Help Diagnose please

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rollituprandy

Member
Ok I have a question, can someone help me diagnose this please.
Light: SE7000 @ 40% power (around 700 PAR)
2 - 3 weeks into flower
Soil: Foxfarm ocean forest soil + earthworm castings + black soldier fly larvae
Nutrients: Gaia Greens dry amendments (4-4-4, 2-8-4, basalt rock dust, glacial rock dust), Supreme Growers Kelp Blast 0-0-10, unsulphured blackstrap molasses, rapidstart, great white mycorrhizae, (AN) voodo juice, (AN) piranha, (AN) tarantula, Foxfarm Organic Big Bloom
Temp: 74F (average)
rh: 50% (average)
VPD: 1.3 kPa (average)

New to dry amendments so I'm learning how they work best. I found I have to water them more often and keep the soil more moist than if using regular liquid nutes to keep the beneficial bacteria alive. Have a boogie plus filter and my ppm before adding anything is like 20ppm. i use the nutes to pH my water, so I use a couple one week and then the others the next week, so everything is being used 'every other week'. for example one week i throw in the voodoo, piranha, and tarantula, and the next week ill throw in rapidstart. since my pH out of the faucet is high it usually ends up being in the correct pH range when I add a few nutes, sometimes I have to add pH up. When I transplanted I added some b-52 and sensizyme. theyre in 10 gallon fabric pots. I use a soil moisture meter and water them when the top 2 inches get dry. theyre starting to drink a lot now. Like I said new to dry amendments so any help is appreciated. Just trying to keep on top of things because it seems with dry amendments fixing problems is not as immediate as adding inorganic nutes since the living soil needs time to break down the nutes and feed the plant.
 

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Sativied

Sativied

Well-Known Member
rollituprandy said:
Ok I have a question, can someone help me diagnose this please.
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Veinal chlorosis symptoms (yellow veins, opposed to more common interveinal chlorosis where the areas between veins yellow)

Which can have many different causes that can be hard to fix, and can be the aftermath of something that no longer needs a fix. Overcompacted/overwatered soil, overfeeding, root problems, iron deficiencies caused by lockout (not to fix with more iron) and nutrient imbalances. In combination with the burned tips this early on, and the abomination combination of nutrients you add and the keeping them moist part, and the educated guess you started adding 'flower' nutes recently, I'm guess it's all of the above. Veinal chlorosis means it partly shut down, usually because too much 'love' from the grower. Aside from that, they look pretty good and unless it spreads to more plants/leaves I'd just dial down the number of nutrient bags and bottles and live and learn. It's pretty much impossible to use so many different nutrients and reach an optimal balance for the plants and above all unnecessary.
 
R

rollituprandy

Member
Sativied said:
Veinal chlorosis symptoms (yellow veins, opposed to more common interveinal chlorosis where the areas between veins yellow)

Which can have many different causes that can be hard to fix, and can be the aftermath of something that no longer needs a fix. Overcompacted/overwatered soil, overfeeding, root problems, iron deficiencies caused by lockout (not to fix with more iron) and nutrient imbalances. In combination with the burned tips this early on, and the abomination combination of nutrients you add and the keeping them moist part, and the educated guess you started adding 'flower' nutes recently, I'm guess it's all of the above. Veinal chlorosis means it partly shut down, usually because too much 'love' from the grower. Aside from that, they look pretty good and unless it spreads to more plants/leaves I'd just dial down the number of nutrient bags and bottles and live and learn. It's pretty much impossible to use so many different nutrients and reach an optimal balance for the plants and above all unnecessary.
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Thanks for the response. Ill go in order,
- I dont think the soil is overcompacted or overwatered. I am someone who likes to water thoroughly and then let them fully dry out but have learned that I should keep them more moist if using dry amendments as the beneficial bacteria need a moist environment to break down the dry amendments into nutrients for the plant.
- It could be overfeeding but I am going by what the bag says: 3tbs/gallon of medium mixed into the Foxfarm Oceanforest soil when transplanting and fully mixing the soil, and then every 30 days 1tbs/gallon of medium as a topdressing. (I thought they cant get burned with dry amendments)
- One part im confused about though is im not adding extra "nutes". the voodoo and piranha and tarantala are all beneficial bacteria/colonizers. Contains bacillus and trichoderma etc.. They dont contain any NPK. The molasses is to feed the bennies. mychorrizae is the same. Im not stacking/adding multiple of the same nutrient lines. Im using gaia greens for the base macronutrients, NPK, their 4-4-4 and their 2-8-4. The rockdust is for the cal/mag. none of those contain myco so I add great white. during the first 2 weeks of flower the plant needs more P and K as its hormones change from vegetative growth to flowering fruit so I use 1 teaspoon of kelp blast per 2 gallons of water. Its a pretty mild dose.
Thanks in advance for your response.
 
R

rollituprandy

Member
Treesomewanted77 said:
Do you know anyone using this recipe of nutrients? Not sure why you’re giving so much stuff all over the map. All they need in that soil is a well balanced feed. You’re giving them whatever you want when you want by the sounds. You don’t need anything other than top dressing with more fox farms soil or use the dry amendments like the Gaia bloom feed.
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yes i see many people using NPK Cal/mag, myco, and molasses together. I also see them brew compost teas and add them. Can you explain what is over the map? Does it matter what brand a nutrient comes from? i figured this gives them a well balanced soil as it give sit everything it needs, NPK cal/mag, myco, carbohydrates the food for myco and bennies. you're saying i would topdress plants with foxfarm soil and not add dry amendments?
thanks in advance for your response
 
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Treesomewanted77

Well-Known Member
rollituprandy said:
yes i see many people using NPK Cal/mag, myco, and molasses together. I also see them brew compost teas and add them. Can you explain what is over the map? Does it matter what brand a nutrient comes from? i figured this gives them a well balanced soil as it give sit everything it needs, NPK cal/mag, myco, carbohydrates the food for myco and bennies. you're saying i would topdress plants with foxfarm soil and not add dry amendments?
thanks in advance for your response
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Yes all that is needed is the soil and the dry amendments. You can add fresh soil as a top dress to add food for the plants. I just think you’re adding a lot of stuff that is not needed. Keep it stupid simple is the best way. The plant don’t look bad at all so it’s not like you have a major issue but I would be so confused on adding all that stuff at different times.
 
driver77

driver77

Well-Known Member
Temps are a bit low for LED lighting....it's now suggested that raising temps to around 80f might help metabolism.
Looks like not your first grow though! :leaf:
 
R

rollituprandy

Member
Treesomewanted77 said:
Yes all that is needed is the soil and the dry amendments. You can add fresh soil as a top dress to add food for the plants. I just think you’re adding a lot of stuff that is not needed. Keep it stupid simple is the best way. The plant don’t look bad at all so it’s not like you have a major issue but I would be so confused on adding all that stuff at different times.
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Ya i get what youre saying how someone randomly naming off a ton of different products can seem confusing from an outside perspective, but for me I know my water pH and I've used different types of nutes on different grows in the same 2 gallon containers so I know that the 2mL/gal of rapidstart will bring my water from a pH of 9 to 6.5. i should have worded it better, though, when i say nutes i just mean anything im adding to water. the micronutrients/colonizers/bacteria that im adding are all the other stuff. Do you know if FFOF soil naturally contains myco? i didnt think it did so i added it. im basically trying to make living soil, which requires me to add the myco and baccilus etc... but i only do that once every 2 weeks to make sure the microbial diversity is at its highest. as i said im new to growing with dry amendments so im still trying to fine tune it.
 
R

rollituprandy

Member
HydoDan said:
Have you tried dry amendments without all the unecessary crap you've been adding??
They work surprising well by themselves.. KISS
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what is the unnecessary stuff? can you elaborate on that please. I dont think FFOF is a living soil, so i added all the bacteria and myco to it and some food.
 
driver77

driver77

Well-Known Member
rollituprandy said:
what is the unnecessary stuff? can you elaborate on that please. I dont think FFOF is a living soil, so i added all the bacteria and myco to it and some food.
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FFOF is a living soil and usually pretty hot. That said the last batch I got of it was full of wood chips and cold as hell, had to add nutes 1st week, where usually none needed till week 4 to 5.
 
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Treesomewanted77

Well-Known Member
driver77 said:
FFOF is a living soil and usually pretty hot. That said the last batch I got of it was full of wood chips and cold as hell, had to add nutes 1st week, where usually none needed till week 4 to 5.
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That’s one of the issues with bagged soil some are hot some are cold. Like the guy at the grow shop explained to me it’s mixed by humans so they may make mistakes and over fertilize some and some they may forget and not add enough so it’s a crap shoot. But almost all the bags of soils I’ve gotten have had bugs mainly fungus gnats.
 
flowrrpowrr

flowrrpowrr

Active Member
driver77 said:
FFOF is a living soil and usually pretty hot. That said the last batch I got of it was full of wood chips and cold as hell, had to add nutes 1st week, where usually none needed till week 4 to 5.
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Hey Driver. I use FFOF and understand what you're saying. How do you determine when you have a cold batch that early in your grow?
 
flowrrpowrr

flowrrpowrr

Active Member
driver77 said:
The cotyledon turned yellow 2nd day above ground. It was full of big wood chips, was dry and clumpy and plants leaves where light green too........usually nothing needed for an auto in first 4 to 5 weeks.
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Thanks..I've seen that too. I'm concerned about seedlings in FFOF showing stress almost immediately. Have you switched to anything you like more?
 
driver77

driver77

Well-Known Member
flowrrpowrr said:
Thanks..I've seen that too. I'm concerned about seedlings in FFOF showing stress almost immediately. Have you switched to anything you like more?
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FFHF lol.....HF is best for seedlings anyhow. I run top 3" HF only, then I usually run a 50/50 mix of HF and OF....bottom half is amended with Dr Earth..... Since the OF looked so shitty I used more like 70/30 with HF being the 70 in my current grow. I ordered just 1 bag of OF recently(bad batch was purchased in early December) and it looks great. So fingers crossed it was just a bad batch.
OF is really hot when it's a good batch. Some seedlings will be fine with it, others it will cook. I like HF or at the most a 50/50 mix of HF and OF for seedlings.
 
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