The age old question HPS, MH vs LED

Kushash

Well-Known Member
yes, and because of the direction of LED light most of it is absorbed by the leaves. if the photon is absorbed by a chloroplast it'll trigger a chemical bonding, and only a small fraction - the rest of the energystate of what's left over, is subsequently converted to heat. Ofc there are other materials there which can absorb photons that range in the visible spectrum which then can cause higher excitation states of baryonic matter.

However, the energy (heat) is not gone just chemically conserved - it will be released again upon decomposing. That's the reason why stuff thats decomposing heats up and can be used to drive a power plant.

And because LED puts out more PAR than HPS the emitted photons will create relatively more biomatter than initial heat.

Also, one reason to go for LED is to draw less power from the wall, so it makes not much sense to even compare the same tent-power-intake....
This was a great post.

This was my favorite part:
However, the energy (heat) is not gone just chemically conserved - it will be released again upon decomposing. That's the reason why stuff that's decomposing heats up and can be used to drive a power plant.
 

xtsho

Well-Known Member
Calling me insecure doesn't change the fact that you're retarded. I could be Satan himself and you would still be an idiot. And idiot who can't answer my question. Do you have any idea how good the CRI is on incandescent bulbs? It's like, the best light you can get. So why don't you use it?
I don't care about incandescent lights so why do you keep ranting about them? Like I said, I'm growing marijuana not conducting a science experiment about different sources of lighting. I use an HID you use and LED. I don't care what light you use but apparently you care what light I use. I'd tell you to look in the mirror if you want to see retarded but knuckle draggers like you can't stand upright.

You are obviously an insecure pathetic retard that thinks that anyone that does things different than you is a retard. You use LED's so anyone else that doesn't is a retard. You don't grow organically so anyone that does is a retard. Remember this post of yours?

Organic is Latin for retard.
So you have basically called those that use HID lighting or grow organically retards. That's a damn good percentage of the people on this site. So what is your purpose for being here? All you do is insult the members of this forum. You have absolutely nothing to offer. Do you even grow marijuana? Or do you spend all your time fiddling with lights and reading all the marketing crap pushed by the LED light manufacturers? Lets see these great grows of yours where watt for watt you get double the yield of an HID. I know you can't show us those because they don't exist.

Oh, here you are calling someone else stupid.

No, you're lying. Also, you're stupid. Which is it? Are all blurples better than HPS's or are not all blurples the same?
So if everyone on this site is stupid I have to ask again, Why are you here?
 

Lordhooha

Well-Known Member
I don't care about incandescent lights so why do you keep ranting about them? Like I said, I'm growing marijuana not conducting a science experiment about different sources of lighting. I use an HID you use and LED. I don't care what light you use but apparently you care what light I use. I'd tell you to look in the mirror if you want to see retarded but knuckle draggers like you can't stand upright.

You are obviously an insecure pathetic retard that thinks that anyone that does things different than you is a retard. You use LED's so anyone else that doesn't is a retard. You don't grow organically so anyone that does is a retard. Remember this post of yours?



So you have basically called those that use HID lighting or grow organically retards. That's a damn good percentage of the people on this site. So what is your purpose for being here? All you do is insult the members of this forum. You have absolutely nothing to offer. Do you even grow marijuana? Or do you spend all your time fiddling with lights and reading all the marketing crap pushed by the LED light manufacturers? Lets see these great grows of yours where watt for watt you get double the yield of an HID. I know you can't show us those because they don't exist.

Oh, here you are calling someone else stupid.



So if everyone on this site is stupid I have to ask again, Why are you here?
Right I love my leds and cmh. Both do well. also you’re right a bunch of us do full on organic grows theres far too much arguing on what lights better. Alot of the problem has simply came from shady led manufactures. Personally I’ve found that a combination of both my cmh’s and leds together create one hell of an environment. A lot of the people that bitch and complain about which light is better makes no sense when they should focus more so on the reasons they have issues in their grow in the first place. I've seen folks on here that have issues feeding and watering but boast on who’s equipment is better. You can have the best light in the world but if your environment isn’t dialed in does it really matter what light or fan you have?
 

Kassiopeija

Well-Known Member
A lot of the people that bitch and complain about which light is better makes no sense when they should focus more so on the reasons they have issues in their grow in the first place. I've seen folks on here that have issues feeding and watering but boast on who’s equipment is better. You can have the best light in the world but if your environment isn’t dialed in does it really matter what light or fan you have?
My growroom isnt climatizised so Im using a multitude of various lamp-types to get some of these variables (soil-, leaf- and airtemperatur) into the right direction. So far, so good. Sometimes problems like erratic growth, hanging leaves or spots can be defeated just by dialing in the growparameters right. Esp the combination with rH into VPD seems to be important. As is good water free if Na Cl and a proper high quality medium.
Sometimes I see new growers that act under the impression "its weed itll grow easily" wasting their indoor plants by bad conditions (and too early fertigation) when in fact high-bred Cannabis is a demanding plant. Its not like having an outdoor landrace strain in its natural vicinity

So even if I use lamps that are less efficient than LED in terms of PAR output it can work greatly.

Growing indoors theres just so many parameters at large, we can rip a single variable (eg "light") out of context to investigate the details/ compare the numbers but at the end of the day everybody's situation may be differently.
 

xtsho

Well-Known Member
Right I love my leds and cmh. Both do well. also you’re right a bunch of us do full on organic grows theres far too much arguing on what lights better. Alot of the problem has simply came from shady led manufactures. Personally I’ve found that a combination of both my cmh’s and leds together create one hell of an environment. A lot of the people that bitch and complain about which light is better makes no sense when they should focus more so on the reasons they have issues in their grow in the first place. I've seen folks on here that have issues feeding and watering but boast on who’s equipment is better. You can have the best light in the world but if your environment isn’t dialed in does it really matter what light or fan you have?
Yes this "Which light is better" nonsense is getting rather old. There are thousands of pictures on this site showing grows where people spend ten times what I spend and still can't match what I get with my el-cheapo 600 watt HPS and bulk salts. And there's always some jackass making statements like "You're retarded for using and HID" or "You're retarded for growing organically". Why do they care what light others use or what method they use to grow? I like to use this site to communicate with others that share a common interest. Some seem to just use this site to start conflict and attempt to degrade others.

Anyway, It's PCK x Panama on the menu for breakfast this morning. A fruity taste with a mellow high. A hybrid with a nice clear heady high. :weed: bongsmilie
 

Grow Lights Australia

Well-Known Member
Alot of the problem has simply came from shady led manufactures.
This is true. There is so much mis-information about LEDs that it has caused the industry more harm than good. So much so, we even devoted a page to "LED Myths" on our website to redress it: https://growlightsaustralia.com/technology/led-myths/

"Equivalent watts" is the worst culprit: it confuses the hell out of people so they don't even know what the manufacturer is talking about.

All most growers need to know is most top efficiency LEDs use 2/3 the power to emit the same amount of PAR as most HIDs. If you compare micromoles per joule (umol/j) you'll see that is exactly the case: the best HPS and CMH lamps are around 1.8-2.0 umol/j while the best LED grow lights are 2.5-3.0 umol/j. LED also emits through a 120-degree plane, whilst HIDs emit through 360 degrees and need reflectors to refocus much of their light.

Even PAR measurements are a bit deceiving, because not all photons are equal: plants absorb some spectra better than others, and different spectra and their ratios to each other cause different morphological responses. So not all colours are equal. That is where LEDs have another advantage as you can alter spectra much easier with phosphors and different base pumps than with HIDs that rely on sodium, mercury and/or other metal excitation to emit fixed spectral wavelengths corresponding to each element.
 

Agronut

Well-Known Member
Just out of curiousity….how much heat does a hps/mh or cmh light give off? In summer I couldn't use one but winter it may be an option. I have a 4x4 tent and a 2x4. I also have a 3x8 room too.
i run CMH + HPS with lights ON at night only, during the winter In a 5x5 tent. This keeps “day” temps below 80 in the garden. Even a T5 in a tent will drive temps high if you aren’t venting/extracting, and I usually dont fire up the giant inline during veg.
 
I will be adding to my lights and have an opportunity to aquire numerous 1000w hps/MH fixtures..my current home is in a state that is VERY HOT in the summer so heat is an issue. I want maximum yield for my effort and wiling to spend $$ on HVAC...My question is are the new LED lights even close to as efficient as traditional lighting fixtures I understand that you have to add much more LED to acquire the same results but if I want to do commercial grows should I stick with the traditional? I have attached a picture of a unit with great reviews...I was gonna put 6 of these in a 15x8 room...what do the experiance growers have th day? Thank you for your help in advance! View attachment 4443448
I just purchased this from alibaba. Great led. Get off of Amazon.
 

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xtsho

Well-Known Member
I mean I have a degree in computer science and biology focused on plants sciences from NMC. Along with countless Microsoft and comptia certifications. So I'll be labeled a nerd anyday
I got my MCSE in 1999 and my CCNA right after. I code in multiple languages as well. I worked as a Network Engineer for years before leaving the corporate grinder and going solo. Now I do contract work from home as a self employed contractor. There is no shortage of work. I'm sure glad to be away from the office politics although they still manage to creep into my home office from time to time.

It doesn't seem like twenty years since this showed up in the mail after passing the final test. It's outdated but with over twenty years worth of experience I don't need to bother with certs anymore.

 

Lordhooha

Well-Known Member
I got my MCSE in 1999 and my CCNA right after. I code in multiple languages as well. I worked as a Network Engineer for years before leaving the corporate grinder and going solo. Now I do contract work from home as a self employed contractor. There is no shortage of work. I'm sure glad to be away from the office politics although they still manage to creep into my home office from time to time.

It doesn't seem like twenty years since this showed up in the mail after passing the final test. It's outdated but with over twenty years worth of experience I don't need to bother with certs anymore.

Same thing I do. I do my own I currently keep x amount of clients on a monthly retainer. Most everything I do is automated through GFI with my own scripts and other than that I deal with the occasional end user visited or opened something and now their machine has gone all wonky. other than that I do server maintenance manually. I just finish a new server migration this week. all my Comptia certs lapsed last year but I figure who cares I don’t feel like forking the cash to renew it unless a client would like it which then I have them pay for. Because those bastards aren’t cheap to take.
 

xtsho

Well-Known Member
I dunno man, I haven’t smoked an outdoor grown plant that’s been anywhere near an indoor.. But I also live in Canada.
The outdoor we were getting from Humboldt County back in the early eighties was fire. Southern Oregon puts out some damn fine outdoor grown weed as well. I'd take that anyday over much of the indoor grown I see on this site regardless of lighting used.
 
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