Pandemic 2020

[Five of diamonds]

150 qualified people like epidemiologists and doctors say a shut down is the only solution, for 8 weeks because asshole and asshole governors fucked everything up so bad and are now killing 1000 Americans a day.

But how does one manage a shutdown of 328 million people? And a true shut down? No one allowed out at all unless an emergency? Because if people are going to be able to go shopping etc. Then it won't be good enough in america because there are millions who won't follow guidelines. So if they are not allowed to leave their homes, then how do they get food and water? Delivery services? Then the virus would continue no? Being delivered here and there and infected people coming outside when they are not supposed to. And if they try and lock it down like that, let's say after the election and trump is out, then how will the tens of millions of anti left people react to being held down by a boot heel for their own good? We might not care in a sense what they think but we should care about what might happen no? You may have numbers on them, but there is still i would guess at least 50 million Americans (less than 1 in 6) who would NOT in any fashion go along with a science based solution put in place by a left leaning government. Hell most of them don't even believe in science!

Yes it needs to be slowed, I am not staying that it's a bad plan. It may be the only plan, a shut down. I am just talking about what that would look like in AMERICA specifically. It really would need to be for the full 4-8 weeks. Because if done half assed, the virus will just return after awhile and then once everybody is going back to normal, it will explode again.... it would seem.

 

[hillbill]

Sorry
1000 a day isn’t enough?

 

[Fogdog]

But how does one manage a shutdown of 328 million people? And a true shut down? No one allowed out at all unless an emergency? Because if people are going to be able to go shopping etc. Then it won't be good enough in america because there are millions who won't follow guidelines. So if they are not allowed to leave their homes, then how do they get food and water? Delivery services? Then the virus would continue no? Being delivered here and there and infected people coming outside when they are not supposed to. And if they try and lock it down like that, let's say after the election and trump is out, then how will the tens of millions of anti left people react to being held down by a boot heel for their own good? We might not care in a sense what they think but we should care about what might happen no? You may have numbers on them, but there is still i would guess at least 50 million Americans (less than 1 in 6) who would NOT in any fashion go along with a science based solution put in place by a left leaning government. Hell most of them don't even believe in science!

Yes it needs to be slowed, I am not staying that it's a bad plan. It may be the only plan, a shut down. I am just talking about what that would look like in AMERICA specifically. It really would need to be for the full 4-8 weeks. Because if done half assed, the virus will just return after awhile and then once everybody is going back to normal, it will explode again.... it would seem.

Are you still talking about this?

How are things going in your own country? Is it so great that you feel entitled to come here to help the virus kill off as many as possible?

 

[Budzbuddha]

Must be a “requirement” for new members to haunt and troll the politics section. Jus sayin.

 

[Queen2Green]

I agree on many points. I have a lot of doubts on things based on what I see people doing. Most people around me really are taking no precautions. Lots act like its all a joke. And seeing as I am actually trying not to bring it into the cancer patients I care for, I have come to realize how difficult it is to actually try and keep everything sanitized. Its damn near impossible. Everything touched has to be cleaned. After anyone or anything that isn't 100% for sure clean has touched it. I am successful in doing this but I think it's clear most people will NOT go through that much effort. I know they don't based on what I see. Usually the effort I see people trying to make is half assed, not nearly enough to make sure surfaces are clean or all possible contaminated objects get cleaned. And this is in a country that has done marginally well. We are spiking again now though, what a shock. Almost no mask wearing.

My point is it's impossible to get everyone to do it right. Its also borderline impossible to make everyone do something. America is such a torn country, the chances of them coming together to win, which is what would be needed, a healing if you will and working together, won't happen imo.

I still stand by my use of the numbers provided but concede to the idea that it's much worse and won't be getting better.

As I read your response I think to myself how that mirrors exactly what I was thinking when covid made it to US. If no one is taking it seriously where you are, it won't be long and your country will likely be in the same struggle we are. Take it seriously, regardless of whatever others are doing. Science matters. Every single thing I predicted would happen from Feb on has came true. America is a mess..

I agree with everything you said. People will not listen or come togather for the sake of winning via covid. We were much too divided before covid even got here, it's surely worse now and I'm not quite sure how America will overcome this at it's current standing. I feel are darkest days are ahead. Which is why on another thread on onother day, I said if Trump is re-elected I'm gone. I will not sit in this country after fighting to live to be taken out by idiots who won't use science and common sense to do what needs to be done for the best of all. I want to live.

I'm a cancer patient, so I get it. We can agree to disagree on the use of numbers

 

[Five of diamonds]

And this part I dont really know. The vaccines for covid 19.

Must be a “requirement” for new members to haunt and troll the politics section. Jus sayin.

How exactly am I haunting? I veiw this as talking and I am actually evolving myn opinion. Not worth the time i suppose.

 

[potroastV2]

Are you still talking about this?

How are things going in your own country? Is it so great that you feel entitled to come here to help the virus kill off as many as possible?

He's your neighbor, Man.

And he's posting from the same IP addy as Estaban Sebrador.

 

[Fogdog]

He's your neighbor, Man.

And he's posting from the same IP addy as Estaban Sebrador.

must be a cluster of ignorance in that household. I'd quarantine them.

Do you mean neighbor as in he's in Oregon? It does feel like a different country some days, what with the US government's occupation and all.

Edit: So, yeah, Canada. The US is paying a price for it's obnoxious "American Exceptionalism". Now that we are down, a whole lot of outsiders are enjoying the moment. Can't blame them, really.

 

[Five of diamonds]

Are you still talking about this?

How are things going in your own country? Is it so great that you feel entitled to come here to help the virus kill off as many as possible?

I feel entitled to discuss any topic and I dont view what I said as too out of line. At least I am considering things and agreeing to things and conceding to points.

I guess I should have remained in my previous state of mind and completely ignored the situation in america simply because I dont live there.

Things in my country are better than in America but they are getting worse again now that summer is upon us and most people are acting like its over. It will get bad again and a lot of the ground made will get taken back. Not to mention we are in extreme debt now, exteme.

 

[Five of diamonds]

He's your neighbor, Man.

And he's posting from the same IP addy as Estaban Sebrador.

I regretted heavily revealing my location so I dropped the account, seeing as how it was no loss being new. I greatly appreciate you revealing it again for me.

Most of what I was talking about was about my actual country of origin, not of where I live now. But in reality the situation here is not much different.

 

[Queen2Green]

But how does one manage a shutdown of 328 million people? And a true shut down? No one allowed out at all unless an emergency? Because if people are going to be able to go shopping etc. Then it won't be good enough in america because there are millions who won't follow guidelines. So if they are not allowed to leave their homes, then how do they get food and water? Delivery services? Then the virus would continue no? Being delivered here and there and infected people coming outside when they are not supposed to. And if they try and lock it down like that, let's say after the election and trump is out, then how will the tens of millions of anti left people react to being held down by a boot heel for their own good? We might not care in a sense what they think but we should care about what might happen no? You may have numbers on them, but there is still i would guess at least 50 million Americans (less than 1 in 6) who would NOT in any fashion go along with a science based solution put in place by a left leaning government. Hell most of them don't even believe in science!

Yes it needs to be slowed, I am not staying that it's a bad plan. It may be the only plan, a shut down. I am just talking about what that would look like in AMERICA specifically. It really would need to be for the full 4-8 weeks. Because if done half assed, the virus will just return after awhile and then once everybody is going back to normal, it will explode again.... it would seem.

There's never gonna be a "true" shutdown in that sense you're speaking of. It's impossible. The best we can do is close non essential businesses that attract groups of people, wear masks, and stay 6 feet apart. That will atleast slow the spread down to help relieve our hospital systems and allow for continued care of those who need it. Like I said before, if we don't slow this down now, we are gonna have a lot more deaths on our hands of people that don't even have covid.

You can live just fine without leaving your home, I've been doing it for 5 months. My backyard is my playground. I work from home. Groceries are delivered outside no contact. I've already online shopped for years. I use disinfectant on everything before it comes in the house. I am stupid careful, because I'm technically not even in remission yet. It can be done and it's not even that hard to do! The hardest part about it is missing contact with friends and family.

We know what will happen if everything is done half-assed, we already did that and 4-8 weeks is likely grossly underestimated. I'm curious to see what happens next. It honestly blows my mind that otherwise seemingly logical people can't wrap their brain around whats honestly happening. I don't even need science for that it's so obvious.

Must be a “requirement” for new members to haunt and troll the politics section. Jus sayin.

I've never been called a troll, thats a first. LOL. I will see myself out of your political section. I'm working anyways..

 

[potroastV2]

must be a cluster of ignorance in that household. I'd quarantine them.

Do you mean neighbor as in he's in Oregon? It does feel like a different country some days, what with the US government's occupation and all.

Edit: So, yeah, Canada. The US is paying a price for it's obnoxious "American Exceptionalism". Now that we are down, a whole lot of outsiders are enjoying the moment. Can't blame them, really.

No, sorry, I got him confused with someone else who is in Oregon.

 

[Fogdog]

I feel entitled to discuss any topic and I dont view what I said as too out of line. At least I am considering things and agreeing to things and conceding to points.

I guess I should have remained in my previous state of mind and completely ignored the situation in america simply because I dont live there.

Things in my country are better than in America but they are getting worse again now that summer is upon us and most people are acting like its over. It will get bad again and a lot of the ground made will get taken back. Not to mention we are in extreme debt now, exteme.

Sure, feel free, we enjoy repeating the same things over and over again. After all, we are becoming experts at failing to control an epidemic and we are so glad to share our failure with everybody who insists we should just let the virus rip.

The US is a mosaic of severity. Some states are doing pretty well, mine, for example, compared to, say, Georgia. Other states not good at all. As I see it the major difference is in people's behavior. Telltale signs of a community that is doing well are: proactive government that set up a rational system of testing, tracing, and isolating new case; high rates of people wearing masks, people following social distancing guidelines, people minimizing time spent in public spaces. Probably others but those are for starters.

When you say your country is doing well, how do you know? Does everybody get tested who wants to or is there a testing protocol? Does the government report simple statistics or do they use those numbers in models to provide a better estimate for how many get sick? How many are being tested and is that enough to provide an accurate assessment? How confident are you that the numbers are accurate and why?

I keep hearing from others the complaint on the price of responding to the virus. You might as well complain about the weather. The virus changed everything, including economic health of nations. It arrived with a minimum cost in lives and resources. From there, anything we do can only increase those costs but won't reduce them below that starting point. The worldwide cost of this epidemic started off at a horrendously high number and it's getting worse by the day. When I hear people complain about the cost, it sounds an awful lot like the things people say about the cost of education, healthcare and roads. I see those as investments and not costs.

 

[Fogdog]

No, sorry, I got him confused with someone else who is in Oregon.

That guy can't finish a sentence without making a false comparison.

 

[Queen2Green]

Sure, feel free, we enjoy repeating the same things over and over again. After all, we are becoming experts at failing to control an epidemic and we are so glad to share our failure with everybody who insists we should just let the virus rip.

The US is a mosaic of severity. Some states are doing pretty well, mine, for example, compared to, say, Georgia. Other states not good at all. As I see it the major difference is in people's behavior. Telltale signs of a community that is doing well are: proactive government that set up a rational system of testing, tracing, and isolating new case; high rates of people wearing masks, people following social distancing guidelines, people minimizing time spent in public spaces. Probably others but those are for starters.

When you say your country is doing well, how do you know? Does everybody get tested who wants to or is there a testing protocol? Does the government report simple statistics or do they use those numbers in models to provide a better estimate for how many get sick? How many are being tested and is that enough to provide an accurate assessment? How confident are you that the numbers are accurate and why?

I keep hearing from others the complaint on the price of responding to the virus. You might as well complain about the weather. The virus changed everything, including economic health of nations. It arrived with a minimum cost in lives and resources. From there, anything we do can only increase those costs but won't reduce them below that starting point. The worldwide cost of this epidemic started off at a horrendously high number and it's getting worse by the day. When I hear people complain about the cost, it sounds an awful lot like the things people say about the cost of education, healthcare and roads. I see those as investments and not costs.

This!!!!!!!!

 

[topcat]

Honestly its not that, I just love actual fishing.

How's the fishing in Purgatory? Not good, not bad? Since you don't live in the U.S., you can't be in Colorado.

 

[hillbill]

whoops?

 

[Fogdog]

This!!!!!!!!

let me pose a question to you.

Is capitalism failing? Does that economic system even work during an epidemic? I'm beginning to think that it doesn't.

 

[hanimmal]

But how does one manage a shutdown of 328 million people? And a true shut down? No one allowed out at all unless an emergency? Because if people are going to be able to go shopping etc. Then it won't be good enough in america because there are millions who won't follow guidelines. So if they are not allowed to leave their homes, then how do they get food and water? Delivery services? Then the virus would continue no? Being delivered here and there and infected people coming outside when they are not supposed to.

That is the propaganda talking man, there is not a true 'shutdown' here or anywhere that I know of in the states.

But that doesn't mean that there are not rules in place to stop super spreader events from occurring (anything indoors with a lot of people is going to end up with a whole lot of virus spreading).

Delivery guys have a lot less contact with outside public than in a store setting. Groceries stores are all still open here, as are drug stores/gas stations, drive through and pick up food is still all open. Hardware stores here too are still all open, hospitals all that.

We had a bunch of storm damage and the power company still showed up and got the work done.

The problem is in America we had a lot of people who work in those industries that are tip-base pay that are screwed, possibly forever.

And if they try and lock it down like that, let's say after the election and trump is out, then how will the tens of millions of anti left people react to being held down by a boot heel for their own good? We might not care in a sense what they think but we should care about what might happen no? You may have numbers on them, but there is still i would guess at least 50 million Americans (less than 1 in 6) who would NOT in any fashion go along with a science based solution put in place by a left leaning government. Hell most of them don't even believe in science!

Yes it needs to be slowed, I am not staying that it's a bad plan. It may be the only plan, a shut down. I am just talking about what that would look like in AMERICA specifically. It really would need to be for the full 4-8 weeks. Because if done half assed, the virus will just return after awhile and then once everybody is going back to normal, it will explode again.... it would seem.

As soon as you get into the political realm and correctly identify the tens of millions of 'anti-left' people that have attached themselves to Trump, you left reality by the political talking point of left is going to shut everything down with a 'boot heel', I would question where you heard anyone say this, because this is untrue.

Science is saying we need to be careful, that working with a bunch of people in a confined area is going to end up spreading germs if we are not. Trump has wasted 7 months to get ahead of this virus. He should have just shut up and did his job like Clinton did when he was impeached, and got everyone in America PPE, and guidance on how to safely get about doing their daily life during the threat of the pandemic. I suggest checking this statement Biden put out a while ago for a better idea of what the 'left's' plans are talking about doing.

Instead Trump had to go on a couple months vacation as he was buzzing NASCAR, golfing and calling everything negative a 'hoax' because he is a rich spoiled brat that has no clue what he is doing other than the old sales technique, 'always be closing'.

The problem is I have no idea what it is that you have seen that makes you feel the way you do, because that is the power of micro targeting.

 

[Queen2Green]

let me pose a question to you.

Is capitalism failing? Does that economic system even work during an epidemic? I'm beginning to think that it doesn't.

Absolutely. 100% failing. Everyone is each for their own, there is no sense of community, adaptability, problem solving capabilities being demonstrated in facing our most imminent threat. There is by some, don't get me wrong. But currently not enough to win. That's why we gotta battle online and in person with our friends, family, and strangers to change minds. At the risk of our relationships because really the price is much higher than the economy right now, it's literally our lives. Help people to realize we are all in this togather and the ultimate end game is going to effect each and every one of us. We always knew these types of things were a possiblility. Life will never be the same and the sooner people get used to that the better we can handle it, and get back to economics. Not just in the US but across the globe. US relationships with other countries. The ties to foreign affairs are stretched quite thin. Our ancestors have done it and rebuilt, we will do it too.

The countries that are doing things rights says it all. That's why I say I rely on science for statistics but I don't even need science to speak truths. I can watch whats happening in the world, and see it. It's so obvious.