1st grow with BCNL producer... God bud!

stillcantroll

Active Member
Hahahaha dude, its not dry yet!! Give it a few days!!

I didn't weight the trim before i made it into hash, but there was about 1/3 of a large black garbage bag of good trim. I went through and got rid of fan leaves and stems to improve the hash quality, and that what was less.

I'll weigh the final product and the hash in the next few days... and my next clones are in, stay tuned! Pink kush baby!
 

Bigbux

Active Member
Oh cool. How much hash did you get? What size screens do u use and how many days did you veg and flower?
 

stillcantroll

Active Member
Oh cool. How much hash did you get? What size screens do u use and how many days did you veg and flower?
I used a 220 micron work bag (obviously), then a 160, a 73, and a 24 (those aren't exactly right, going by memory). I haven't weighed it yet, as I haven't finished using the second batch of shake, i'll keep you posted.

It took me 3 weeks in veg just to get my girls to around 13 inches, and then they only grew about another 4 in flower because of genetics, and my failures. I basically completely wasted a week in veg by nute burning and overwatering the living hell out of them, as it took me a week to get them green and growing again. I easily could have trimmed a week, maybe a week and a half off of the process in hindsight. I gave them nutes all the way up until the end of week 7, then flushed for week 8, and then 3 days of shock ripening after that for a total of 59 days in flowering and 21 days in veg. Next time around, depending on success, I'm simply going to start flushing at week 7, as week 7 is such a low PPM week anyways. Most of the bulk is on the flowers at the end of week 6 anyways. I want a very smooth, clean burning product for my medicine. I noticed that the plant I chopped early, with only 2 days in flushing, burnt very poorly, and left a thick black ash. This stuff I'm hoping won't do that, and my next batch won't have a chance in hell doing that.

The goal for me, and I'm sure Ancap and other BCNL users is to eliminate veg time all together in these boxes, and to make our grows as efficient as possible (6-6.5 a year). I'm achieving this with a closet station in the next grow. Anyways, good luck! I'll weigh the batch in a few days, and start a journal for my next grow in the next week or so.
 

Bigbux

Active Member
Cool thx for the info. I'm getting scared about mine touching the glass. I vegged for 17 days and the heights were 4.5" to 10.5". Now on day 27,flower day 11, and heights range from 18" to 22"! I've seen them grow as much as 2" a day! So I'm about to try this product called Bushmaster. A lot of people say they've had great success stopping vertical growth with it. Have you ever heard of that or have any other suggestions?
 

stillcantroll

Active Member
Cool thx for the info. I'm getting scared about mine touching the glass. I vegged for 17 days and the heights were 4.5" to 10.5". Now on day 27,flower day 11, and heights range from 18" to 22"! I've seen them grow as much as 2" a day! So I'm about to try this product called Bushmaster. A lot of people say they've had great success stopping vertical growth with it. Have you ever heard of that or have any other suggestions?
I don't have any experience whatsoever with bushmaster, but I have read that it does what it advertises. This probably goes without saying, but if you have co2 running, turn it off (lol). You still have another 10 days of verticle growth approximately in flower so, try bushmaster, and if it doesn't work, get ready to tie down some colas, and do some more trimming than you thought you'd have to. These things happen. You flowered on the conservative side of the height equation, hindsight is 20/20 I guess, next time you'll be able to shave a week off your veg times if using the same strain. Good luck man, let me know if they slow down. You might get lucky and have them end up just being perfect.
 

stillcantroll

Active Member
Total try weight was 7.5 ounces, right under the half pound mark I was hoping for. Also, ended up with about 12 grams of good, full melt hash. Very potent stuff, some of my friends had to shift some plans around after helping me sample. Very happy with the quality, now to work on the yield... :D
 

Bigbux

Active Member
Awesome! What factors do you think contributed to lower yield? Did you use co2? Do you have 400s or 430s in there?
 

Bigbux

Active Member
Actually I just rent back in this thread and remembered u had those early issues with roots and what-not. Anything else you think could have done to make that a pound or pound and a half harvest?
 

stillcantroll

Active Member
Actually I just rent back in this thread and remembered u had those early issues with roots and what-not. Anything else you think could have done to make that a pound or pound and a half harvest?
I want you to know I spent 20 minutes typing up a very long and detailed response to this question, as a closing summary to my growing experience, and i accidentally closed my browser window. I'm shaking with anger as I retype this, but here it goes.

Firstly, to answer your questions above, I use whatever HPS bulbs come standard with the box, i believe they are 400s, and i don't believe an extra 60 watts would make any difference in that spectrum. Id rather see more blue spectrum light if anything for the resin production, plenty of red in there already. The CFLS and t5's add os much redundant light anyways. It's really more of an exposure issue, which is the growers responsibility by clipping and pruning.

Yes I did use co2, but I had it on 5 psi as per BCNL's instructions, which caused it to run out at the end of week 5 (i started using it at the beginning of week 3). So, only on for 3 weeks... unacceptable. I don't want to use another tank, and I don't want to carry around a 40lb monster, so I'll be dialing it back to 4 PSI to see how things go next run. I would prefer ot have co2 going the entire grow up until the last 2 weeks, but in my opinion, it's only really truely indispensable in weeks 3 till about weeks 7 when bud production is booming.... that's when it's really needed.

I'm going to start listing some of the things that I would have done differently, and will be doing differently in my next run. Pardon the rant, and stop reading when you get bored. here goes nothing:

-Using 2ml/gal of 35% hydrox instead of 8ml/gal, and letting it sit for 20 minutes in my water before adding nutes ( the extra burnt my roots and led me to trying organics).
-Staying completely away from the above mentioned organics (sensizym, piranha, and voodoo juice) and just using hydrox. The organics provided an immediate noticible result, but caused my roots to stagnate and stop growing for almost 3 weeks straight. As soon as I went back to hydrox, there was new root growth the SAME DAY, and my res, roots and airstones were crystal clear again... wonderful.
-Using a proper material for lightproofing my machine to prevent algae (these lids are NOT lightproof, trust me).
-Manually watering my new 1 inch clones in the producer, and pH balancing right before watering. I completely lost a whole week of veg by overwatering my clones. They went yellow and didn't grow at all until I flushed, and basically hit the reset button.
-Being much more patient with my pH adjustments, and doing it twice a day for the first 3 days after a res change, and once a day after that (pH becomes more stable as the solution ages)
-Using the daily maintenance regiment I have developed from day one (writing down PPM for that week after mixing nutes, then adding water every day to match that PPM, then pH balance, then drop bottles in and close the doors)
-Using co2 and 4 psi rather than 5
-Vegging long enough to let my plants fill the box (totally hindsight, no way of knowing this)
-pruning and clipping to keep 3-4 branches instead of 8-10
-manually checking the plants at the back of the box for mold/mildew/dead plant matter instead of being lazy and only admiring the girls at the front
-doing 3-4 small flushes during the grow to prevent salt buildups, which killed one of my plants (5 days of nutes, followed by 2 days of hydrox+plain water 3-4 times during grow).
-Keeping 4 or so extra clones in 3 inch rockwool in a closet station in case some of the clones in your box don't root (2 of mine didn't)
-Adding another 4 airstones, for a total of 8 (which ive already done, and are using in my next grow... journal coming soon!)
-Using frozen bottles from the beginning (i might not have to do this anymore because of the extra dissolved oxygen from the extra 4 stones... another thing to test)
-Shaking my nutrients before using, and not cross-contaminating them!!! (DUHHHH)
-Not leaving my fucking valve open and letting my nutes spill all over the fucking floor
-Use CFL for all stages of flower for extra resin production
-Keeping a cleaner overall box by removing dead plant matter
-using a shop vac to clean res (started doing this at week 4 or so, should have bought it sooner)
-Using an air conditioner (again, started this too late)
-Used much less nutes, than slowly dial up to your plants needs. I have to say, this is the best approach in my experience for any grower using an unfamiliar strain. These strains have different appetites and different stages for nutrients, and the old mantra LESS IS MORE holds truer here than anywhere else. Your plants won't die from a lighter nute regiment, but they certainly will if given too much. I'll be heiring on the side of less, than climbing more slowly.
-Using 50 litres of water instead of BCNL's 34 to keep PPM and pH more stable (use same nute schedule, however, always go on the light side)

That's about all I can think of right now, but there is more and i'll edit them in as they come to me. I want to add a few things. First off, a lb per harvest i think is completely doable, and easily exceeded with a bit of experience, but almost impossible with anything other than clones. In my opinion, using clones really saved me this run. Even rates of growth, uniform ripening and a nice even canopy are paramount to a successful box grow in my view, and you won't ever get that with seeds.

I did meet my 0.5z a plant goal for this troubled run, which I am extremely happy with considering what you read above, and it helps put a couple things in perspective. Firstly, my plants were literally half the height they should have been (maybe even less than half), and each plant only resulted in 1-3 actually ripe branches. Both the height problems and the 6 or so underdeveloped branches on each plant were totally my fault. So, Imagine a cola that was twice as long, thicker, and double the healthy branching (all of these are quite easy to expect in a healthy grow). 0.5 that i produce could easily, and i mean easily, become 1 oz or more per plant. 1 oz per plant is already a pound and 2 ounces per harvest. So, I totally and completely think 2lbs is doable, but only by an experienced grower whos got one single SOG friendly box strain dailed in nice and tight, and I aim to do that in the next year or so. Hope this answered your question. Any questions or criticisms are welcome, i'm trying to learn as much as I can.
 

Bigbux

Active Member
That was great! I do have to say that I use Voodoo Juice and I love it, but it may have been the other products you mentioned that caused more problems. So they were what 24" when you cut 'em?
 

stillcantroll

Active Member
That was great! I do have to say that I use Voodoo Juice and I love it, but it may have been the other products you mentioned that caused more problems. So they were what 24" when you cut 'em?
Hahaha I wish they were 24. Try 17, some of them less. I really screwed up the height. They just fucking stood in place after the organics hit them. I seriously got 3-4 inches in flower, thats it. Really messed that up.

Voodoo juice I will stand by as the only one of their organics line with any success that I've personally used, but it's so damned expensive. And as i've said to other people asking about it, it prevents you from running a sterile hydroponic environment. The juice got me huge roots, but then as soon as I stopped using it (as per the instructions) roots came to a screeching halt, and hte end result was I had a nice thick ball at the base of the pots, but very little submerged in the water itself where I needed it. I have a half bottle left, so as per a suggestion by a BCNL rep, I might try using 2 weeks of voodoo at the beginning of veg then hydrox for the rest of the run, and contrast it to just using hydrox all the way through.

In any case, I don't find the benefits to be worth the money in my view. Good white healthy roots come from proper plant environment (good oxygen levels, nitrogen levels, etc). Plenty of guys on here get 3-4 foot long root strands using nothing at all, so I know im doing something wrong. I mean $80 a bottle?!?! Fuckin hell, highway robbery.
 

Bigbux

Active Member
Yeah 60 for a half litre here! It's so tough to say when you're using like 10 different products(grow a & b, bloom a & b, voodoo, b52, big bud, bud blood, humboltd roots, etc) which product is doing what or if any of 'em are doing anything! A half lb. when they were 17" or less is pretty good I think. Very encouraging. I'm on Flower day 14, 30 overall and I need to trim but I don't know what I'm looking or. People(including you I think) have told me to keep 3 to 4 branches plus main cola and wait till week 3 so I know which ones have bud or look like they will. It looks like a SOG with 50 plants in there cuz 3 or 4 branches per plant have shot up just as high as the main cola. So should I just keep all of those and clip the rest? And keep ALL fan leaves?
 

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stillcantroll

Active Member
Yeah 60 for a half litre here! It's so tough to say when you're using like 10 different products(grow a & b, bloom a & b, voodoo, b52, big bud, bud blood, humboltd roots, etc) which product is doing what or if any of 'em are doing anything! A half lb. when they were 17" or less is pretty good I think. Very encouraging. I'm on Flower day 14, 30 overall and I need to trim but I don't know what I'm looking or. People(including you I think) have told me to keep 3 to 4 branches plus main cola and wait till week 3 so I know which ones have bud or look like they will. It looks like a SOG with 50 plants in there cuz 3 or 4 branches per plant have shot up just as high as the main cola. So should I just keep all of those and clip the rest? And keep ALL fan leaves?
Try to do your best to maintain as many fan leaves as you can, they are friggin solar panels for your plants. The only fan leaves I would consider removing are ones that have absolutely no hope of getting light, in which case I would probably still leave them, as they aren't blocking light in that case from anything else. Basically, you have a small area of space between each of your plants. You have to get in there, look at the branches that occupy that space, and ask yourself: Does this branch have good flower sights? Is this branch getting light? If the answer to either of these is no, cut it off. To be honest, it's better still to go on the side of 1 or 2 branches than on the side of 6-7. If you start clipping between the plants youll notice things start opening up, it's very encouraging. Just get in there and start going man, don't be afraid of them they won't bite :) Worst case scenario is you clip too many and your colas get fatter... boo hoo :P

And by the way, are you using T5 lights in there? I don't see them.
 

Bigbux

Active Member
No I'm not using t5s. I was told I could find tubes at Home Depot with the little wire connectors and a small ballast I could put anywhere for like $25. I didn't go with the $110 BCNL T5s becuase I always figured I could find some for cheaper. So I've found tubes, but no real things to connect them to besides the fixtures which obviously won't fit in there. I have only looked at hydro stores so far, but I will look at Home Depot and Lowe's soon. The other thing is people were debating whether the T5s were even helping on Ancap's thread I believe.
 

Bigbux

Active Member
So wait 'til week 3 flower still? And, btw, when people say week 3 that would be day 15 to 21 right? I always get confused cuz I write down what day but not what week.
 

stillcantroll

Active Member
No I'm not using t5s. I was told I could find tubes at Home Depot with the little wire connectors and a small ballast I could put anywhere for like $25. I didn't go with the $110 BCNL T5s becuase I always figured I could find some for cheaper. So I've found tubes, but no real things to connect them to besides the fixtures which obviously won't fit in there. I have only looked at hydro stores so far, but I will look at Home Depot and Lowe's soon. The other thing is people were debating whether the T5s were even helping on Ancap's thread I believe.
I understand. I'm still on the fence myself to be quite honest, but what I have noticed is having the t5's there early in flower really helped develop flower sites all down the stem to the base of the plant. Maybe genetics, maybe existing light, maybe not. Even if its not a good stand alone light, its a full spectrum lamp, and my plants were sticky as all hell... I think the t5's had something to do with it. I don't mind keeping them in there as they don't add much to the hydro or the heat so, whatever.

Yea, that's correct. I would wait right until the end of week three (IE day 21) and go in there and chop. I know other guys that start chopping branches at the end of veg or right at the beginning of flower to keep an eye on it, but if theyre still vegging the branching can come back. The best practice ive seen is to do one good sweep at day 21 of flower, and that should pretty much do it. You can keep an eye on it from that point on. This is what I'll personally be doing from this day forward. It'll probably take you a good hour, and make sure you wear gloves and change your clothes before doing it, as your plants will be exposed to you for a long time, and you don't to bring any mites or anything in there. If you're having a tough time getting to the backside of any of the plants, unplug the drip emitters and rotate them a little so you can get at the branching. Turn them back the same way as to not break any of the tangled root matter underneath. Good luck man, post some pics after theyre all chopped up, would love to see a before and after.
 

Bigbux

Active Member
Does anyone have issues with ph climbing up rapidly? I got my nute mix to 5.5, changed rez, and 30 minutes later it was up to 6.2. So I got it down to 5.7ish and hours later it had climbed to 6.8!! I've been dealing with this for a while but now it's worse than ever. I've used half a litre of TechnaFlora's pH Down in 25 to 30 days. I'm also wondering if too much ph Down is bad for roots and/or nute solution. What everyone else think?
 
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