Member
Thay dr. Foster and smith site is screwy. They keep changing their prices through out the day. They cant decide if they are having a sale or not.

This morning they said they were having a 2 week sale ending may 14. An hour later I went on to make an order. Sale is gone. Then I went back on from my phone an hour ago. Sale is back on. Just now I went back on the site on pc and phone and no more sale. The flora suns were 11.49, 12.49, 14.27. Now 14.99. Wtf.....
 
polyarcturus

polyarcturus

Well-Known Member
i thought the sale was till the end of this month.

Hyroot, UV (even the 10.0) is okay to run all 12 hours, i run mine 11 hours with my MH and my hps 12 hours. the key is that they are not too close but the amount of UV from these bulbs are like 1/10 the intensity of the sun you really only have to worry about problems if all the light from the bulb is focused on a single spot. in fact UV light is most useful as side lighting, and the tube are the best choice for UV suppliment since the light is very spread out.

another thing im using the cfls(x2 10.0 exoterra) currently but for a price like 13$ a tube cant miss out, plus i think the coverage will be better than the cfls.
but those cfls pack a wallop thats for sure.

oh yeah i forgot to say the UV expert around here is gastanker, he does some crazy shit with the reptile bulbs, most of this info is from him

https://www.rollitup.org/advanced-marijuana-cultivation/507322-uvb-full-12-hours-during-2.html

good info over here as far as understanding microwatts in actual action, distance plays into UV alot.



having fun FF?
 
I

infinitalus

Active Member
yeah I figured 10-12" away was good enough and I was right. I still dont have enough UVB, but this isnt the time to fret about that with very tight money restrictions at this point. Just put my name on a few housing applications. Time to get the ball rolling in that court.

Ill be picking up a few smaller standing lamps for my CFLs for adequate central UVB. I have 4x 2 lamp HO T8 fixtures which I can use for UVB side lighting.

So far, the results of using the UVB for just 4 hours a day has been beneficial. If texas gets ~ 220mW of UVB, imagine what Afghanistan and India is like. When my roomie came home from the Army says he said the best marijuana hes ever saw came from Afghanistan, and he has seen all sorts of the stuff Ive had. I was indeed jealous..
 
Kite High

Kite High

Well-Known Member
there are NO cfls which provide anywhere near the 150-500 uw/cm2 required for the uvb effect

these t 5's DO provide it though:

http://www.lightyourreptiles.com/ard3t546in54.html

With a solartech 6.2 uvb meter at 12 inches from the bulb 431/uw/cm2

here at 7300 ft elevation in NM at 2 pm uvb reading 411/uw/cm2....

greatest level measured in nature thus far was 530/uw/cm2
 
polyarcturus

polyarcturus

Well-Known Member
Kite High said:
there are NO cfls which provide anywhere near the 150-500 uw/cm2 required for the uvb effect

these t 5's DO provide it though:

http://www.lightyourreptiles.com/ard3t546in54.html

With a solartech 6.2 uvb meter at 12 inches from the bulb 431/uw/cm2

here at 7300 ft elevation in NM at 2 pm uvb reading 411/uw/cm2....

greatest level measured in nature thus far was 530/uw/cm2
Click to expand...
your wrong it intensity the cfl will put off plenty at close range plus the more of them you the more effective they will be, yeah i know about Arcadia bulbs they are not available in america right now or i would have them. microwatts stack so to speak and most measurements are made at distances further than i would have the bulbs to my plants and if you go the thread i linked earlier, you will see he is using tanning bulbs which put off the ultimate amount of UVB. and the difference between my buds with and without UVB is nite and day, 1 cfl at the top of a single plant within 12inches will have a noticeable affect. 2 cfl next to each other above 1 plants within 12 inches and you will start seeing big differences...... my first exp. with UVB was i killed a plant and had harvest another plant early, so i know it works with one cfl(exoterra reptiglo 10.0 to be specific)
 
Kite High

Kite High

Well-Known Member
you are mistaken...I ordered the Arcadias and received them from the very link I posted...the co. is in Maine

Also side lighting the plants with uvb has proven better results than overhead

View attachment 2150467
http://www.solarmeter.com/model62.html

And at 1 inch the 23 watt 10.0 cfls only emit 35 uw/cm2 as per measurements with the above meter...the range to produce the effect is 150-500 uw/cm2 which the cfls will never produce at any number or distance... Yes I have said meter and have taken readings on so many bulbs...this is why I use arcadias and megaray zoos...the meter doesnt lie nor does the herb

I keep it at 300-400 the entire grow with the megaray zoo bulbs and arcadias and both thc and thcv levels were increased compared to lab results from control bud...best was about 10% increase in thcv and 6% in thc...go above 500 uw/cm2 and the yield suffers with no apparent gain over the 400 level

http://www.reptileuv.com/megaray-eb-60-watt-flood-zoo-lamp-kit.php

more uppy creeper and longer lasting high were the effects reported by smokers in comparison
 
polyarcturus

polyarcturus

Well-Known Member
i already said that UV lighting was better on the side, i dont know the actual readings for the cfls but im sure their higher than that, how did i kill my plants? shit was rolling good, i havent had a case of sids for 3 years!(at least not in a plant that old- 2 weeks into flower)

yeahi have been looking into MV lights im thinking of adding it to my grow, hell i might even do a 400w! but im undecided, these spectrums from fluorescents are amazing and much easier to manipulate the light spectrums to have closer ratios, to that which occur in nature.

yes the creeper effect, is it really credited to thcv? that is interestin and the first time i have really heard that... but cannabis synthesis is long book i havenot really broken into, alas no lab to do testing, so no desire. but maybe one day.
 
polyarcturus

polyarcturus

Well-Known Member
i dont know tho anyways im not the uv expert i just roll with the shit i can afford and are common. if they where accessible like up the street or a major website for a lower price id be more interested. its just i believe in quality, but not to the point where im spending LED money.

i mean what did i cost them to make that bulb, i believe all they have to do is skimp on a specific layer of phosphor.
 
PetFlora

PetFlora

Well-Known Member
PSUAGRO. said:
^^^^Yes Pet is somewhat of a grammar nazi:bigjoint:sorry pet..............ha........he just expects the most out of uskiss-ass
Click to expand...

Thanks for noticing. I write for a number of different mediums where communication accuracy is critical. I expect a lot out of myself to learn, grow, correct mistakes, move to higher ground. Also, the PTB (powers that be) are desperate to dumb us and down and keep us there. That alone is reason enough
 
PetFlora

PetFlora

Well-Known Member
infinitalus said:
Petflora, for UVB you definitely want minute quantities (he is doing the 5.0) or you will be getting premature maturation of buds.

I found a lot of different reports on UVB usage and decided to try for myself.

Im using 2x reptiglo 10.0 24w CFLs about 10-12" away from my plants. Theyre on a separate timer for 4 hours a day during the middle of the photoperiod. 4 hours without, 4 hours with, 4 hours without. The sugar leaves have gotten darker and shine with resin acting as sun screen. Red hairs appear to be more so on this side of the plant than the other without UVB. Appears to make no difference on trichome production but the resin glands have been swelling quite a bit. For my knee pain, I like a little more CBD so it works out well.

Using polys method of T12 UVB will work as long as it goes on a timer and isnt TOO close to the plants.
Click to expand...
That sounds like a good plan. I use a Repti-Glo 10.0, as side lighting, in my starter tent.

I have it on excellent authority that IR for ~ 10 minutes immediately after lights out is very beneficial as well.
 
AltarNation

AltarNation

Well-Known Member
PetFlora said:
Thanks for noticing. I write for a number of different mediums where communication accuracy is critical. I expect a lot out of myself to learn, grow, correct mistakes, move to higher ground. Also, the PTB (powers that be) are desperate to dumb us and down and keep us there. That alone is reason enough
Click to expand...
Well said, PF! I am also a fan of accuracy of communication methods in any and all mediums. And fuck them powers that be. ;)
 
PetFlora

PetFlora

Well-Known Member
Started a new Journal. See my sig.

I have not yet posted anything regarding lighting choice. Probably add that later.


What ever happened to Pr0f or his new bulb?
 
Kite High

Kite High

Well-Known Member
polyarcturus said:
i dont know tho anyways im not the uv expert i just roll with the shit i can afford and are common. if they where accessible like up the street or a major website for a lower price id be more interested. its just i believe in quality, but not to the point where im spending LED money.

i mean what did i cost them to make that bulb, i believe all they have to do is skimp on a specific layer of phosphor.
Click to expand...

It is moreso the glass than the phosphor coating which allows the uvb to escape...I tested Exo-terra and and Zoo med 23 watt cfls and the best they did on the meter was the 35 uw/cm2...also it seems that uvb levels drop off even faster than lumens with distance...also the glass in the cfls polarizes after 6 mos and barely emit any uvb

I agree that the arcadia are expensive but they work so it is worth it

I have not witnessed premature pistil reddening nor increase in resin production, nor any change in flower times...When I first attempted it with cfls etc this did occur but IMO it was from the heat from having to keep them 1" away which still wasn't enough uvb

I too am befuddled as to what causes creeper effect as well...I suspect it is other lesser known cannabinoids or a combo of things but it is definitely greatly enhanced by uvb

hope it helps...jus saying
 
polyarcturus

polyarcturus

Well-Known Member
i was also reading about the differences in glass this seems to be the problem with using commercial MV bulbs.

i dont know exactly which ones yet but some MV bulbs are made from UV resistant glass and others have a coating that could be washed off the glass.

another thing i wanted to note, according to one website, the meters are not an accurate tool for measurement. they say that yes they measure the uvb spectrum but not to a degree of accuracy that they can give actual number to the amount emited. the meters simply tell how much(%) of the spectrum is in the UVB range, they even tell you not to compare result from between bulbs. this is usefull, but not the deteriming factor in the quantity a UV bulb produces.

i knew the bulbs had to be replaced every six monthes now i know why thx for that little tidbit of info.
 
polyarcturus

polyarcturus

Well-Known Member
thinking about getting one of these...http://www.staytannorth.com/400wclipin.html... who here has the ball to have this light bulb 6 inches from their face?

i dont know where to get the specs for these bulbs, but these are probably just what i need..


also found out cfl uvb bulbs have a 150 hour burn in period where uv is greater than normal, and that the older design uvb cfls where janky and alot of them produced a LARGE amount of uv and where burning eyes, well im about to head to a couple stores and look for some older cfl bulbs! seems this problem has only recently(like in the last year/2011) been corrected
 
Kite High

Kite High

Well-Known Member
the meter is centered at 295 nm and what they are implying is that if the spectrum of the bulb is highest in this range it will fool the meter into reading higher than the overall output of uvb of another bulb which is not as active at that nm

tanning bulbs are mostly uva

sterilization bulbs are uvc

the mega ray externally ballasted 60 ZOO lamps produced the highest numbers of all...while the meter is not the most accurate it will tell you if the lamp will meet the level;s you need way better than anything else would without paying thousands of dollars...afterall it does not require high accuracy as the range of energy is quite wide which will produce the sought after effects

And please do not think I am attempting to argue...just sharing info and data that I have found chasing this uvb thing down....main thing I want to stress is it is definitely worth the effort as it produces the trippy creeper high I loved in the 70's back into my life
 
polyarcturus

polyarcturus

Well-Known Member
sounds good, i think i will run a comparsion between a few bulbs when i have time, but research is research and i have pretty much come to the same conclusion as you(that ZOO lamps are the way to go or arcadia) just trying to find chaper and better, well, decent sources.
 
PetFlora

PetFlora

Well-Known Member
Kite High said:
you are mistaken...I ordered the Arcadias and received them from the very link I posted...the co. is in Maine

Also side lighting the plants with uvb has proven better results than overhead

View attachment 2150467
http://www.solarmeter.com/model62.html

And at 1 inch the 23 watt 10.0 cfls only emit 35 uw/cm2 as per measurements with the above meter...the range to produce the effect is 150-500 uw/cm2 which the cfls will never produce at any number or distance... Yes I have said meter and have taken readings on so many bulbs...this is why I use arcadias and megaray zoos...the meter doesnt lie nor does the herb

I keep it at 300-400 the entire grow with the megaray zoo bulbs and arcadias and both thc and thcv levels were increased compared to lab results from control bud...best was about 10% increase in thcv and 6% in thc...go above 500 uw/cm2 and the yield suffers with no apparent gain over the 400 level

http://www.reptileuv.com/megaray-eb-60-watt-flood-zoo-lamp-kit.php

more uppy creeper and longer lasting high were the effects reported by smokers in comparison
Click to expand...
Excellent 411. How many MegaRays for a 2 x 4 area? As side lighting it seems one has to spread the plants apart, which I can do.
 
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