Organic no till, probiotic, knf, jadam, vermicomposting, soil mixes, sips etc... Q & A

Ecompost

Well-Known Member
Word, i feel ya about the contradictory info. And thats pretty much what i gathered from my research into it. Maybe we read the same thing lol. Teraganix website has a ferment recipe using the em1 but its different. I must have read that recipe at some point and subconsciously interchanged them. Idk but i def trust hyroot tho so i ditched it and started over. Also making labs and im gonna ditch the em1 after i finish this bottle. Its just so expensive and lab is basically free.
:-) I like this progression :-) As peasant farmers, we should consider the interchangeability of the things we read about, with the plants and things we actually find around us. That our world is so ridiculous a single person can claim ownership of biology...pfft...dont forget to pay the lady...... yeah right :-) keep learning and sharing, one day we will be free
 

Ecompost

Well-Known Member
It’s crazy because their is a ton of perlite in riots organic original and there’s a bit of it in the super soil mix (Kind soil). I’ve been reading that perlite rises up, so I’m afraid that most of my perlite has migrated to the top portion of my soil. What are some ideas for amending aeration/drainage to a plant that’s already been potted ?
Broadfork :razz::razz::-P:roll:

I use rice hulls for aeration, I have tried all sorts, eg nut shells and perlite, clay balls blah but i use hulls because I live near a place they make rice.
Better to understand the biological and chemical/ electrical reasons for soil compaction rather than find more sources for aeration beyond what you can easily purchase or access. Most of the air is going to be in the top layers of any soil profile and just how deep are your pots anyway?
 

Ecompost

Well-Known Member
You want high brix. Add basalt rock dusts to your soil and feed with lab and ffe and sst.

Brix are the sugar and mineral content of the plant.

Ffe and lab recipes are towards the beginning of this thread.
I think this comes from Harley and NPK industries, among others, who have said publicly that, "plants with high BRIX content, cant be seen by predators", which is more than a little disingenuous with reference the sum total of requirements for plants to become "invisible????" to pest insects, pathogenic molds and so on.
However, as with any good marketing, it is a likely outcome that, in the event biological harmony has been achieved from seed to harvest, that any plant might also have "High BRIX" as well as having been unmolested :-)
 

outliergenetix

Well-Known Member
they look like Oribatid mites but I am not a biological entomologist so defer to more accurate responses.
If they are Oribatid mites then you have composting occurring in your pots, which means you soil isnt ready because it hasnt been harmonized and so stabiized by humifying microbes, thus you are suffering the consequences of resonance and you have next to no hope of solving this riddle. You are taking part in the real time system of composting and you have put living plants in the mix. It will be a battle I suspect. Sorry i cant be more positive, but sometimes its better to just cut our losses and start again wiser and less vulnerable :-)
i think this may be overstated a bit and i am an admitted "organic" noob, however I have been gardening my whole life both indoors and out. imo before you tell ppl they may need to cull their plants you need to tel them to determine the identity of the pest positively, without that telling anyone to cull their plants is being irresponsible even if you lead with, "I'm not an entomologist".
after identifying the insect or pest then you can asses damage to the plant, if none yet or minimal it is 100% worth trying ot treat the situation, spinosad, soap soakes andmayny many other methods can keep things under control. you will have pests, that is unavoidable, as you said in your other post healthy plants and immune systems is the key to whether they take over. so again treat the pest with some natural pest deterent or killer and treat your plants to silica Trichoderma, chiten etc. to keep the bugs from feasting on sick plants. for example maybe I would add things like spinosad to my ipm or other appropriate solution regarding the indentity of the pest.
***note the same shit that kills bad mites and arthropods kills good ones, the idea is not to have no "bugs" its to keep balance
 
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Ecompost

Well-Known Member
i think this may be overstated a bit and i am an admitted "organic" noob, however I have been gardening my whole life both indoors and out. imo before you tell ppl they may need to cull their plants you need to tel them to determine the identity of the pest positively, without that telling anyone to cull their plants is being irresponsible even if you lead with, "I'm not an entomologist".
after identifying the insect or pest then you can asses damage to the plant, if none yet or minimal it is 100% worth trying ot treat the situation, spinosad, soap soakes andmayny many other methods can keep things under control. you will have pests, that is unavoidable, as you said in your other post healthy plants and immune systems is the key to whether they take over. so again treat the pest with some natural pest deterent or killer and treat your plants to silica Trichoderma, chiten etc. to keep the bugs from feasting on sick plants. for example maybe I would add things like spinosad to my ipm or other appropriate solution regarding the indentity of the pest.
***note the same shit that kills bad mites and arthropods kills good ones, the idea is not to have no "bugs" its to keep balance
I never said kill it, I think I said may be think about it, but of course he can if he prefers and has the budget to waste, chase his tail as you suggest, using an ever widening array of products to kill the very signposts he ought to be considering might be trying to teach him something, or pass on a subtle but real message from nature.
I can see you have a product to fix most of your mistakes, so why stop making them right?
 

projectinfo

Well-Known Member
I never said kill it, I think I said may be think about it, but of course he can if he prefers and has the budget to waste, chase his tail as you suggest, using an ever widening array of products to kill the very signposts he ought to be considering might be trying to teach him something, or pass on a subtle but real message from nature.
I can see you have a product to fix most of your mistakes, so why stop making them right?
Those were some seeds i put in pro mix. I put some castings on top and some rice hulls for mulch. They must have started composting. Its all good lessoned learned, go easy on the castings lol

Ive got totes of soil that i mixed once so far and dont plan to again .

It will be about 2months 1 week old soil Hyroots recipe on the first page .
 

Ecompost

Well-Known Member
Those were some seeds i put in pro mix. I put some castings on top and some rice hulls for mulch. They must have started composting. Its all good lessoned learned, go easy on the castings lol

Ive got totes of soil that i mixed once so far and dont plan to again .

It will be about 2months 1 week old soil Hyroots recipe on the first page .
I havent seen the blend. I dont tend to bother with these elaborate soil mixes, no offense to the creator in this case, who seems like a nice soul, helpful and knowledgeable on growing here. He certainly isn't as blunt as me! Its just that they all appear to me, to be a little odd in light of my simple observations of natural grassland soil systems around the world, North and South and everything in between. Eg average organic matter %, mineral composition varience between healthy and unhealthy grassland systems (non farmed), rates of infiltration, average moisture%, pH, average temps and CO2/ O2 burst.

I think rice hulls have a Carbon ratio of about 115. I suspect you may have too much N in the blend elsewhere if these are composting quickly. No disrespect intended, but i wont go back to review the blend you use. I have seen many hundreds of these, super soil/ grow mixes, its not really worth the science imo, of which there is plenty of higher value, not least in truly understanding the mechanisms behind enhancing human chain beneficial plant characters and beyond. After all we are growing medicine here :-)
If we study nature, and not men, the story of what grows a high quality grassland crop is already resolved with reference suitable environments and or say C/N ratios for grassland crops. I think people over think growing plants in ways that are self distracting, but I do love to see human minds working anyway, and i am not suggesting how I grow is better or worse, its just may be different to many here and the same as many too.
I treat compost as a soil additive, not a growing medium. I use local soils, real soil, eg clay, sand, silt, local bedrock, biology and so I limit my added organic content to be within a natural percentage overall, matching C/N for the crop I want to grow. I understand that every input i make, has consequences for the community, so i try not to add things that arent already in the system, eg tomorrows organic matter is today's residue.
My idea of organics, is to depend more faithfully in the systems of God/ Mother nature, and do my very best to mimic what is already working without human interference.

Added disclaimer: I dont grow indoors anymore, I dont need to because i am lucky to live in a country where the production of this crop is made easier and is much the less consumptive because i dont pay for power or add extra carbon waste using electricity, but I used to before i migrated to a zone more preferential to my biology, and that of MJ too :-) and so i understand the challenges of trying to replicate nature on a budget, without getting arrested.
I do use Rice Hulls myself in potting mixes that require free draining media, so I am not bashing the use of these or anything people use, lots of things are seen to work in the growing world, but this is pony credit, if we consider "life itself" is more determined to grow, than we have capacity to fuck things up. Our lives may not be so lucky as the sum total here however.

Cornell always had the best resource for understanding compost and composting. No use trying to reinvent wheels imo, what we have discovered is a small fraction of what we might know, so i am not bashing soil mixoligists,
http://www.compost.css.cornell.edu/calc/cn_ratio.html
 

Ecompost

Well-Known Member
Those were some seeds i put in pro mix. I put some castings on top and some rice hulls for mulch. They must have started composting. Its all good lessoned learned, go easy on the castings lol

Ive got totes of soil that i mixed once so far and dont plan to again .

It will be about 2months 1 week old soil Hyroots recipe on the first page .
by the way, you can use your rice hulls to make something long known by many peasant farmers around the world as waterglass (Silica). I am sure you will find a method online to follow re how to make it, its easy, just a few commonly located things needed equipment wise. Access to hulls is the hardest part of it :-)
I found this pdf quickly, I havent read it as I already have a method I learned from a wonderful Colombian farmer, but it probably explains how and why if too scientific for many.
http://www.sphinxsai.com/2014/RTBCE/5/(4337-4345) 014.pdf

if you are struggling and want to make it, let me know, I will share my uncomplicated by science language method.

Anyway the message is that i use stuff you use, I just may be use it differently, eg I might foliar silica to correct things that might otherwise cause wide scale failure ( for example, i use silica with both P and K feeds, rather than attempt to avoid the unseen by adding to soil, wide mixes of things I am not first sure I know are missing, or just unavailable and so insufficient.) Who on a farm scale has money to continually test soil through pre biased soil testing labs? (no disrespect to soil labs, but each test method changes the outcome, ergo each test is imperfect as a human led preference, but they do still tell us somethings we might use to inform us.) and further, has the budget and or equipment to add acres of compost 8 inches thick, with tones of rock dust and blah.
Sometimes it is easier and more economical to turn a little bit of XBC in to 1000L of Y so we can spray a plant, other times it might be best to go back to the drawing board.
 

bearded.beaver

Well-Known Member
@Ecompost I agree with you. It's better to work with nature. Encourage nature in the direction you want. Not try to control nature.
With some of these soil recipes if you want to buy all the amendments the price for even two 15gallon pots is in the hundreds of dollars.
And in my opinion the soil food Web developed in your area is from local inputs. And has developed that way since since the beginning of time. That's is why we have diversity
 

Gingeroot

Well-Known Member
Do you really need to ferment the equal amounts lacto/molasses with 20 parts water? Could I just mix molasses/lacto and use that in watering regime?
 

Ecompost

Well-Known Member
@Ecompost it seems like you’re Highjacking this thread, how about starting a new thread. I believe it would helpful for your information to be found rather being on page 30. No offense but I’m here for @hyroot.
sorry you feel like that. I wasnt hijacking, just sharing and providing alternative views which it seems are not really welcome and must be discussed in a silo???
Years ago a man called Julius Hensel was over written by a man called Justus Von Liebig and so began an industry which continues today to exploit peasant farmers.....
 

AkFrost

Active Member
I think this comes from Harley and NPK industries, among others, who have said publicly that, "plants with high BRIX content, cant be seen by predators", which is more than a little disingenuous with reference the sum total of requirements for plants to become "invisible????" to pest insects, pathogenic molds and so on.
However, as with any good marketing, it is a likely outcome that, in the event biological harmony has been achieved from seed to harvest, that any plant might also have "High BRIX" as well as having been unmolested :-)
I took Harley Smith’s growing classes almost two years ago. He never said that a high brix plant makes it “invisible”. He does say that “some organic gardeners claim that when your plant has a brix lvl 12% or higher, sucking insects won’t reconise the plant as food”. I think we should double check things before posting the wrong info on ppl. Is it true? I don’t know, I don’t claim it to work that way. But one of MY goals as a grower is to try and keep my brix lvls high. Normally mine are around 14. I Started a couple FPJ’s last week to hopefully boost my brix lvls and help flowering. Hope they do good, I’ve never tried it before.
 

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projectinfo

Well-Known Member
I took Harley Smith’s growing classes almost two years ago. He never said that a high brix plant makes it “invisible”. He does say that “some organic gardeners claim that when your plant has a brix lvl 12% or higher, sucking insects won’t reconise the plant as food”. I think we should double check things before posting the wrong info on ppl. Is it true? I don’t know, I don’t claim it to work that way. But one of MY goals as a grower is to try and keep my brix lvls high. Normally mine are around 14. I Started a couple FPJ’s last week to hopefully boost my brix lvls and help flowering. Hope they do good, I’ve never tried it before.
Nice what did you use in your fpj for plabt meterial ?


And did you use sugar or em1/labs/aem
 

AkFrost

Active Member
Well it’s winter time so I had to use store bought product. I used cantaloupe (no rinds) and brown sugar. Equal parts. I didn’t really noticed any change in my plants. The brix stayed around its normal percentage. But it did allow me stop using my potassium nutrient in flower. And im still seeing the same results so far. (:
 

DankTankerous

Well-Known Member
I top dressed my plant with Kashi and have gotten that nice mat Of mycelium covering the top. Should the top soil always be wet? If so how would I achieve it without overwatering my plant? Btw I’m in a equal parts perlite, ffof, and Happy Frog, so it’s very well aerated. If it does dry out will the mycelium become inactive and need reinnoculation or just rejuvenate and keep working?
 

ShLUbY

Well-Known Member
I top dressed my plant with Kashi and have gotten that nice mat Of mycelium covering the top. Should the top soil always be wet? If so how would I achieve it without overwatering my plant? Btw I’m in a equal parts perlite, ffof, and Happy Frog, so it’s very well aerated. If it does dry out will the mycelium become inactive and need reinnoculation or just rejuvenate and keep working?
use a mulch, or even just a loose piece of poly plastic. that will help prevent evaporation of your topsoil. the humidity will remain high at the surface and keep it good and moist. and its unlikely you'd have to reinoculate it. you just have to keep feeding it :)
 

DankTankerous

Well-Known Member
use a mulch, or even just a loose piece of poly plastic. that will help prevent evaporation of your topsoil. the humidity will remain high at the surface and keep it good and moist. and its unlikely you'd have to reinoculate it. you just have to keep feeding it :)
I have Barley straw as my mulch and Red Clover crop on two of my plants
 
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