There is no 'right' v 'left': it is Trump and the oligarchs against the rest

Fogdog

Fogdog

Well-Known Member
Not entirely baseless.

"we must all get together and fight for democracy and oppose oligarchy."

The above is a naive but common rally cry. People who hold vile fascist and racist beliefs say similar. To say the main problem is "oligarchy against everybody else" is a great and useless thing. In that essay, Reich commits the common mistake of disrespecting the choices people made at the ballot box. If he conceded that people have valid motivations and interests when the voted in ways other than he recommends, he'd have to admit he is wrong.

Did you know that every Democratic Senator voted for Sanders campaign finance reform bill and every Republican voted against it when the issue came up for a vote in 2015? If you really want campaign finance reform, support Democrats and vote Republicans out.
 
hotrodharley

hotrodharley

Well-Known Member
The doomsday they fear involves us. Not China or Russia but screwed over Americans. They can go in their hidy holes. Let them try to come out and get anywhere.
 
ttystikk

ttystikk

Well-Known Member
hotrodharley said:
Anyone not clearly seeing it’s the wealthy versus everyone else just might be a hopeless fucking idiot of mighty young and protected. This is the battle. Them versus us.
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Damned straight and if just voting Democratic was going to solve the problem, it would have by now.
 
hotrodharley

hotrodharley

Well-Known Member
ttystikk said:
LMAO you arrogant turd, calling Bob Reich, a man with more political experience than you can even imagine 'naive' and calling him out for 'mistakes'.

Then you demonstrate that you've completely missed the main thrust of his piece with your last sentence, as if just voting for one party instead of the other is going to solve anything.

The 'naive' one making 'common mistakes' isn't Secretary Reich; it's you, moron.
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Reich is as far left as a reasonable person could be. He defines “liberal”. Many of his articles blare it but this is not his first assignment of blame as an economist. He’s mos def got the cred there. The right hates him.
 
hotrodharley

hotrodharley

Well-Known Member
Let me ask. How many of you actually know someone who started out without 2 nickels to rub together and who became wealthy before they were deaf and feeble? Not just comfortable. I’m talking real wealth. And not illegally either. Let’s set a minimum of a measly million. And we’re assured recently that a million these days doesn’t mean what it used to.
 
ttystikk

ttystikk

Well-Known Member
hotrodharley said:
Let me ask. How many of you actually know someone who started out without 2 nickels to rub together and who became wealthy before they were deaf and feeble? Not just comfortable. I’m talking real wealth. And not illegally either. Let’s set a minimum of a measly million. And we’re assured recently that a million these days doesn’t mean what it used to.
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I've met a few.

America, 'the land of opportunity', actually has less economic mobility than any other developed nation-nevermind emerging economies like China, India, Thailand and Vietnam.

Simply put, we've allowed capitalism to run amok, forgetting the lessons our grandparents learned the hard way back in the 1930s. Both political parties are complicit, grabbing at the cash with both hands, no matter what the consequences for the vast majority of their constituents.

That's why I support 'the squad', Bernie Sanders, Ro Khanna, Tulsi Gabbard, and leading political thinkers like Robert Reich, Larry Lessig, Mark Blyth and Richard Wolff.

Our capitalist system is broken, on a runaway track downhill to disaster. The two establishment parties make a big show of fighting over the controls but both are too busy making money to really want to change anything. This explains the outrageous spectacle of Nancy Pelosi ignoring members of her own party and defending an autocratic President against the impeachment proceeding he so richly deserves to save a nation that so badly needs the demonstration of accountability.
 
ttystikk

ttystikk

Well-Known Member
hotrodharley said:
Reich is as far left as a reasonable person could be. He defines “liberal”. Many of his articles blare it but this is not his first assignment of blame as an economist. He’s mos def got the cred there. The right hates him.
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Liberal isn't a good descriptor anymore. It excuses the recipes excesses of corporate power and that is no longer acceptable.
 
Unclebaldrick

Unclebaldrick

Well-Known Member
ttystikk said:
Liberal isn't a good descriptor anymore. It excuses the recipes excesses of corporate power and that is no longer acceptable.
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So you say. You say a lot of things. Most of them are garbage. Thank you for your opinion but nobody here cares what your opinions are. You are not a credible person.
 
Fogdog

Fogdog

Well-Known Member
ttystikk said:
LMAO you arrogant turd, calling Bob Reich, a man with more political experience than you can even imagine 'naive' and calling him out for 'mistakes'.

Then you demonstrate that you've completely missed the main thrust of his piece with your last sentence, as if just voting for one party instead of the other is going to solve anything.

The 'naive' one making 'common mistakes' isn't Secretary Reich; it's you, moron.
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Anybody can make a mistake, even you (lol).

Are you really saying that because the essay came from Reich it must be true?

Reich is ignoring the fact that people have many reasons to choose a candidate. Reich claims in this essay that people must come together and fight oligarchs who control politicians. Opinion polls show for the most part voters have very high satisfaction with their own Congressional representation. Same goes with voting records. For example, you claim that people won't vote for Pelosi when she got almost 90% of the vote in her district. Reich is basically saying that anybody who disagrees with him is stupid. Where have I heard that before, tty?

Most of the silent generation and about half of the boomer generation approve of Trump because Trump says what they want to hear and for the most part is doing what they want. They are racist misogynist fuck heads just like Trump is. That's why they voted for him, not because he'a s "puppet master". We might think that they are fools but they are for the most part average people. They have their own reasons and Reich is overlooking them when he makes his huge leap of faith about oligarchs and puppet masters.
 
Fogdog

Fogdog

Well-Known Member
hotrodharley said:
Reich is as far left as a reasonable person could be. He defines “liberal”. Many of his articles blare it but this is not his first assignment of blame as an economist. He’s mos def got the cred there. The right hates him.
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Cred or not, Reich makes a false claim that, people are duped into voting for Trump by a puppet master. This ignores the appeal Trump has to racist and misogynist fuckheads in this society. Trump is playing to his audience, not the other way around. Also, Trump isn't exactly playing false to them. He is a racist and misogynist fuckhead himself.

Same goes with people who aren't far left and aren't convinced that large government is the answer to their problems though they are willing to listen to that argument. The current struggle is not entirely "oligarchs against everybody else" though that is part of the problem. The current struggle is between a large and wealthy demographic made up of older racist, misogynist white people vs millennials and groups of people who have been disenfranchised by those racist misogynist fuckheads.
 
ttystikk

ttystikk

Well-Known Member
Unclebaldrick said:
So you say. You say a lot of things. Most of them are garbage. Thank you for your opinion but nobody here cares what your opinions are. You are not a credible person.
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The comments of many put the lie to your churlish and hate filled words.

You are not a credible person.
 
ttystikk

ttystikk

Well-Known Member
doublejj said:
vote republicans out......by any means necessary...
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Fine. Just don't expect things to get better- just acquire a nice coat of whitewash. If that's good enough for you, that's your call.

I expect more from our elected officials and I'll work to hold them accountable.
 
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