jonsnow399
Well-Known Member
I get the crates for free.I think that comes out to about 50 net pots, sans crates, for $80. The only bummer is I don't grow in soil.Oh, wait - 25, for two 1x3 strips, I think...
PetFlora
Well-Known Member
My new aero cloner and seedling starter. It will be on a deep cycle timer ~ 1 minute on/3 minutes off. The tan misters provide a finer mist and are somewhat adjustable
The starter discs are coco filled. They swell when soaked. Since I am using hydro, I then put them into jars and feed with eye dropper until I see roots
The starter discs are coco filled. They swell when soaked. Since I am using hydro, I then put them into jars and feed with eye dropper until I see roots
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ZxcStaz
Active Member
Nice PetFlora!
What size pump powers that bad boy? You know, I think you need few more nozzles, say about a dozen more, maybe two, just sprinkle them all over the bucket...well, you know that's how I'd do it. I'd give those plants a nutrient enema! (...and there's plenty more where that came from.) LOL!
Joking aside, it does look good.
What size pump powers that bad boy? You know, I think you need few more nozzles, say about a dozen more, maybe two, just sprinkle them all over the bucket...well, you know that's how I'd do it.
I'd give those plants a nutrient enema! (...and there's plenty more where that came from.) LOL!Joking aside, it does look good.
PetFlora
Well-Known Member
LOL, for anyone BUT you, the whole gestalt behind HPA is to barely give the roots enough nutrient to process then within as short a time as possible feed those hungry mouths again and again and again. That is what forces an abundance of lovely root hairs. Too much means too wet, which keeps root hairs from reaching out into the mystic atmosphere
ZxcStaz
Active Member
So, I have read in prior threads that there were issues with HPA and cloning. That better results were had with LPA, for cloning at least. Are you guys using HPA for cloning, and if so, how well does it perform in comparison to LPA? I figure that there would be a problem with embolism and dehydration, unless the dispensation timing was drastically reduced, reduced to the point of keeping the stem completely saturated -constantly. This might be a tricky feat if there are environmental fluctuations.
dstroy
Well-Known Member
I use LPA to clone, I dip the cuttings in a little rooting hormone (clonex or elite 91, elite 91 is observably better imho) and use tap water. Sometimes I use clonex clone solution if they have to sit in the cloner waiting for space to open up.
I know that people have problems with their cloners sometimes after a few runs, with cuttings damping off or taking forever to root, and there is plenty of evidence that points to poor sterilization practices in those cases. I clean my cloner with physan 20 first, empty that and then let it run with bleach for a bit before rinsing it out a couple of times and letting everything dry after every cloning run. Cleaning it out with one or the other would be ok I think, as long as it’s clean.
I don’t know the efficacy of HPA regarding cloning.
The sooner the roots get used to hpa mist the less time you lose in transition. Roots cant adapt until they appear so just mist as needed until the bump stage. HPA can be adjusted from bone dry to drenched, LPA can provide the two extremes (off or on) but not much inbetween.
The stems dont need to be completely saturated in other cloning methods, why should aero be any different
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For cloning I'm thinking to build "fogponics" cloner with ultrasonic fogger. Was reading a few good things about them. Fogger shouldn't clog up with so little nutrients in the feed for that stage.
Again, that's how I see it, and I have no real experience with foggers myself
The whole nutrients strength information is confusing. Some claim that low EC is a must, but then some say to run it up to 2900ppm (which is like EC 4.1)
I'm planning to use Hydro Flores A&B (soft water) from Canna as a base.
Bit of CalMag (Canna) to bring my RO water to EC 0.2 first.
Also my "flowering booster" will be Monopotassium Phosphate.
Phosphoric acid for pH Down and Liquid silicon for pH Up accordingly...
Again, that's how I see it, and I have no real experience with foggers myself
The whole nutrients strength information is confusing. Some claim that low EC is a must, but then some say to run it up to 2900ppm (which is like EC 4.1)
I'm planning to use Hydro Flores A&B (soft water) from Canna as a base.
Bit of CalMag (Canna) to bring my RO water to EC 0.2 first.
Also my "flowering booster" will be Monopotassium Phosphate.
Phosphoric acid for pH Down and Liquid silicon for pH Up accordingly...
PetFlora
Well-Known Member
Hey Guru. long time no speak. As you might recall I pushed HPA as far as I could without a tank, solenoids... I gave it up due to not being able to control day time room temps, which is already a problem since mid February. Consequently I went back to my original F & D roots to finish plants. I had been starting in a DIY DWC bubbler, then transferring to F & D once roots are sufficiently established. But this requires an air pump running 24/7, which introduces ambient heat and co2 into the solution. Now, all lpa needs is a deep cycle timer to make it perform similarly to hpa, and that's what I am embarking on for my next grow. Seeds are starting now. I will attempt to start timer at 1 minute on/~ 2 minutes off, 24/7The sooner the roots get used to hpa mist the less time you lose in transition. Roots cant adapt until they appear so just mist as needed until the bump stage. HPA can be adjusted from bone dry to drenched, LPA can provide the two extremes (off or on) but not much in between.
The stems dont need to be completely saturated in other cloning methods, why should aero be any different
Since taking these pics I cut a hole for the lp pump power cord
Hi Pet
Nothing wrong with LPA, i`ve used it in the past along with most of the common hydro methods. I still run flood and drain (hydroton, aka, canna aqua clay pebbles) and even a little coco here and there. The bulk is dtw hpa and aa, mainly cos theres no medium and i`m just too lazy to check, adjust and dump reservoirs on a regular basis Temps arent much of an issue here, it barely gets above freezing in feb
Nothing wrong with LPA, i`ve used it in the past along with most of the common hydro methods. I still run flood and drain (hydroton, aka, canna aqua clay pebbles) and even a little coco here and there. The bulk is dtw hpa and aa, mainly cos theres no medium and i`m just too lazy to check, adjust and dump reservoirs on a regular basis
Temps arent much of an issue here, it barely gets above freezing in feb
ZxcStaz
Active Member
Well, I don't know of too many cloning methods that don't submerge the stems or keep them very wet, at least until the formation of roots, If the other methods don't keep them wet, what is their success rate? I have heard of many cloning failures, but I have found an 80 - 100% success rate with LPA, even when monster cloning.HPA can be adjusted from bone dry to drenched, LPA can provide the two extremes (off or on) but not much inbetween.
The stems dont need to be completely saturated in other cloning methods, why should aero be any different
I agree that using HPA affords complete control over the water volume dispensed. What I'm wondering is if the droplets are so fine, will they still prevent embolism? I mean, just for cloning success rates, which method fairs better? Have you used both methods for cloning, and how do they compare?
I think that the bigger drops in LPA would be better suited for cloning, but I don't have data to make a good comparison. Let me know your thoughts.
I`ve cloned in coco, perlite and rockwool, they all work equally well. I`ve never had to resort to constantly dipping them in water to get roots I`d say the embolism risk is highest just after you take the cuts, most folks drop them straight into a glass of water to minimise the risk. I think i could soak a stem a lot faster with hpa than lpa because there`s more chance of a direct hit from millions of small droplets vs a few large ones. The ones that miss will hang around for a while, which increases the chance of a hit
I`d say the embolism risk is highest just after you take the cuts, most folks drop them straight into a glass of water to minimise the risk. I think i could soak a stem a lot faster with hpa than lpa because there`s more chance of a direct hit from millions of small droplets vs a few large ones. The ones that miss will hang around for a while, which increases the chance of a hit
ZxcStaz
Active Member
I put a fogger into my cloner to warm up the water. It does fog up nicely, and the humidity is high, but you have to watch the temperature. I put the fogger onto a thermostat, and the temperature probe into the water. If the temp exceeds 75F, it shuts off. The fog is not the only water source though. Timed spray nozzles also dispense water. Now I've also read that the fog might displace air or oxygen, so I also pump in air with a few air stones/air pump. This the first time I'm using this setup, so I'll let you know how it works as I find out.
ZxcStaz
Active Member
Hey Dstroy,
This is the first time I've heard about Elite 91. I checked out their website, but it didn't provide much information about the composition. I know it contains microbes, but there was nothing specific about rooting hormones. Do you know what it has in it? It does sound interesting, so I might give it a try when I clone next. Thanks man!
dstroy
Well-Known Member
No clue dude, I emailed them just now asking for an MSDS.
It just works faster than the clonex rooting gel that I have by a couple days. Clonex is a gel, elite 91 clones is a liquid. Could be that it is easier for the liquid to get to the cambium, the use instructions are slightly different in that clonex just wants you to take the cutting, and dip it then put it in whatever medium, and elite 91 clones specifically says that though it is optional to score the stem to the cambium layer to about an inch above where you cut and then dip and place in whatever.
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PetFlora
Well-Known Member
I got rid of hydroton ages ago. When I first grew back in the early 80s I used gravel, and grew monster plants under a 1000w street light that weighed a tonHi Pet
Nothing wrong with LPA, i`ve used it in the past along with most of the common hydro methods. I still run flood and drain (hydroton, aka, canna aqua clay pebbles) and even a little coco here and there. The bulk is dtw hpa and aa, mainly cos theres no medium and i`m just too lazy to check, adjust and dump reservoirs on a regular basis
I tried hydroton but found it messy at best. I replaced it with different size polished ornamental gravel from the dollar store. Since mosquitoes get into my house, I have to use tote lids for plants and rez.
I use 3" net pots with a coco fiber liner, plant seeds in coco pellets, and side fill with small gravel. The gravel leaves no residue, is super easy to remove from harvested roots, clean and reuse, PLUS, I can mve plants from DIY bubbler/lp aero to the finishing totes without shock
