LED Without LEDs -My First T5 Grow

[pedro420]

Ive read this thread a few times. No one has grow With reg bulbs then upgraded?

I could say that I have

I had 2 autos under my fixture with 3 vegging girls they were under just reg grow/bloom now the 3 girls that are left are under par lights

2 flora sun / 1 Coralwave 1- 3000k
( I know that's not enough to flower all 3 but it's wat I got so I'm working with it and it is working good enough fr me for now untill I move)

But there was a big difference in just one day one of the girls leafs went from kinda saggy to almost strieght up and there has been tighter nodes and a lot healthier looking leafs

Am haveing a bit of a p-k def but we are working threw it getting back on track things got kinda screwed up for a bit

 

[Undercover Cop]

Ive read this thread a few times. No one has grow With reg bulbs then upgraded?

I started with just plain ol' 6500k grow bulbs and had good results. I added a BlueWave and ReefWave and saw much tighter internode spacing although possibly slightly slower growth. I swapped out those generic tri-band 6500k's that only peak at 610nm, for FloraSuns that have PAR red 630-660nm. I now have the tight node spacing but have a quicker growth rate since they're getting lots of both PAR RED and BLUE with a little bit of green/yellow/orange too. During Veg I keep them Blue dominant but always make sure to provide good Red and the other supplementals. The opposite goes for Flower, Red Dominant while still providing blue (which isnt hard since almost every bulb has a healthy dose of blue anyway)

Trust me and the whole point of the thread, you will see a difference in performance with the right bulb selection ...and it wont cost you $20 a bulb... except for RedSuns, sorry

WavePoint BlueWave + CoralWave, ZooMed FloraSun, AquaticLife Roseate, CoralLife ColorMax will all run about 8-10$ All will hold their own and will work into most custom PAR spectrums.
In My Ever So Humble Opinion...

 

[Undercover Cop]

I emailed Kevin from WavePoint about the UltraGrowth Waves. He said "We are going to release the ultra growth wave however we are in final test, verifying that the bulbs will hold up as you may know many of the red bulbs do not hold color. I hope to have some production bulbs ready in about 4-6 weeks....Kevin Shiotani"

If UVL is making a "660", I would be willing to bet it would be a tri-band bulb due to costs, and if so I'd be willing to pay half the price to get the same bulb as the UltraGrowth (which is pretty much the same as a FloraSun really when you compare SPD's, but I'd still be willing to get a few UltraGrowths just to compare and hope for more of a deeper red from them)
But if UVL is making a DeepRedSun or a pure 660 tube like the RedSuns 630........then that changes everything...

 

[PetFlora]

First to anyone who cannot afford $15-25 bulbs...

Both Quantums are pretty good, with the nod to the Grow bulb. However, the Flower bulb needs help in the Red Zone (especially when growing Indica dom), but that can be covered with adding a Coral Wave + Red Life + FloraSun and/or a 660. So if you don't own Quantum Flower (I have then buy CW + RL + FS. Hell, the FS alone should provide a damn nice harvest both quality AND quantity

UC: Good 411 on the Ultra Wave. Did he actually say deep reds are harder to keep inside the bulb? If so, then that could be the issue with the Red Lifes, too.

According to my conversations early on with UVL, the new bulb is a specific 660nm, and consequently is going to cost more ($24.95). I asked him about a bulb that covered 650-740. He said it would be too expensive, which could be mfg speak for maybe later, as the focus is on the 660

Bulb Placement

Due to much darker green leafs on one side, I repositioned the other 3 bulbs. (Plants are still small enough to not need 8 bulbs).

Even though heat is not an issue, I am raising the BB fixture to ~ 5" above the canopy. The top of my pod is covered with Al foil + side reflection SHOULD help in homogenizing the various spectra

Current Veg

1/6 UVL AquaSuns- Mostly B/G: soon to be replaced with Red Lifes (could show up by tomorrow)
2/5 Coral Waves- veg & flower UVb + IR: What the Fiji should have been
3/4 Quantum Grow- Excellent inexp bulb- better for Sats. Soon to be replaced with FloraSuns (better for Indica dom). I should do this now, but waiting for 3 plants to darken a bit.

Happy growin

 

[PetFlora]

I could say that I have

I had 2 autos under my fixture with 3 vegging girls they were under just reg grow/bloom now the 3 girls that are left are under par lights

2 flora sun / 1 Coralwave 1- 3000k
( I know that's not enough to flower all 3 but it's wat I got so I'm working with it and it is working good enough fr me for now untill I move)

But there was a big difference in just one day one of the girls leafs went from kinda saggy to almost strieght up and there has been tighter nodes and a lot healthier looking leafs

Am having a bit of a p-k def but we are working threw it getting back on track things got kinda screwed up for a bit

and he got really good results too! My frst grow was using only Quantum G/F bulbs. I had excellent growth, but due to heat stress in my HPA pod, all plants became male, so I pulled them. Before starting again I came across Pr0fs thread

 

[hyroot]

Hola banditos. Im baa-aack. 9 days away from chop chop. bubba kush yaaaaaaaa.

Im putting 16 bulb up now so 24 bulb total

8 bulb - 2 fiji, 1 coral wave, 3 redsun, 2 flora sun. I swapped a redsun back in. They like it.
16 bulb - 2 coral wave, 7 flora sun, 7 redsun. This combo rocks. I almost want ro swap in 2 fiji. I will post some pics just before wood chop wood chop chop and after.

Keep it real

Happy yard work

 

[cjd]

A couple quick questions for everyone. Has anyone used the Evergreen light? Would there be much interest in an American made "Badboy" design with options. Options like a choice of reflectors and ballasts and higher quality?

 

[AltarNation]

I emailed Kevin from WavePoint about the UltraGrowth Waves. He said "We are going to release the ultra growth wave however we are in final test, verifying that the bulbs will hold up as you may know many of the red bulbs do not hold color. I hope to have some production bulbs ready in about 4-6 weeks....Kevin Shiotani"

If UVL is making a "660", I would be willing to bet it would be a tri-band bulb due to costs, and if so I'd be willing to pay half the price to get the same bulb as the UltraGrowth (which is pretty much the same as a FloraSun really when you compare SPD's, but I'd still be willing to get a few UltraGrowths just to compare and hope for more of a deeper red from them)
But if UVL is making a DeepRedSun or a pure 660 tube like the RedSuns 630........then that changes everything...

*crossing fingers*

 

[jsamuel24]

Hows it going everyone here at RIU.

Last veg photos are in. I think I have my Nute problem taken care of and have started to add Earth Juice individual nutes to prep for flowering change. As allways any advice would be appreciated. Have started to prune under the cannopy, but held off till I can get to the hydro store to get some rockwool and rooting agent. Too many stems are in great shape but need another 2 weeks or so to hit the cannopy, so figure i should keep this fire og around. I think its still a little low in N, and since I changed to PAR lighting I have noticed that the plants drink the N out of the soil like a life long alcoholic in the middle of the Jack Daniels Distelery that is unguarded. Any imput on this grow would be greatly appreciated. I dont think its going too bad for a second grow from a person who had never kept a plant alive for a full life cycle until last grow. In the past I have had the worst green thumb ever. Hoping that changed alot. As for the plant that went outside, she is doing well and is recovering from her spider mite fiasco. Just going to leave her out there for the year and hope, but I dont think she is going to really do much at all.

 

[pedro420]

and he got really good results too! My frst grow was using only Quantum G/F bulbs. I had excellent growth, but due to heat stress in my HPA pod, all plants became male, so I pulled them. Before starting again I came across Pr0fs thread

Like -----^^^

Thanks I thought they did pretty good for being my second grow indoors and haveing heat issues almost there entire lyfe

I'm hopeing the remaining girls do a lil better thangs autos

The auto was a realy cool experament tho it was interesting to watch

 

[kpmarine]

A couple quick questions for everyone. Has anyone used the Evergreen light? Would there be much interest in an American made "Badboy" design with options. Options like a choice of reflectors and ballasts and higher quality?

What kind reflector and ballast choices were you thinking? What quality improvements? The judicious use of 2 pc fans would make a bad boy run as cold as it could, or so it would seem. That's the only improvement I can think of.

 

[cjd]

What kind reflector and ballast choices were you thinking? What quality improvements? The judicious use of 2 pc fans would make a bad boy run as cold as it could, or so it would seem. That's the only improvement I can think of.

The fan was something I was working with a company to either install a fan or make it like a "cool tube". Honestly I am leaning more to the "cool tube" idea. As for the ballasts it would be a choice of a basic unit or a high end electronic unit. The reflectors could be available in wide, medium and narrow it would depend on how you would want to blend your light. It would also be aluminum but not collapsible. There seems to be some complaints about the Badboy's construction and it seems that the folding is a weak point. Lastly it would be made in the US and if it goes as it should CHEAPER in the equlivent configuration as the current Badboy.. Right now I am seeing if there is much if any interest in it before I invest any cash.

 

[AltarNation]

Hey man. I like the idea of cool tube setups because these things do put a decent amount of heat off... the problem is, plexiglass in front of lights that already have relatively weak penetration power... not really comfortable losing anything to the glass shield.

I am pretty interested in the premise of figuring out a way to vent out the heat without shielding the bulbs, though. I have built a DIY solution by halfing a section of 6" ducting and laying it across the ballast box, taping it down along the sides, and having a 6" duct coming out of the middle of that halfed piece. It pulls a ton of heat directly off the fixture, and even pulls some from between the ballast box and the reflectors, so it does vent some heat right off the bulbs as well.

If you could figure out a way to engineer a solution along those lines, while still keeping the bulbs bare, I would be very interested in buying some.

P.S. There is a picture from my gallery incase you don't get what I'm describing... no patents on this, just DIYing for fun. Would be glad to see someone apply the logic, so consider it a freebie idea.

Can't figure out how to access my own damn gallery... heh. Here, I'll reupload a couple shots:

 

[Undercover Cop]

Welcome back Hyroot!

PF, that was an exact quote from Kevin at wavepoint. I'm sure they prob have some that theyre running a few more months to make sure they'll last their full rated lifespan. Ive not had the problem myself with RedSuns (mine just pooped out within a week) but Ive heard that they like to fade to a more orangeish color long before their rated life is up (if they don't fail outright, that is)

Id still love to see the SPD (or planned spd) for the new 660. Just to see how wide the spike is. RedSuns cover something like 622-640 or so, Itd be nice to have a really wide peak for the 660s. A peak from 625-670 would be Tits AND Ass. That bulb would replace RedSuns all together IMO.

 

[AltarNation]

Id still love to see the SPD (or planned spd) for the new 660. Just to see how wide the spike is. RedSuns cover something like 622-640 or so, Itd be nice to have a really wide peak for the 660s. A peak from 625-670 would be Tits AND Ass. That bulb would replace RedSuns all together IMO.

*crossing fingers*

 

[kpmarine]

The fan was something I was working with a company to either install a fan or make it like a "cool tube". Honestly I am leaning more to the "cool tube" idea. As for the ballasts it would be a choice of a basic unit or a high end electronic unit. The reflectors could be available in wide, medium and narrow it would depend on how you would want to blend your light. It would also be aluminum but not collapsible. There seems to be some complaints about the Badboy's construction and it seems that the folding is a weak point. Lastly it would be made in the US and if it goes as it should CHEAPER in the equlivent configuration as the current Badboy.. Right now I am seeing if there is much if any interest in it before I invest any cash.

If you could make it better, cheaper, and customisable; people will buy it. If the cooltube design goes over the bulbs, I have the same concerns as AN. However, if you can pull all of this off with your fixtures. I would totally buy some when I expand.

 

[kpmarine]

Speaking of T5 related business ventures, anybody heard from the Prof lately?

 

[cjd]

AN,
It was your idea that brought me to the vent!

 

[AltarNation]

AN,
It was your idea that brought me to the vent!

Cool man, I am glad to be an inspiration! Have you got any ideas about how to implement it smoothly without covering the bulbs and without a bunch of taped-on ducting? hehe. It works really well as is, but sure would like something more compact and permanent.

 

[cjd]

The cooling of the bulb is the problem I totally agree with both you and AN. I really don't know if much can be done with that unless the bulb could be pushed a little harder. Then you have to compare the benefits of a little less heat to the overall cost and lifespan of the set up. Can it be done? Yes it can, but with what draw backs, final cost is the major one. What I have been asking myself is, how perfect of a set up can we realistically and economically expect.