How much does genetics really matter for seeds? How much of it is a scam?

zoomer428 said:

Its not an opinion that today's genetics are better than yesterday's lol. Its also not an opinion that plants are able to be grown to their genetic ceiling and most people don't have the experience to do so.

I understand what your saying too. Its just that those aren't opinions. Its like saying older guitar players were better. Like I'm sorry thats just not true. They were the best in their time. We take and build upon them. We stand on the shoulders of giants. The opinion in all of this, however is the person saying that the older guitar players were better. Same thing for cannabis. In reality, THEY think they are better. Factually we have improved. Cannabis has improved. Guitar players have in fact, improved past jimis skill level. Its not to take away from the older crowd again we stand on the shoulders of giants. But you are taking away from the current generation by not saying they are on top of the game because they are.

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To a point in other ways nah when we talking guitar theres still no one thats on the level of some of the guys that came before imo suppose personal taste influences that tho of course mate sure our tech has improved alot

smokerjimbob said:

Okay we'll see. I grew my entire Piff Coast Midnight Mass of 10 fem seeds this time. 4 died but I was able to get 6 plants going. Well 2 around 2 months old currently and 4 more I recently popped which are seedling stage right now and will be grown outdoors in the backyard. Even 1 Harlem Dreams as well.

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Never tryed there gear myself before far as i know anyway

smokerjimbob said:

I meant 2 teaspoons to 2 gallons of water. They are in 3 or 5 gallon fabric pots. I add a little bit of nutes because especially the Great Lakes soil is said to have deficiencies later in the grow.

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I checked out your grow journal briefly. I think you're on the path and you have alot to figure out before you should lose faith. I'm still learning to. I had back to back grows with some promise that got ruined by a freeze and a heat wave respectively, right when I started to dry them. Shit sucks, but we keep trudging along.

I don't put blame on the weed when shit doesn't work out, and I think it pushes me to do better. Just my 2 cents.

There is no way anyone will convince me today's weed is better than weed 20+ years ago.

Something happened to the weed and it's not strong like it used to be or even as good tasting/good smelling.

Dont' know if the DEA burned all the good genetics, if money hungry hucksters overbread weed to make polyhybrids and bred out the good genes as a result. But today's weed is a shadow of its former self.

Why does every dispensary smell like that cheap, hay-like, weed smell. Almost smells like a dull manure. I don't remember weed smelling like that. Today's weed smell like poo poo because it is poo poo.

Whats even more amazing is so many people buy the shit. So many young kids buying Stiizy/Cannabiotix and calling it fire. OMFG they have no idea what good weed was.

When you burn good weed, people turn their head and say what's that sweet smell. Today's weed smell people smell it and say damn who's smoking that nasty marijuana again? Get that smoke away from me.

"I haven't smoked good weed in years" does not mean "good weed doesn't exist anymore."

smokerjimbob said:

I meant 2 teaspoons to 2 gallons of water. They are in 3 or 5 gallon fabric pots. I add a little bit of nutes because especially the Great Lakes soil is said to have deficiencies later in the grow.

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Interesting. Tag me in a grow diary next time around ill throw my 2 cents in for whatever its worth.

Tolerance Break said:

That is literally an opinion lol

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So you don't think we have improved since the 80s? Its actually a fact we have. Its YOU who has the opinion.

smokerjimbob said:

There is no way anyone will convince me today's weed is better than weed 20+ years ago.

Something happened to the weed and it's not strong like it used to be or even as good tasting/good smelling.

Dont' know if the DEA burned all the good genetics, if money hungry hucksters overbread weed to make polyhybrids and bred out the good genes as a result. But today's weed is a shadow of its former self.

Why does every dispensary smell like that cheap, hay-like, weed smell. Almost smells like a dull manure. I don't remember weed smelling like that. Today's weed smell like poo poo because it is poo poo.

Whats even more amazing is so many people buy the shit. So many young kids buying Stiizy/Cannabiotix and calling it fire. OMFG they have no idea what good weed was.

When you burn good weed, people turn their head and say what's that sweet smell. Today's weed smell people smell it and say damn who's smoking that nasty marijuana again? Get that smoke away from me.

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The genetics are there, just diluted or hidden . In my thinking it's the entourage effect that we've lost to a large extent .

zoomer428 said:

Interesting. Tag me in a grow diary next time around ill throw my 2 cents in for whatever its worth.

So you don't think we have improved since the 80s? Its actually a fact we have. Its YOU who has the opinion.

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Lol yes, I also have an opinion.

I have no reason to believe today's weed is any better than the landrace/heirloom weed from which it's based. There are families that have been cultivating cannabis for hundreds of years, from places where weed has been cultivated for thousands of years, and they weren't operating under clandestine prohibition. No corporate overlord demanding returns based on spreadsheets. They were free, and it was their lifes work. To say modern cultivars are empirically better today is ego, bordering on arrogance. That's my opinion.

We are standing on the shoulders of giants.

Unga Bunga said:

The genetics are there, just diluted or hidden . In my thinking it's the entourage effect that we've lost to a large extent .

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I tend to think its just the way the sales has developed. I don't go to dispos often. But its also hard to find the real stinky shit on the streets. Mostly sweeter flavors. Cookies and all its types. Lots of sweeter kushs. Not a lot of cheese or things of that nature it seems.

conor c said:

To a point in other ways nah when we talking guitar theres still no one thats on the level of some of the guys that came before imo suppose personal taste influences that tho of course mate sure our tech has improved alot

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So guitar playing is probably the one thing I'd say I'm best at out of my hobbies and I can't take anyone who says that seriously. People today can play things people back in the day like jimi hendrix, couldn't play. They don't have the skill set. If you could resurrect them they would develop that skill set. But thats not real. On the other hand, players now adays can play everything jimi made, and more. Now a valid reason why someone might say someone like jimi or randy Rhodes was the greatest would be that they didn't have the internet to learn and exposure was much harder, finding good instruments etc etc. And thats fair. But to say jimi is more skilled than today's players is just not true. One couldn't do what the other does. While today's players can do it all and more.

And again thats not to take away from older guitar players. It just irritates me when people take away from the current generation. We are better flat out. They are part of the reason of course. And it was much more difficult in their times. But again, jimi is never going to shred arpeggios like yngwie malmsteem but yngwi can play anything from back in the day.

Tolerance Break said:

Lol yes, I also have an opinion.

I have no reason to believe today's weed is any better than the landrace/heirloom weed from which it's based. There are families that have been cultivating cannabis for hundreds of years, from places where weed has been cultivated for thousands of years, and they weren't operating under clandestine prohibition. No corporate overlord demanding returns based on spreadsheets. They were free, and it was their lifes work. To say modern cultivars are empirically better today is ego, bordering on arrogance. That's my opinion.

We are standing on the shoulders of giants.

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I have the opposite opinion lol. To say they were better in the past, is bordering on arrogance imo. It feels boomer-esque. Like the "back in my day" stuff. Trust me %100 props for being able to do that stuff back then with no internet to help and all the laws that shot the shit into the ground in certain places. But I can't fathom how someone thinks that we haven't improved. Those guys, those strains and genetics, if they weren't busted. Are still going. Meaning they should have improved. Which again proves my point. Unless you actually think that those particular plants were better which then seems like a rose color glasses type deal which is fine. Its just an opinion man.

That guy is the video with a $1000 Oz. Is Kyle kushman of strawberry cough fame.

An thats 2 chains with Sarah silverman

I’ve grown a few $100+ packs all fire save for a few herms here and there that got pulled, grown more reasonably priced beans(~$50 packs) from established breeders too and also all been fire, I’ve grown fire from hobbyist breeders on OG(also some mid bs but mostly fire) I’ve grown fire from $2 seeds on strainly too(also some mids, can’t say mostly either way because I’ve only shopped strainly the once)

Greengrouch said:

I’ve grown a few $100+ packs all fire save for a few herms here and there that got pulled, grown more reasonably priced beans(~$50 packs) from established breeders too and also all been fire, I’ve grown fire from hobbyist breeders on OG(also some mid bs but mostly fire) I’ve grown fire from $2 seeds on strainly too(also some mids, can’t say mostly either way because I’ve only shopped strainly the once)

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And that my friends is why the market is so fucked, bs mids but fire, 2$ fire, everything fire
Give us a break...
If you under 20 you have no idea what fire even means, no disrespect just pointing out

@zoomer428 your out of context, your arguments have no relation to our topic, we are talking about things you can't change and again you make the same argumentals about weight (which can be changed)
So you probably too stoned at the moment or something, I'll be back later again to point out what actually pro growers know, you grow it, you smoke it, if it's good, you keep it, if it's not, nothing will make it better.
Ask all the pro growers why they throw away so many plants if it's so grower based, it's not.
If the breeder did a good job, you will have good results, nothing on your end can change that.
When I read your claims it sounds like this:
This is a non bearing fruit tree, but if you give it to the right grower, he can make fruit appear !
Faulty logic

DanKiller said:

@zoomer428
So you probably too stoned at the moment or something,

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Maybe you should ask him what he's growing for genetics then, aye?

Wtf is this thread even about? I cant decipher whether you guys have actually grown any weed yourself or you're talking dispo weed??

Cruise around the forum, there's a lot of talk of good gear. Get hunting

natureboygrower said:

Maybe you should ask him what he's growing for genetics then, aye?

Wtf is this thread even about? I cant decipher whether you guys have actually grown any weed yourself or your talking dispo weed??

Cruise around the forum, there's a lot of talk of good gear. Get hunting

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Someone can't find good weed, some people are debating what good even weed is, aswell as where to find it...
Then I got assmad about the use of declarative statements in regards to experiences and opinions, which derailed things a bit. My bad.

I have smoked a lot of weed...
It has changed over the years...
It will change again...how I don't know
That said....

I know a good high when I feel one...
I know superior genetics when I see them
I know superior growers when I encounter one
I am an OG.

I have seen growers produce mega beautiful plants.
With perfect nugs ...frost monsters
Not a 'hairy' nug in sight...just perfectly dense nugs
So genetics can improve with the grower

I have seen absolute shit shows that shine due to powerful genetics. They both go hand in hand.

As for growing the fire
I can compete at canna cup levels in hydro...
I know this...
I am however NEW to strictly coco coir growing.
I can't compete with anyone in that

I know that as more people start to grow...
The weak growers will thin out
As large hoop house growers fail to put out fire
Buyers will seek other sellers

I am waiting for cannabis rescheduling..
I think it will open the flood gates to even more growers. I think $100 is the lowest cannabis will dive before people start paying $200-$300 an Oz again...

I just bought 5 packs of seeds from Shoreline genetics...his packs have fire in them...
I just have to find it.
Chem 91
ECSD
DeathStar
Shoreline
Crippy...
All old school ...so we shall see

zoomer428 said:

I tend to think its just the way the sales has developed. I don't go to dispos often. But its also hard to find the real stinky shit on the streets. Mostly sweeter flavors. Cookies and all its types. Lots of sweeter kushs. Not a lot of cheese or things of that nature it seems.

So guitar playing is probably the one thing I'd say I'm best at out of my hobbies and I can't take anyone who says that seriously. People today can play things people back in the day like jimi hendrix, couldn't play. They don't have the skill set. If you could resurrect them they would develop that skill set. But thats not real. On the other hand, players now adays can play everything jimi made, and more. Now a valid reason why someone might say someone like jimi or randy Rhodes was the greatest would be that they didn't have the internet to learn and exposure was much harder, finding good instruments etc etc. And thats fair. But to say jimi is more skilled than today's players is just not true. One couldn't do what the other does. While today's players can do it all and more.

And again thats not to take away from older guitar players. It just irritates me when people take away from the current generation. We are better flat out. They are part of the reason

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Sure bud agree to disagree

Trap Star said:

I have smoked a lot of weed...
It has changed over the years...
It will change again...how I don't know
That said....

I know a good high when I feel one...
I know superior genetics when I see them
I know superior growers when I encounter one
I am an OG.

I have seen growers produce mega beautiful plants.
With perfect nugs ...frost monsters
Not a 'hairy' nug in sight...just perfectly dense nugs
So genetics can improve with the grower

I have seen absolute shit shows that shine due to powerful genetics. They both go hand in hand.

As for growing the fire
I can compete at canna cup levels in hydro...
I know this...
I am however NEW to strictly coco coir growing.
I can't compete with anyone in that

I know that as more people start to grow...
The weak growers will thin out
As large hoop house growers fail to put out fire
Buyers will seek other sellers

I am wait for cannabis rescheduling..
I think it will open the flood gates to even more growers. I think $100 is the lowest cannabis will dive before people start paying $200-$300 an Oz again...

I just bought 5 packs of seeds from Shoreline genetics...his packs have fire in them...
I just have to find it.
Chem 91
ECSD
DeathStar
Shoreline
Crippy...
All old school ...so we shall see

Click to expand...

I know shoreline is legit, but its always suss when people have regular seed of clone only plants. Like, how did lucky dog and Shoreline BX chem 91 when it was one of many bagseed from a dead show, and all the seeds popped females?

Tolerance Break said:

Someone can't find good weed, some people are debating what good even weed is, aswell as where to find it...
Then I got assmad about the use of declarative statements in regards to experiences and opinions, which derailed things a bit. My bad.

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You're good. I read your Bodhi recommendation and agree 100%. I just grew out his white afghani where the afghani was very dominate and reminiscent of 90's weed. Hardly any taste terps, just a weed taste and potent. I grew out 2 phenos, 1 is going to be a keeper. It's unlike most of the fruity terp stuff I run. Dried very gassy.

I think it's always best to just check the lineage on stuff, you may be surprised at what can be unlocked.

DanKiller said:

And that my friends is why the market is so fucked, bs mids but fire, 2$ fire, everything fire
Give us a break...
If you under 20 you have no idea what fire even means, no disrespect just pointing out

@zoomer428 your out of context, your arguments have no relation to our topic, we are talking about things you can't change and again you make the same argumentals about weight (which can be changed)
So you probably too stoned at the moment or something, I'll be back later again to point out what actually pro growers know, you grow it, you smoke it, if it's good, you keep it, if it's not, nothing will make it better.
Ask all the pro growers why they throw away so many plants if it's so grower based, it's not.
If the breeder did a good job, you will have good results, nothing on your end can change that.
When I read your claims it sounds like this:
This is a non bearing fruit tree, but if you give it to the right grower, he can make fruit appear !
Faulty logic

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I’m closer to 40 than 30, much less 20 lol and I’ll take today’s weed over the old mexi brick and beasters any day. Sure you could find dank back then but you were gonna pay 60 an 1/8, never mind how much more worry free growings gotten. It’s an easy to grow plant, as long as the parents were decent and the grow environment too aside from some outliers most of the weeds gonna be decent too. People with different world views make seeds too, like some folk are profit driven and will charge what the market can bear, others just want people to have medicine they can afford but still have overhead so they charge enough to cover it, others just want to share a cool thing they made fuck the money. That’s why seeds that grow into dank can range from free to several hundred a pack