The Ruiners' Hypothetical Questions to 19 Supporters

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fdd2blk

Well-Known Member
Johnny Retro said:
Ok leme rephrase.
Drug dealers and house wives scared for their children
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are you going to answer the question in the first post? or did you simply come here to insult people?




The Ruiner said:
Since there is so much debate over the 5x5 and cultivation in general, and the (possible) overlap between that part of the bill and the CUA/MMP, if 19 passes, will people still be able to get doctors rec's and, by what everyone is saying, cultivate however much they want, without restrictions in regards to growing space? Therefore, in order to be part of the action in commerce, ordinary people will simply need to get a doctors rec to grow, and distribute as much as they possibly can to dispensaries and other patients, and quite possibly to the "black market" ? What would be the point of passing all new legislation that can be so easily cast aside? What good does 19 do the state, if all it takes to avoid what will more than likely be thousands of dollars in taxes annually is a $35 doctors rec? Wouldn't that just be, as supporters of the bill have put it "more of the same"? Also, how could the commercial interests backing 19 benefit from making it legal for the entire 21 and over population of the state to possess cannabis if they cant possibly compete with a market that has way more advantages in regards to abundant supply and more relaxed regulations? On the flip side of this coin, what will be the motivation for the "casual smoker" to patronize the commercial establishments, with their elevated overhead and strict regulatory scrutiny which will more than likely spell higher prices, versus just getting the doctors rec and going medical?

It just doesnt make sense to me that people with millions riding on the passage and eventual commercial sales of MJ to leave a less regulated and more than likely less expensive competitor. It doesnt make sense to make things harder on yourself, and to pay millions of dollars to do it. It just doesn't make sense for 19 to leave 215 intact if EVERYTHING that is being SAID about 215 being left intact is true.

I would really appreciate someone who fancies themselves as well-versed in 19 to respond.
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Johnny Retro

Johnny Retro

Well-Known Member
No insults here, just think its ridiculous stoners are against a legalization bill.
Kinda fucked up in my eyes and throughout usa, i say this from personal experience. ;)
You guys are making fools of yoursleves
:clap:
 
Johnny Retro

Johnny Retro

Well-Known Member
Ill give you a couple answers
1)What good does 19 do the state, if all it takes to avoid what will more than likely be thousands of dollars in taxes annually is a $35 doctors rec?
Answer- SOME people dont like playin the system. Not all people have the will to lie to a doctor just to smoke weed. And the good it does to the state? well obviously taxes
2)Also, how could the commercial interests backing 19 benefit from making it legal for the entire 21 and over population of the state to possess cannabis if they cant possibly compete with a market that has way more advantages in regards to abundant supply and more relaxed regulations?
Answer- Where are the more relaxed regulation? If someone dosent have a card is the law relaxed?
And how do you know the market for marijuana thrives when theres an abundant supply, thats just a ridiculous claim.


Your basing your opinion off of being a card holder. Look at it from the other side....
 
The Ruiner

The Ruiner

Well-Known Member
Johnny...

I am asking the hardcore supporters of 19 to come here and give me the answers I need. As the emissaries of the legislation, I would expect them to have the knowledge necessary to fully address my questions. If you feel that this is important to you in Chicago, just imagine what this means to everyone here in CA... These arent just knee-jerk reactions towards 19, its serious for all of us.
 
Johnny Retro

Johnny Retro

Well-Known Member
Good luck with your findings, it wont go very far on this fourm.

And im trying to get you to give me the REAL reasons why you dont want prop 19 passed.
From an average, non card holding, daily smoker, it seems ridiculous that you guys dont want this passed and i cant even get a real answer!
 
Johnny Retro

Johnny Retro

Well-Known Member
Not all, just gota downsize to 25sq feet.
Ok, i would have to admit, if i was growing the amounts you were i would HATE this bill. But even you said it yourself, you have trouble gettin rid of it all
 
F

fdd2blk

Well-Known Member
Johnny Retro said:
Not all, just gota downsize to 25sq feet.
Ok, i would have to admit, if i was growing the amounts you were i would HATE this bill. But even you said it yourself, you have trouble gettin rid of it all
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as a medical patient i need a little more than 25sq feet.

i have trouble getting rid of b grade. top shelf disappears overnight. ;)

unless you are involved in it all it's really hard to understand. most people can't even fathom a tiny garden such as mine. let alone understand the impact this may have on us all.


i quit my job because i needed to keep up on my garden. it over grew me. i never started growing to make money. i am a gardener before i am a seller. i only sell it so it doesn't rot on the shelf. if i could find the time to work for money while growing for free i would. but because i involve so much of my time growing i don't have time to keep a regular job. therefore i need to compensate my time to make my bills. just because someone grows and sells pot does not mean they are a "drug dealer". i have poured my heart into this plant for over 20 years now. i'm not about to hand it all over to TAXES and REGULATION. i'd rather stand my ground and fight my fight and rot in fucking prison then to give in to this nonsense.
 
The Ruiner

The Ruiner

Well-Known Member
Johnny Retro said:
Good luck with your findings, it wont go very far on this fourm.

And im trying to get you to give me the REAL reasons why you dont want prop 19 passed.
From an average, non card holding, daily smoker, it seems ridiculous that you guys dont want this passed and i cant even get a real answer!
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Its very, very simple: 19 as it stands now is set to dismember prop 215 and mostly everyone with a script will be affected by this. I can tell you that most MMJ patients could care less if it were "legalized" but firstly, 19 isnt legalization and secondly 19 strips current patients of rights. If this bill had been written in a less ambigous and misleading manner most 215 patients would probably be rejoicing in the streets. But this "mainstream acceptance" is coming with a terrible price that, even if I wasn't medical, I would say is too high to pay. 15 years...
 
UncleBuck

UncleBuck

Well-Known Member
The Ruiner said:
Its very, very simple: 19 as it stands now is set to dismember prop 215 ... 19 strips current patients of rights.
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fdd2blk said:
i risk losing it all. :(
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not even close to being true!

7. Ensure that if a city decides not to tax and regulate the sale of cannabis, that buying and selling cannabis within that city’s limits remain illegal, but that the city’s citizens still have the right to possess and consume small amounts, except as permitted under Health and Safety Sections 11362.5 and 11362.7 through 11362.9.


8. Ensure that if a city decides it does want to tax and regulate the buying and selling of cannabis (to and from adults only), that a strictly controlled legal system is implemented to oversee and regulate cultivation, distribution, and sales, and that the city will have control over how and how much cannabis can be bought and sold, except as permitted under Health and Safety Sections 11362.5 and 11362.7 through 11362.9.
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UncleBuck

UncleBuck

Well-Known Member
Johnny Retro said:
Yea i was pretty sure i read that it had no affect on prop 215?
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you are correct. the verbiage you see above comes from the 'purposes' section of the bill. this is especially important because legislators and lawmakers rely on the purposes section to interpret the rest of the prop. considering that those two points, which make specific reference to 11362.5 (215), are preceded by this point:

6. Provide easier, safer access for patients who need cannabis for medical purposes.
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there have also been court cases, from what i understand, that prohibit california from imposing lower limits on medical patients that have prescriptions from their doctors for higher limits.

in any case, no matter how much evidence i point to, some people will just say the exact opposite without citation or evidence. none of that matters though, because this prop has been consistently up in the polls and will soon be passed.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/California_Proposition_19_(2010)#Polls
 
The Ruiner

The Ruiner

Well-Known Member
Johnny, UB,

Address the questions. Because I just took that argument you have come back with time and time again made it work against you. Address the actual thread, out of respect. I took the time to come up with those questions and I really want some answers. I will not debate the horrible composition of the bill with you.
 
valhalla88

valhalla88

Active Member
In a perfect world it wouldn't be political. As a outsider watching(California) it would appear that this proposition serves a purpose other then simply what they say. The attachments and verbiage would send one mad making sense of it all. It hurts my head. Decriminalization for 18 and up. Medical free pass to have and grow blah blah blah....
growers grow at own risk...thats how we get paid!
Real simple keep things the way they are for a minute before changing the method so fast...KNOWone should go to jail for pot..I mean I don't encourage kids to rip vape-bags b4 school either so obviously it goes back to the HOME and the PARENTS!...caps not shouting just um getting carried away...just my two hits worth ...
looking to California.
 
UncleBuck

UncleBuck

Well-Known Member
The Ruiner said:
Johnny, UB,

Address the questions. Because I just took that argument you have come back with time and time again made it work against you. Address the actual thread, out of respect. I took the time to come up with those questions and I really want some answers. I will not debate the horrible composition of the bill with you.
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i am not going to reply to your hypothetical speculation. i will correct you when you attempt assert that falsehoods are true or down is up.

just as you took the time to come up with those questions, i once took the time to masturbate. i didn't demand that everyone discuss the implications of my chosen actions or applaud out of respect.
 
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