Mark Blyth, the economist who's making sense

[ttystikk]

I've already said what I meant. Posted back up articles that are current from December on to show what Bernie is now saying.

I was specific enough for you to understand. You just don't like my answer.

Bernie is going to finish his draft bill for Universal Healthcare. Bernie isn't hard line about people supporting it. It's all there in black and white. When I read the quotation from the Washington Post interview that was published on August 9 of this year, I see him accepting that this issue won't get passed very soon. It's you who is hard line and obnoxious about denying reality that the US is more conservative than you'd like. Single Payer Healthcare is not a hard line issue for the "Our Revolution" reformers.

Sanders told The Post that healthcare, and support for a single-payer system, is just one issue for voters to consider.
“Is this a litmus test? No, you have to look at where candidates are on many issues,” Sanders said.

“But you’re seeing more and more movement toward ‘Medicare for All.’ When the people are saying we need healthcare for everyone, as more and more Americans come on board, it will become politically possible.”

I think the only issue that is clearly a litmus test for the "Our Revolution" reformers is support for reforming campaign finance. Also, the people who have signed on already are pretty good in terms of liberal values. Bernie is giving room in his movement for moderate conservatives who either represent or want to represent districts that would reject single payer healthcare when the cost is calculated. Also other conservative hot button issues like abortion.

Pretzel your logic much? I want cheese with mine, please.

Lulz

 

[ttystikk]

the old testament is worth a read just for the tetragrammaton.

where would even you be without Menger and marginslism? opportunity costs, Buisness cycle?

Will you deny then that Hayek was about the only one to predict the crash of 1929 based on monetary expansion? "unproven axiom" indeed.

it's the same old struggle....economics as the science of individual choice vs economics as accumulation of data serving the state.

it's clear which side youre on as you are a proponent of using the state to implement your version of good through a blend of politics as economics, rather than leaving politics out of economics as the Austrians do.

Where do you get this drivel? You're the classic definition of 'kook'.

It clearly doesn't help you understand the world or help with your daily life.

You badly need an actual education. Until you get one, no one who has one will take you seriously- nor should we.

 

[Fogdog]

He won't respond. He's wrong and he knows it, so he is stuck on repeat, hoping that alone will win the argument.

Fogsmog is beginning to sound as stupid as Stinkydigit. Their positions don't line up with their actions and their blame game is the same lame.

Worse than right wingnuts; gotta trash the very one that best represents their interests, then wonder why they keep getting screwed.

But remember! It's always someone else's fault! We just have to find them first!

LMAO

Bizarre post, tty.

I'm not trashing Bernie. Bernie's own statements regarding social issues that affect minorities are status quo or retrograde on policies that would address systematic racism. He said "people are tired of political correctness" and went on to falsely describe what political correctness is. Typical old white man who will be good for white people and for others but not on issues of social equality for minorities. His voting record is good, it's just that he's not a leader on issues of social equality.

When Sanders says "people" he means white people in the statement below. I don't think African Americans are exhausted about the fight for their right to move about safely and prosper in this society.

Regarding Trump and the exhausted white people:
“I think he said he will not be politically correct,” Sanders explained. “I think he said some outrageous and painful things, but I think people are tired of the same old politically correct rhetoric, and they believe that he was speaking from his heart and willing to take on everybody.”

Regarding what he think political correctness is:
“It means you have a set of talking points which have been poll-tested and focus-group-tested and that’s what you say rather than what’s really going on. And often, what you are not allowed to say are things which offend very powerful people.”

Don't believe me? Within the first minute of this video of a town hall meeting in December, he says all of that. Note that he very quickly pivots away from this issue. I get the sense that he thinks it is a losing issue for Democrats and he's probably right.

 

[Fogdog]

Pretzel your logic much? I want cheese with mine, please.

Lulz

What exactly did you disagree with?

As pad would say, be specific. Also post back up information.

Is it so bad that Bernie is shifting his stance on single payer healthcare to accommodate moderate conservatives?

 

[ttystikk]

Bizarre post, tty.

I'm not trashing Bernie. Bernie's own statements regarding social issues that affect minorities are status quo or retrograde on policies that would address systematic racism. He said "people are tired of political correctness" and went on to falsely describe what political correctness is. Typical old white man who will be good for white people and for others but not on issues of social equality for minorities. His voting record is good, it's just that he's not a leader on issues of social equality.

When Sanders says "people" he means white people in the statement below. I don't think African Americans are exhausted about the fight for their right to move about safely and prosper in this society.

Regarding Trump and the exhausted white people:
“I think he said he will not be politically correct,” Sanders explained. “I think he said some outrageous and painful things, but I think people are tired of the same old politically correct rhetoric, and they believe that he was speaking from his heart and willing to take on everybody.”

Regarding what he think political correctness is:
“It means you have a set of talking points which have been poll-tested and focus-group-tested and that’s what you say rather than what’s really going on. And often, what you are not allowed to say are things which offend very powerful people.”

Don't believe me? Within the first minute of this video of a town hall meeting in December, he says all of that. Note that he very quickly pivots away from this issue. I get the sense that he thinks it is a losing issue for Democrats and he's probably right.

Strawman.

Try again.

He's the only one introducing a universal health care bill this year but you can't help but spend all day trashing him.

And you have the gall to call other people's behavior 'bizarre'?

 

[Fogdog]

the old testament is worth a read just for the tetragrammaton.

where would even you be without Menger and marginslism? opportunity costs, Buisness cycle?

Will you deny then that Hayek was about the only one to predict the crash of 1929 based on monetary expansion? "unproven axiom" indeed.

it's the same old struggle....economics as the science of individual choice vs economics as accumulation of data serving the state.

it's clear which side youre on as you are a proponent of using the state to implement your version of good through a blend of politics as economics, rather than leaving politics out of economics as the Austrians do.

Your philosophy rejects science and math.

 

[Fogdog]

Strawman.

Try again.

He's the only one introducing a universal health care bill this year but you can't help but spend all day trashing him.

And you have the gall to call other people's behavior 'bizarre'?

Sanders is not expecting that bill to go anywhere. He says that's OK. Maybe some day.

Sanders told The Post that healthcare, and support for a single-payer system, is just one issue for voters to consider.
“Is this a litmus test? No, you have to look at where candidates are on many issues,” Sanders said.

“But you’re seeing more and more movement toward ‘Medicare for All.’ When the people are saying we need healthcare for everyone, as more and more Americans come on board, it will become politically possible.”

I'm not trashing him. I'm quoting him. You don't like what he said?

 

[Padawanbater2]

I was specific enough for you to understand. You just don't like my answer.

Why can't you cite a single policy or position that supports your claim that they specifically target "white middle moderates"?

That's been your entire thesis the past few pages, but you can't even cite a single thing to substantiate it?

Bernie is going to finish his draft bill for Universal Healthcare. Bernie isn't hard line about people supporting it. It's all there in black and white. When I read the quotation from the Washington Post interview that was published on August 9 of this year, I see him accepting that this issue won't get passed very soon. It's you who is hard line and obnoxious about denying reality that the US is more conservative than you'd like. Single Payer Healthcare is not a hard line issue for the "Our Revolution" reformers.

What quote are you citing from the WaPo article that leads you to believe "him accepting that this issue won't get passed very soon"? There's only one quote from Sanders in the article and he's not talking about healthcare.

The US is measurably more progressive than conservative based on data you can verify yourself. Universal healthcare in particular is one of the issues that gets bipartisan support across the spectrum

Bernie is giving room in his movement for moderate conservatives

How is he doing that? I've asked you 4 times now. What policies or positions Sanders support that attracts "moderate middle conservatives"? If you can't cite a single policy, your argument doesn't hold water

 

[twostrokenut]

Where do you get this drivel? You're the classic definition of 'kook'.

It clearly doesn't help you understand the world or help with your daily life.

You badly need an actual education. Until you get one, no one who has one will take you seriously- nor should we.

lol my daily life? I'm waiting on ups to drop off a Pittman arm seal for the steering box on my truck and watching you and the rest of the left argue amongst yourselves on which candidate can impliment their version of the labor theory of value better.

what's your education? I know you are retired from the resturaunt service industry or some such. I'm quite sure we all took the same econ college courses.

I suppose it's lack of perspective, not on my part though as I was a big lefty most of my life and still am in most aspects save for monetary policy.

 

[ttystikk]

Why can't you cite a single policy or position that supports your claim that they specifically target "white middle moderates"?

That's been your entire thesis the past few pages, but you can't even cite a single thing to substantiate it?

What quote are you citing from the WaPo article that leads you to believe "him accepting that this issue won't get passed very soon"? There's only one quote from Sanders in the article and he's not talking about healthcare.

The US is measurably more progressive than conservative based on data you can verify yourself. Universal healthcare in particular is one of the issues that gets bipartisan support across the spectrum

How is he doing that? I've asked you 4 times now. What policies or positions Sanders support that attracts "moderate middle conservatives"? If you can't cite a single policy, your argument doesn't hold water

His arguments not only don't hold water, they've been sinking faster than a Houston suburb.

He repeats the same tired claims, his citations are off topic and he's just plain wrong.

He has no good reasons to dislike Sanders. He's just stuck on it.

This is how people who can't keep up with the times react when they are overtaken.

 

[SneekyNinja]

You have no idea where you are.

I didn't equate the two, I said that Bernie would have been better than either of them. I notice you had to Strawman that because you knew you couldn't debate it fairly.

Dumber and dumber, Stinkydigit.

"Tell me all about how either the one you voted for or the one in office would be any better."

Comparing Clinton to Trump, as to the rest, stfu man, you're a cuck.

 

[SneekyNinja]

His arguments not only don't hold water, they've been sinking faster than a Houston suburb.

He repeats the same tired claims, his citations are off topic and he's just plain wrong.

He has no good reasons to dislike Sanders. He's just stuck on it.

This is how people who can't keep up with the times react when they are overtaken.

Again, no-one dislikes Sanders, they only dislike you idiots.

 

[ttystikk]

Again, no-one dislikes Sanders, they only dislike you idiots.

Funny coming from one of the basher clan.

But you just troll, you don't care if you don't make any sense, do you Stinkydigit?

I should charge rent for the real estate i own in your head... But it isn't worth anything.

 

[Fogdog]

Why can't you cite a single policy or position that supports your claim that they specifically target "white middle moderates"?

That's been your entire thesis the past few pages, but you can't even cite a single thing to substantiate it?

What quote are you citing from the WaPo article that leads you to believe "him accepting that this issue won't get passed very soon"? There's only one quote from Sanders in the article and he's not talking about healthcare.

The US is measurably more progressive than conservative based on data you can verify yourself. Universal healthcare in particular is one of the issues that gets bipartisan support across the spectrum

How is he doing that? I've asked you 4 times now. What policies or positions Sanders support that attracts "moderate middle conservatives"? If you can't cite a single policy, your argument doesn't hold water

Sanders distancing himself from "identity politics". What part of "people are tired of political correctness" don't you understand? He never connected or spent much time courting the African American and Hispanic American voters and so this is not a change in stance. He's more vocal about it.

It's the perfect strategy to allow ambiguous systematic racism to continue.

You do know that Trumps win had more to do with racism and sexism than it did about economics, don't you?
http://people.umass.edu/schaffne/schaffner_et_al_IDC_conference.pdf

Also Sanders voters who broke to Trump didn't think white people have advantages over black people. Maybe not kkk types but blind to the effects of racism in this country. Almost the definition of systematic racism.
http://www.npr.org/2017/08/24/545812242/1-in-10-sanders-primary-voters-ended-up-supporting-trump-survey-finds

It's perfectly understandable that Bernie is breaking to the right on social issues like the ones that Black Lives Matter have been making white people uncomfortable over.

 

[Fogdog]

Again, no-one dislikes Sanders, they only dislike you idiots.

LOL

He's crying like a teenage girl who's been told "I like you but don't want to join your facebook friends list."

 

[Fogdog]

His arguments not only don't hold water, they've been sinking faster than a Houston suburb.

He repeats the same tired claims, his citations are off topic and he's just plain wrong.

He has no good reasons to dislike Sanders. He's just stuck on it.

This is how people who can't keep up with the times react when they are overtaken.

LOL

Your ability to objectively read is gone. Or maybe you never had it.

 

[rkymtnman]

He never connected or spent much time courting the African American and Hispanic American voters

you ever been to vermont? there's probably less than 20 black people and 100 hispanics in the whole state. lol.

 

[Fogdog]

you ever been to vermont? there's probably less than 20 black people and 100 hispanics in the whole state. lol.

Even fewer than Oregon? And the African Americans who do live in Vermont say they felt invisible to him. This shouldn't come as a surprise to our Bernie babies. I've been telling them the same thing for about a year now.

 

[Gquebed]

Even fewer than Oregon? And the African Americans who do live in Vermont say they felt invisible to him. This shouldn't come as a surprise to our Bernie babies. I've been telling them the same thing for about a year now.

They quite likely did feel invisible to Bernie...because Bernie tends to avoid pandering to minorities...or to anyone for that matter. Minorties like to be coddled and told theyre special and Bernie just wont. He is old school.

Instead, Bernie goes to the heart of the matter...he tends to draw the line between the haves and the have nots, which include almost all the minorities and the vast majority of white people.

 

[rkymtnman]

Minorties like to be coddled and told theyre special and Bernie just wont.

you making old man Sanders sound like a racist.

i'm not one, but i'm pretty sure minorities want to be thought of and treated as equals.