27 arrested in five county marijuana bust

TheMan13 · Oct 23, 2013

A couple of times early in the last century many men gave their lives literally fighting on foreign soil to free this world of tyranny. Many of the survivors and leaders of those actions latter went into politics and business creating the greatest nation on earth. How did we get to where we are today with this "leadership" of politically motivated lawyers, completely oblivious to the plight of their predecessors, parsing words to simply seek power and control over this same populace. As history repeats itself here what is being taught to our youth whom which this countries future will rely upon? How can we expect the next generation to unwind all this political lawfare with 17+ trillion in debit to boot? Exactly what will be the cost of just this past decade of narcissistic partisan politicians and when will it end?

[video=youtube;m10KlmLiIk0]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m10KlmLiIk0[/video]

st0wandgrow · Oct 23, 2013

TheMan13 said:
A couple of times early in the last century many men gave their lives literally fighting on foreign soil to free this world of tyranny. Many of the survivors and leaders of those actions latter went into politics and business creating the greatest nation on earth. How did we get to where we are today with this "leadership" of politically motivated lawyers, completely oblivious to the plight of their predecessors, parsing words to simply seek power and control over this same populace. As history repeats itself here what is being taught to our youth whom which this countries future will rely upon? How can we expect the next generation to unwind all this political lawfare with 17+ trillion in debit to boot? Exactly what will be the cost of just this past decade of narcissistic partisan politicians and when will it end?

I agree with that entire post. I would think that most people do. The problem is how are these changes going to be made? With regard to marijuana laws, things are changing. Most of us agree that no man should be locked up over a plant, but how do we get to that point? That seems to be the issue here. Short of a civil uprising (which I don't think will ever happen in this country) we have to work towards incremental changes. State by state laws are being passed. 58% of the public now favors legalization of marijuana. Colorado and Washington already have laws on the books, and New York and Maine aren't far behind. In some shape or form legalization should be a reality in our lifetime. I don't want our opposition to have any ammo to use against us. People like this group gives them that ammo, imo. Or am I wrong with that thinking? Do you feel that busts like this are a positive for legalizing marijuana?

ProdigalSun · Oct 23, 2013

st0wandgrow said:
Do you feel that busts like this are a positive for legalizing marijuana?

Actually yes. The more they do aginst us at this point the better, as even those who don't even like weed are sympathizing with us. People at large really do look at this like it's just a plant farmer. They still throw around big numbers and nasty buzzwords in the papers, but the people aren't buying it.

I don't want to see someones dog get shot in a raid, but I'm happy when it makes the news because those are the stories that will get people to say "Enough already", and re-legalize the shit.

st0wandgrow · Oct 23, 2013

ProdigalSun said:
Actually yes. The more they do aginst us at this point the better, as even those who don't even like weed are sympathizing with us. People at large really do look at this like it's just a plant farmer. They still throw around big numbers and nasty buzzwords in the papers, but the people aren't buying it.

I don't want to see someones dog get shot in a raid, but I'm happy when it makes the news because those are the stories that will get people to say "Enough already", and re-legalize the shit.

I'm not so sure about that. I agree that people who are clearly being fucked with over an ounce or two, or having their children taken away from them enrage most people, and they become more sympathetic towards legalization. I don't know that an operation of this scale does that though. I think it gives fodder for the opposition, and makes it easier to paint us all in a certain way.

Maybe people are sick and tired in general of tax dollars being used like this no matter the circumstances.

TheMan13 · Oct 23, 2013

st0wandgrow said:
I agree with that entire post. I would think that most people do. The problem is how are these changes going to be made? With regard to marijuana laws, things are changing. Most of us agree that no man should be locked up over a plant, but how do we get to that point? That seems to be the issue here. Short of a civil uprising (which I don't think will ever happen in this country) we have to work towards incremental changes. State by state laws are being passed. 58% of the public now favors legalization of marijuana. Colorado and Washington already have laws on the books, and New York and Maine aren't far behind. In some shape or form legalization should be a reality in our lifetime. I don't want our opposition to have any ammo to use against us. People like this group gives them that ammo, imo. Or am I wrong with that thinking? Do you feel that busts like this are a positive for legalizing marijuana?

Yes, you are completely wrong. The use of Federal law against a states citizens with the clear precept of such laws that there is literally NO medicinal use of such within this country is as absurd as it is blatantly wrong. Furthermore, in this particular case, to wrongfully quote and combine our states criminal and civil medicinal marijuana laws under oath with the intent to simply ignore these rights and justify thier use of force is well beyond simply wrong. And in an a failed attempt to charge these individuals with conspiracy is painfully ironic at best.

con·spir·ing [verb]
1.
to agree together, especially secretly, to do something wrong, evil, or illegal: They conspired to kill the king.
2.
to act or work together toward the same result or goal.
verb (used with object)
3.
to plot (something wrong, evil, or illegal).

st0wandgrow · Oct 23, 2013

TheMan13 said:
Yes, you are completely wrong. The use of Federal law against a states citizens with the clear precept of such laws that there is literally NO medicinal use of such within this country is as absurd as it is blatantly wrong. Furthermore, in this particular case, to wrongfully quote and combine our states criminal and civil medicinal marijuana laws under oath with the intent to simply ignore these rights and justify thier use of force is well beyond simply wrong.

So your only issue here is that it was the feds? You'd be OK with this if it were the state police that conducted the raid?

TheMan13 · Oct 23, 2013

st0wandgrow said:
So your only issue here is that it was the feds? You'd be OK with this if it were the state police that conducted the raid?

That is exactly whom conducted "Operation High Mileage". I started this thread with asking the rhetorical question of why state and local LEO would illicit a federal agent to obtain warrants from a federal court to authorize this use of force. I latter provided proof of this fact with court documents.

Rrog · Oct 23, 2013

The internet unfortunately doesn't help us sometimes. If we were around a fire with a bong this would be a different / better convo. I'm speculating.

TheMan13 · Oct 23, 2013

Rrog said:
The internet unfortunately doesn't help us sometimes. If we were around a fire with a bong this would be a different / better convo. I'm speculating.

[video=youtube;INxliT-NrxA]https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=INxliT-NrxA[/video]

Rrog · Oct 23, 2013

I like everyone here and sometimes this bothers me. What we need is some newb asshole to be the scapegoat and I'll flog him and feel better.

st0wandgrow · Oct 23, 2013

TheMan13 said:
That is exactly whom conducted "Operation High Mileage". I started this thread with asking the rhetorical question of why state and local LEO would illicit a federal agent to obtain warrants from a federal court to authorize this use of force. I latter provided proof of this fact with court documents.

My apologies then. I jumped in a little later in the thread and was going off in a different direction.

My bad

OGEvilgenius · Oct 23, 2013

st0wandgrow said:
I don't hate Obama any more than any other president before him in the last 50 years. This has been going on long before he took office, and will continue long after he's gone. The problems with this country didn't start in January of 2009.

Yet you somehow are willing to accept the status quo on some level.

I never said that there was anything wrong with turning a profit, or living comfortably. Buying multiple houses, cars, 2 businesses, 140 acres of land, etc is beyond living "comfortably", and talking about it over the phone is just plain stupid. Again, if someone wants to do that, then fine. Just don't use the medical law that sick people depend upon for cover.

You talk about these guys like they're some sort of saints for medical patients driving prices down. They are doing nothing of the sort. This story, and others like it will be used as fodder by our attorney general and other corporate interests to hijack this law. They will hold this story up as an example of how the law is being abused, paving the way for a complete corporate takeover of medical marijuana like is happening right now in Canada. You tell me how a cancer patient that is on a fixed income will benefit from no longer being allowed to grow his own medicine and instead be forced to pay $400+ an ounce. You make some good points about the tyranny of our government, and then apparently just assume that they'll leave these medical laws alone and not try to turn them in to another profit stream for big business.

You sort did imply that. And they are driving prices down for everyone, not just patients - their intent is irrelevant. There are plenty of very successful folks out of Colorado/Cali who have lots of "things" yet also still give away plenty for free as well. You're all violating the law as far as the Feds are concerned, so I'm not sure why you're so upset about this in particular. The overwhelming majority of Americans support medical access and these guys aren't going to change that.

TheMan13 · Oct 23, 2013

Rrog said:
I like everyone here and sometimes this bothers me. What we need is some newb asshole to be the scapegoat and I'll flog him and feel better.

I do not mind the banter, nor do I take anything here personally brother. I would never see, understand or have the hope of overcoming political blinders without this back and forth. This is simply how we learn and sometimes it's painful. This is not the first nor last time st0w and I will go around either. I may never respect his political views (see UncleBuck), but I have yet to lose respect for him as a man and my brother.

OGEvilgenius · Oct 23, 2013

kinddiesel said:
they did a good job busting. that grow. was not legal. they must of been growing out side. makes huge plants. 3 pounds each on the low side.x 500 1500 pounds of weed on the low side yearly. 3750000 almost 4 million a year. see a problem ?

Divide that by 25 and you get a whopping 150 grand a year. That's not much these days.

Rrog · Oct 23, 2013

St0w is an upstanding person. I'd stand by him in a fight. Actually I'd probably stand behind him, but my spirit would be further up there. He's about as good a guy to have around as they come in my book.

TM13- I see your point. You like to wrestle on the rougher side. That's cool, especially if people know where you're coming from. I think 4-5 of us all together would be laughing our asses off. Seriously.

st0wandgrow · Oct 23, 2013

It's all good. After going back to the beginning of the thread (probably should have done that to begin with) I see TheMans point and actually agree with him. The feds willingness to stick their noses in to medical states is one of my biggest rubs with this administration. At this point it's pretty clear that all politicians are self-serving crooks regardless of the letter beside their name. We all want weed legalized in some fashion, but I guess we can have different ideas about how to get there and bicker about it now and then. No hard feelings on my end.

I need to smoke a bowl

Rrog · Oct 23, 2013

Let's all smoke a bowl

OGEvilgenius · Oct 23, 2013

Rrog said:
St0w is an upstanding person. I'd stand by him in a fight. Actually I'd probably stand behind him, but my spirit would be further up there. He's about as good a guy to have around as they come in my book.

TM13- I see your point. You like to wrestle on the rougher side. That's cool, especially if people know where you're coming from. I think 4-5 of us all together would be laughing our asses off. Seriously.

I like St0w, I think he means well. I think he's wrong here though.

OGEvilgenius · Oct 23, 2013

Also, I recently saw a break down of real growth vs nominal and if things remained the same in terms of relative wealth the average salary today would be equivalent of about 90k a year in the 70's. Of course that hasn't happened. The avg salary is closer to a 1/3 that number.

TheMan13 · Oct 23, 2013

I truly believe there is much more to this case than meets the eye. I cannot help but consider and/or imagine all of the wording and statements within those warrants that led up to and allowed for all of these wire taps as quoted and used as facts of the matter in just this one warrant. More specifically was the stated probable cause used in obtaining those warrants ever met or consistent with the facts as portrayed in this warrant? Makes me think all the way back to the unseen nor explained warrant used to raid and seize GrowGreenMI's financial records earlier this year. Anyone ever figure that one out? What are the chances some of these (27) folks were customers there? I don't think it is unreasonable as medicinal marijuana patients and/or caregivers to demand transparency and justification here with all of these warrants signed just this year. Time to start answering some questions, but we need to ask if not demand it.

My thought and hope here is that these patients suing the state for impeding access in this civil matter will expose an indefensible story line on record that will rock this machine to it's very core.

27 arrested in five county marijuana bust

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