ttystikk
Well-Known Member
Only to the people we care about. That's enough for me.
What if you found out your purpose in life was meaningless?
- Thread starter Padawanbater2
- Start date
Sir Napsalot
Well-Known Member
Accepting one's powerlessness is the first step to enlightenment
Padawanbater2
Well-Known Member
"Once you've lost everything, you're free to do anything"
chemphlegm
Well-Known Member
Discovering ones own infertility would resonate well with thread title?
mahiluana
Well-Known Member
evolution = ability to reproduce + variation + selection
Charles Darwin spelled this formula 300 years ago, and told us, that life and creation
is a long, wet and never ending chain.
Nobody and nothing can escape from this "game" called evolution - we are all inside - if we want or not.
It seems to be a universal rule, that even a stone or any other material can`t hide away -
not our spirit - nor the beauty and the uggly, that we create with this spirit.
Aristoteles said it much earlier, when he tried to give another brilliant definition of "GOD"
"THE UNMOVED MOVER" - was even a shorter concept of the same universal rule.
I recommend "ART" as the new religion ***
so please "everybody is an artist"
As an artist you can learn to celebrate :
- your abilities to reproduce your soul or any other concept of any other artist
- your virtuosity
- trying to select by your own choise
this can put you in a position of god or a king --->
What if you find out your purpose in life is - to be part of "GOD" and his creation with your own kingdom ?
- meaningless only the size of your castle
- because you are able to travel through time and space
- ! and state of mind !
I found it`s a relativ exciting journey to ride on a comet through the univers
but totally relativity also means chaos meaningfull = meaningless
half empty = half full
the last will be the first...
ttystikk
Well-Known Member
My body is part of evolution, but my mind is mine to do with as I see fit.
That is art.
mahiluana
Well-Known Member
i hope so - but you can`t exclude your mind from evolution.
i`m shure it`s a conditioned, liquid chain, of whatever you have experienced in your life.
the evolution of spirit, mind and soul was also a chapter in Darwins` work.
google and me translated and interesting article from:
http://www.tagesspiegel.de/meinung/darwin-die-natur-der-seele/1313638.html
specially for you @ttystikk - a kind of spiritual "waterboarding"(sorry-
) to enjoy, confirm and sign @ the end...IT`S MY 2,5 KG BRAIN, THAT CREATES MY EGO
...and it is continuously conquered by manipulation (from outside ?)
...is education evolution of my spirit ???
even sleeping, dreaming... under your pillow there is a recreational facility for many subjects,
that frolic themselves in your subconscious...and form your "new" ego in the next morning.
************************************************************
Darwin
The nature of the soul
150 years after Darwin: As soon as it comes to the core of our ego, the theory of the British biologist is still alien to us.
When Charles Darwin set foot on English mainland for the first time on October 2, 1836, after nearly five years on the world tour with the "Beagle", he was also close to stepping into new ground. He, the former student of theology, he who had planned on leaving the ship at the time of his departure to pursue a career as a country pastor, he was no longer the same. Too much had he seen on the way, too much seen. Something had changed in Darwin. In him already developed and unfolded that thought which would prove more than any other corrosive to our conventional image of God and the world.
And of ourselves: Darwin's thinking revolution is not just about the emergence of nature and the species we see around us. No, it affects us, and at heart, the core of our ego. Our soul.
Before Darwin, it was natural to see the genesis of the species, including man, as the creation of a god, an "intelligent designer". You did not know it better. You could not explain the complexity that nature presents to us everywhere.
And the explanatory approach, which was taken in the emergency, so had sense! Everything known from culture, from shoe to cathedral, was the work of a creator (shoemaker, architect) who was far more intelligent than his "creature." It had to be the same with nature and not least with ourselves: Man, too, had to be created by something even more clever than man himself - God.
Darwin turned this explanation upside down. He saw that it was different, even vice versa: A stupid process called evolution could produce something like intelligence. Evolution made possible what most had thought impossible: design without designer, creator without creator, intelligence without higher intelligence.
Darwin immediately recognized the dynamism of this thought: "You will moan now, wondering what kind of person you have wasting your time on," he wrote in 1844 in a letter to the botanist Joseph Dalton Hooker. It was the first time he had revealed his suspicions to anyone. "But I'm almost convinced (quite the contrary to my original opinion) that the species is not (it's as if I'm confessing a murder to you) immutable."
The previously unthought, the unthinkable was in the world.
Darwin was right, his thought is actually some kind of murder, not some: it's God himself that Darwin has on his conscience. Darwin has made God redundant as an explanation of the diversity of life on earth, at least more superfluously than anyone else before him.
Of course, the theory of evolution does not refute the hypothesis of God, no scientific theory can do that. It only makes the usual idea of God implausible. Darwin's theory of evolution can explain the complexity of nature on its own; it does not need an instance that itself remains unexplained. It is no coincidence that Nietzsche, who took note of Darwin, though he misunderstood him to a great extent, was to proclaim the death of God a few years later.
You'd think this is where it ends, Darwin's story, which will see a big anniversary next year. 2009 will be a Darwin year: 150 years ago, in 1859, his major work "Origin of Species" was published. At the same time celebrates the 200th birthday of Darwin, who was born on February 12, 1809 in Shrewsbury, England. However, there is much to suggest that history, especially as far as we humans are concerned, only starts at this point. That`s what Darwin anticipated in the end of his "Origin of Species":
"Light will fall on the origin of man."
The theory of evolution inevitably leads to the insight that we humans are in a continuous line with the other living beings. This does not only apply to our body, to our instincts and instincts. This applies to our entire self, even and even to our "soul".
The soul, we feel, is somehow different, not of this world. We may accept that the brain is part of evolution, part of nature, not the soul, not the innermost, private core of our ego. From a Darwinian point of view, however, it is highly unlikely that our soul was suddenly planted in us in the course of evolution.
Rather, we must assume that the soul, too, is an evolutionary product that has gradually developed, with the brain, the organ of the soul. Mice probably already have a bit of soul, the many animals we breed industrially, and then eat, pigs for example, already have a little more soul, Monkeys even more, and man certainly has the most evolved soul. This simple thought that even the soul is a matter of evolutionary history and not an all-or-nothing phenomenon, breathed by God only to us, Homo privilegiensis was, comes with some consequences, which take some getting used to. God still plays a role, because "God," the dead man, lives on in our soul. Soberly formulated: Our soul has "divine" qualities - at least three. Darwin compels us to translate these seemingly divine qualities into natural ones, as in the genesis of species. The soul's first "divine" quality lies in its airy character. We have the impression that our soul, like God, is something out of the body, immaterial. We believe that there are two worlds: a physical world to which our body belongs, and a spiritual, psychic world. Darwin's theory of evolution, however, suggests that there is only one world, the physical one. We think we are controlling our material brain and body with our immaterial soul. The brain appears to us as a kind of laptop or Google of the soul: If we need information, then our brain, often, mostly, is there for us. However, this intuitive picture turns out to be absolutely misleading after three decades of modern brain research: Not ours Soul controls the brain, but the brain brings out our soul, together with the ego and "its" thoughts and feelings. Nietzsche had also seen through this when he stated that even the phrase "I think" is based on a false intuition that we are up to into the language are wrong about ourselves. In truth, said Nietzsche, it is the other way around: not "I think," but the brain is thinking of our ego! The reason why we are wrong about ourselves is, among other things, that we have the brain and the processes that play in it, do not feel it. Every time we are presented with a colorful picture of our illuminated upper room, we marvel again. We are astonished because we never see the work that the brain does. The brain works incognito, invisible, ghostly. We only perceive the results of this work. Have you ever tried to trace your thoughts? They seem to come out of nowhere! The ego, the soul, the thoughts, feelings - all that we just find. We feel, see our hands, our legs, our feet but not our brains. The brain also does not feel pain, which is why a tumor can grow until it is the size of a billiard ball. A stroke can change our personality or rob parts of our ego: language, emotions, memory content. When the brain is destroyed, as horribly as in Alzheimer's disease, our ego, our soul, is extinguished. Brain research has shown us what Darwin's theory implied from the beginning: that the soul is also corporeal. What leads to the second divine attribute of the soul: free will. God, the idea, created the world as the original creator. He set the whole thing in motion without anybody having moved him on his part. God is the "unmoved mover" Aristotle spoke of. Similarly, we think of our soul as the original creator of our deeds, the unmoved mover in our heads.
Attachments
mahiluana
Well-Known Member
If there were two worlds, one physical and one beyond physics, then there could be something like a stagnant mover in the head. But there is only one world, the physical, and that is causally closed. There is no uneffected work in it. Our ego is produced by the brain as well as all our thoughts. However, every current brain state is determined by the previous state as well as external stimuli and random processes. A free will is not only implausible from this point of view - it is physically impossible. To this devastating conclusion came Darwin in his later life, and he worried about it a lot. At one point he wrote: "Reflecting on these things, one doubts free will, every act (seems) determined by the hereditary constitution (and) the example of others, or the teaching of others." Darwin hoped that knowledge would not he was so afraid of the consequences. He suspected that should society lose its belief in free will, then our conventional notion of morality and responsibility would be shaken. In it, morality, lies the third core of the soul. Nature is beyond good and evil - man is not. Why? Where does our conscience come from? For the longest time in history, the answer was clear: God. God taught people to do the good.
If there is no God, Dostoyevsky said, everything is allowed.
From a Darwinian point of view, moral rules, on the other hand, do not appear as divine, but as an adaptation to a socially complex world. Whose environment is a social - and the human environment is highly social, people survive practically only in groups - who behaves better not amoral as a psychopath, but morally, socially. Moral rules, responsibility, guilt, all that serves to survive in groups.
But if the free will is an illusion, then there is no such thing as "guilt" in an objective sense, then there is only guilt. This is the most radical conclusion that Darwin and brain research suggest to us: both free will and our moral feelings are constructions of a brain optimized by evolution. Evolution is not a philosopher. It does not matter to her that her creatures correctly recognize reality, but that they do not perish prematurely in this reality. If illusions serve survival, then evolution is also welcome to illusions.
Darwin himself came to this sobering conclusion in his last years, as did Nietzsche: free will, responsibility, guilt - all this seemed to both thinkers as more or less useful fictions. Darwin noted: "The disgust of bad guys (should) be no more than the disgust that someone feels at lazy eating. Pity should dispel disgust. Because meanness is just as little of human error as physical illness! "Nietzsche should later speak of the" innocence of becoming "and the" complete irresponsibility "of man.
Darwinian soul, that is not divine, but natural. Not our soul is divine, but we humans have created God according to our soul image.
That we are related to the monkeys - this drop was bitter, but we swallowed it. After all, there was that extra something in us, a divine spark, the soul. That even they could be a physical phenomenon, part of an aimless cosmos, which becomes mysteriously aware of itself in our brain, seems to us a strange, even absurd idea. As far as the core of our ego is concerned, Darwin, 200 years after his birth, 150 years after his theory, is still ahead of us.
2 paintings of my frolicing subconscious - treating the above subject
- company and riding on my side as "underground terrorists of my mind" to help and serve me during my journey - travelling through time,space and mind.
http://www.artists.de/232553-macias555:sie-sollten-besser-auf-ihrem-eigenen-esel-reiten
View attachment 4067897
http://www.artists.de/50247-macias555:j-disches-alphabet-malerei-in-zeiten-der-trockenh
ttystikk
Well-Known Member
Nice read, but my point is that while our brains might be the product of evolution, what we're doing with them definitely ISN'T.If there were two worlds, one physical and one beyond physics, then there could be something like a stagnant mover in the head. But there is only one world, the physical, and that is causally closed. There is no uneffected work in it. Our ego is produced by the brain as well as all our thoughts. However, every current brain state is determined by the previous state as well as external stimuli and random processes. A free will is not only implausible from this point of view - it is physically impossible. To this devastating conclusion came Darwin in his later life, and he worried about it a lot. At one point he wrote: "Reflecting on these things, one doubts free will, every act (seems) determined by the hereditary constitution (and) the example of others, or the teaching of others." Darwin hoped that knowledge would not he was so afraid of the consequences. He suspected that should society lose its belief in free will, then our conventional notion of morality and responsibility would be shaken. In it, morality, lies the third core of the soul. Nature is beyond good and evil - man is not. Why? Where does our conscience come from? For the longest time in history, the answer was clear: God. God taught people to do the good.
If there is no God, Dostoyevsky said, everything is allowed.
From a Darwinian point of view, moral rules, on the other hand, do not appear as divine, but as an adaptation to a socially complex world. Whose environment is a social - and the human environment is highly social, people survive practically only in groups - who behaves better not amoral as a psychopath, but morally, socially. Moral rules, responsibility, guilt, all that serves to survive in groups.
But if the free will is an illusion, then there is no such thing as "guilt" in an objective sense, then there is only guilt. This is the most radical conclusion that Darwin and brain research suggest to us: both free will and our moral feelings are constructions of a brain optimized by evolution. Evolution is not a philosopher. It does not matter to her that her creatures correctly recognize reality, but that they do not perish prematurely in this reality. If illusions serve survival, then evolution is also welcome to illusions.
Darwin himself came to this sobering conclusion in his last years, as did Nietzsche: free will, responsibility, guilt - all this seemed to both thinkers as more or less useful fictions. Darwin noted: "The disgust of bad guys (should) be no more than the disgust that someone feels at lazy eating. Pity should dispel disgust. Because meanness is just as little of human error as physical illness! "Nietzsche should later speak of the" innocence of becoming "and the" complete irresponsibility "of man.
Darwinian soul, that is not divine, but natural. Not our soul is divine, but we humans have created God according to our soul image.
That we are related to the monkeys - this drop was bitter, but we swallowed it. After all, there was that extra something in us, a divine spark, the soul. That even they could be a physical phenomenon, part of an aimless cosmos, which becomes mysteriously aware of itself in our brain, seems to us a strange, even absurd idea. As far as the core of our ego is concerned, Darwin, 200 years after his birth, 150 years after his theory, is still ahead of us.
2 paintings of my frolicing subconscious - treating the above subject
- company and riding on my side as "underground terrorists of my mind" to help and serve me during my journey - travelling through time,space and mind.
http://www.artists.de/232553-macias555:sie-sollten-besser-auf-ihrem-eigenen-esel-reiten
View attachment 4067897
http://www.artists.de/50247-macias555:j-disches-alphabet-malerei-in-zeiten-der-trockenh
mahiluana
Well-Known Member
The evolution of the spirit of Mr. ttystikk = his ability to reproduce this spirit + variation + selection
Starting as an embryo in your mothers`uterus as a fertilized single cell - you had no eyes, no ears.
Few months later you looked more like a tadpole
- where was your mind, when you started to hear the heartbeat of your mother ?
- Where was it, when you heard your own voice for the first time - trying to spell or "reproduce" your first word ?
- was your first word "vertically growing" ???
Yes and NO
Up on word-babbles like dad, mom, dog or cat - your mind grew vertically - adding more sounds, voices, words, languages, ... each day and second - with all your growing senses, streched to a whole univers of persons, subjects, landscapes ...in a constantly changing world.
Can`t understand how you want to seperate the (your) mind from a process like evolution.
EVOLUTION is timeless, in all parts of the univers and the cosmos of your mind is integrated,
if you want or not... your body and your mind are changing...you are a very clear example for evolution.
evolution doesn`t urgently means positive or negative.
My definition of evolution: its a process, that can turn even a big, hard and "mindless" rock into the sand of a nice beach --- or even end up as ground rock flour and nutrients for your maryjane....
If then you get stoned on this beach with your maryjane
you will understand why the good old indians told us -
that GOD is sleeping in the stones and breathing in the plants....
chemphlegm
Well-Known Member
still waiting for monkeys turning into men
New Age United
Well-Known Member
I like that did you come up with that yourself or is that an actual saying? A living universe. "The mind cuts things up into lifeless fragments" Tolleindians told us -
that GOD is sleeping in the stones and breathing in the plants....
mahiluana
Well-Known Member
God sleeps in the rock, dreams in the plant, stirs in the animal...and awakens in man.
- Ibn al 'Arabi
New Age United
Well-Known Member
Genius is he native American, east Indian or Muslim?
ttystikk
Well-Known Member
It's also a Taoist belief.
mahiluana
Well-Known Member
i thought he was hindu, but now find him as one of the most popular sufi...born in spain and working and living in the arabien world of the 12th century a.c.
... anyway i like him and give him as a present the following extension:
Big Bang is the heart beat of GOD...
God sleeps in the rock, dreams in the plant, stirs in the animal...and awakens in man.
...after breakfast he drinks a cup of tea in the artists`studio -
smoking joints and talking about silly things...
https://de.scribd.com/document/17145733/Ibn-Al-Arabis-Doctrine-of-the-Oneness-of-Being-William-Chittick
mahiluana
Well-Known Member
- Which mind ?
- Which state of mind ?
- Is our mind not like an ocean with subconciously flat and deep sea - small islands and big continents forming our concious -
always moving the coast + changing color and temperature with the moon and the sun - and always with the posibility to dive and find beautyfull little treasures ?
- Isn`t it possible for a mind to unify things and create a "whole lively single piece" ???
As a painter i pretend to unify lifeless colored fragments into a whole single piece...
... and Darwins formula
EVOLUTION = ABILITY TO REPRODUCE * VARIATION * SELECTION
is just a perfect and olympic imperative for an artists workflow.
As long as there is a theory of "ONENESS" (or GOD) in any mind of a living person, there is hope to reproduce this spirit holding things and society together.
I guess Mr. Tolle is thinking more about the mainstream of mind -
which is definitly influenced by money and capitalism -
cutting the world in liveless pieces and giving them a price -
earning your money, cutting and dealing pieces 40h / week -
makes your mind get adapted and industriellised.
Looking from outside after a shower, shaved well and put in suitable clothes ,
we are all the same "normal member" of society.
Looking inside the head and minds - you can find unshaved mass murders and stinky liars -
that has nothing to do with the form of mind of a pure, true human being.
Outside you see, that we all share the ~ same DNA (phenotype)
But the sequence of a spiritual information must be inside your "ability to reproduce" this spirit.
Education (evolution of your mind) by parents, family, friends, teacher, idols.... ! and false prophets !...... - is not like a fixed DNA code - and like always depend on the function of a more or less smart and healthy DNA created brain
- the spiritual part of your worldview comes from outside of your physical cosmos
- with your individual experience and unique position in your time, in your places
and states of minds you hopefully fade your antennas well to stay a pure member.
But sick minds + brains are an emerging syndrome of society.
Neurotic people, burn-out, alzheimer, crystal cracked heroins....new york city and all the other big apples are very bussy places for psychologists.
Trump should have stayed there on the sofa - to talk with them about the "sick puppies" of this worlds`century. --- i understand what you mean, if you deny any evolution coming out of these babble-brains.
Every hour he spent in his office is a danger - and it`s not the only oval office in this world.
As we know the sick brain #1 of sick puppies can have an enormeous trigger and influence on Evolution.
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ttystikk
Well-Known Member
And now we're talking about unnatural selection lol
- Which mind ?
- Which state of mind ?
- Is our mind not like an ocean with subconciously flat and deep sea - small islands and big continents forming our concious -
always moving the coast + changing color and temperature with the moon and the sun - and always with the posibility to dive and find beautyfull little treasures ?
- Isn`t it possible for a mind to unify things and create a "whole lively single piece" ???
As a painter i pretend to unify lifeless colored fragments into a whole single piece...
... and Darwins formula
EVOLUTION = ABILITY TO REPRODUCE * VARIATION * SELECTION
is just a perfect and olympic imperative for an artists workflow.
As long as there is a theory of "ONENESS" (or GOD) in any mind of a living person, there is hope to reproduce this spirit holding things and society together.
I guess Mr. Tolle is thinking more about the mainstream of mind -
which is definitly influenced by money and capitalism -
cutting the world in liveless pieces and giving them a price -
earning your money, cutting and dealing pieces 40h / week -
makes your mind get adapted and industriellised.
Looking from outside after a shower, shaved well and put in suitable clothes ,
we are all the same "normal member" of society.
Looking inside the head and minds - you can find unshaved mass murders and stinky liars -
that has nothing to do with the form of mind of a pure, true human being.
Outside you see, that we all share the ~ same DNA (phenotype)
But the sequence of a spiritual information must be inside your "ability to reproduce" this spirit.
Education (evolution of your mind) by parents, family, friends, teacher, idols.... ! and false prophets !...... - is not like a fixed DNA code - and like always depend on the function of a more or less smart and healthy DNA created brain
- the spiritual part of your worldview comes from outside of your physical cosmos
- with your individual experience and unique position in your time, in your places
and states of minds you hopefully fade your antennas well to stay a pure member.
But sick minds + brains are an emerging syndrome of society.
Neurotic people, burn-out, alzheimer, crystal cracked heroins....new york city and all the other big apples are very bussy places for psychologists.
Trump should have stayed there on the sofa - to talk with them about the "sick puppies" of this worlds`century. --- i understand what you mean, if you deny any evolution coming out of these babble-brains.
Every hour he spent in his office is a danger - and it`s not the only oval office in this world.
As we know the sick brain #1 of sick puppies can have an enormeous trigger and influence on Evolution.