Going from HPS to LED. Worth it?

[Olive Drab Green]

No you wont be at 900-1000PPFD, if each one of your cobs is putting out 46.6 PAR watts that's all it is putting out, you can bounce and overlap light all you want the only thing you are going to achieve is better use of those PAR watts, your not going to gain more where none exist... You only have 140 PAR watts with 3 of those cobs giving you a "maximum" of 786PPFD in your 2x4 closet and that's with 100% of the light being reflected off your walls

What are you talking about? My lights will be directly over my plants. I easily will be getting full PPFD. The light is easily going to be perfectly optimal. Like I said, you guys will see.

 

[HydoDan]

CXB3590CD36V3500K 3 COBS @2.1A ON 1.813 PROFILE HEATSINK
8 SQ.FT. CANOPY 100% EFFICIENT DRIVER @10 CENTS PER KWH
Total power watts at the wall: 227.0
Cobs power watts: 227
Total voltage forward: 108
Total lumens: 36561
Total PAR watts assuming 10% loss: 102
Total PPF: 474.3
PPFD based on canopy area: 638.16
PAR watts per sq.ft.: 12.75
Cob efficiency: 49.71%
Power watts per sq.ft.: 28.38
Voltage forward per cob: 35.97
Lumens per watt: 161.06

 

[Olive Drab Green]

CXB3590CD36V3500K 3 COBS @2.1A ON 1.813 PROFILE HEATSINK
8 SQ.FT. CANOPY 100% EFFICIENT DRIVER @10 CENTS PER KWH
Total power watts at the wall: 227.0
Cobs power watts: 227
Total voltage forward: 108
Total lumens: 36561
Total PAR watts assuming 10% loss: 102
Total PPF: 474.3
PPFD based on canopy area: 638.16
PAR watts per sq.ft.: 12.75
Cob efficiency: 49.71%
Power watts per sq.ft.: 28.38
Voltage forward per cob: 35.97
Lumens per watt: 161.06

*274w.

 

[Olive Drab Green]

CXB3590CD36V3500K 3 COBS @2.1A ON 1.813 PROFILE HEATSINK
8 SQ.FT. CANOPY 100% EFFICIENT DRIVER @10 CENTS PER KWH
Total power watts at the wall: 227.0
Cobs power watts: 227
Total voltage forward: 108
Total lumens: 36561
Total PAR watts assuming 10% loss: 102
Total PPF: 474.3
PPFD based on canopy area: 638.16
PAR watts per sq.ft.: 12.75
Cob efficiency: 49.71%
Power watts per sq.ft.: 28.38
Voltage forward per cob: 35.97
Lumens per watt: 161.06

The T1-V196 horticultural lamp from Tasty LED use a Vero29 LED emitter driven at 85 watts providing 50% emitter efficiency at full power and higher efficiencies when dimmed.

TECHNICAL INFORMATION:

Total wattage: 95
Lumens: 13,560
PAR watts: 42
PPF: 196
Efficiency: 50%

Emitters: 1 Vero 29C 3500K 90CRI
Current: 1670ma
Watts each: 85

Power supply: Meanwell LPF series
Efficiency: 90-91%

AC Input (C13): 120-240 volts, 50/60Hz, .75amps at 120V
AC output (C14): for connecting multiple units

Dimensions: 6" x 5" x 12"

ACCESSORIES:

-Power cords: Single lamps come with 6 foot 16 gauge primary power cables which are 5-15P to C13. The second and third lamp of the same kind will ship with 3 foot 16 gauge connector cables to daisy chain the lamps. We recommend chaining no more than three lamps on a 120v circuit, When ordering two different lamps, a T2 and a T4 for instance, both will ship with primary power cables. If you have a preference contrary to this scheme please note it in the comments section when placing the order and we will be glad to accommodate.
-Ratchet hangers and hardware: 1 pair
-Optics: 90 degree reflectors

Space usage and light intensity in vegetative and flowering mode:
The recommended minimum and maximum flowering and full cycle footprints are at 500 and 1200 PPFD.
The recommended minimum and maximum vegetative footprints are at 300 and 700 PPFD.
-18" x 18" 932 PPFD
-24" x 24" 524 PPFD
-30" x 30" 336 PPFD

OPERATION:

-The dimmer switch and knob are located beside each other.
-The dimmer switch can be used to flip between the dimming knob's setting and full power.
-Turn the dimmer switch off to insure max brightness.


^This times three. 3 x 18 = 54 square inches. My closet is only 48x24. So 923 PPFD in a 54x54, compensating for both overlap and small area in comparison to intensity in its intended area size, probably more.

 

[Olive Drab Green]

And my other two are similar but use top bin 3500k Cree CXB3590 LEDs.

 

[qballizhere]

Like I said, one more unit should finish covering my entire closet.

View attachment 3824366

come on guys give the know it all a break I mean it took him 4 or 5 weeks to get the plants this tall
Its so comical you have only 4 or 5 grows under your belt and no one can tell you anything you think your a master grower but its all in your mind.

 

[Olive Drab Green]

come on guys give the know it all a break I mean it took him 4 or 5 weeks to get the plants this tall
Its so comical you have only 4 or 5 grows under your belt and no one can tell you anything you think your a master grower but its all in your mind.

No, it's not. With the right amount of light, proper nutes, and proper training, the plant grows itself. It's really not that hard, so you should cut the shit like it's esoteric, occult knowledge that few possess. My lights are optimal, my nutes are optimal, and I'm confident in my ability. So you should probably fuck off.

 

[HydoDan]

The T1-V196 horticultural lamp from Tasty LED use a Vero29 LED emitter driven at 85 watts providing 50% emitter efficiency at full power and higher efficiencies when dimmed.

TECHNICAL INFORMATION:

Total wattage: 95
Lumens: 13,560
PAR watts: 42
PPF: 196
Efficiency: 50%

Emitters: 1 Vero 29C 3500K 90CRI
Current: 1670ma
Watts each: 85

Power supply: Meanwell LPF series
Efficiency: 90-91%

AC Input (C13): 120-240 volts, 50/60Hz, .75amps at 120V
AC output (C14): for connecting multiple units

Dimensions: 6" x 5" x 12"

ACCESSORIES:

-Power cords: Single lamps come with 6 foot 16 gauge primary power cables which are 5-15P to C13. The second and third lamp of the same kind will ship with 3 foot 16 gauge connector cables to daisy chain the lamps. We recommend chaining no more than three lamps on a 120v circuit, When ordering two different lamps, a T2 and a T4 for instance, both will ship with primary power cables. If you have a preference contrary to this scheme please note it in the comments section when placing the order and we will be glad to accommodate.
-Ratchet hangers and hardware: 1 pair
-Optics: 90 degree reflectors

Space usage and light intensity in vegetative and flowering mode:
The recommended minimum and maximum flowering and full cycle footprints are at 500 and 1200 PPFD.
The recommended minimum and maximum vegetative footprints are at 300 and 700 PPFD.
-18" x 18" 932 PPFD
-24" x 24" 524 PPFD
-30" x 30" 336 PPFD

OPERATION:

-The dimmer switch and knob are located beside each other.
-The dimmer switch can be used to flip between the dimming knob's setting and full power.
-Turn the dimmer switch off to insure max brightness.


^This times three. 3 x 18 = 54 square inches. My closet is only 48x24. So 923 PPFD in a 54x54, compensating for both overlap and small area in comparison to intensity in its intended area size, probably more.

Your math is flawed!! I have 6 x 3590 @ 1400ma in a 2x4 tent the ppfd is 938... Use the cob calculator and go by it..
You're making an ass out of yourself with untrue numbers..I know how good they work but your Bullshit is making it hard for all cob owners.. you're on your fifth grow... I've done five grows a year ten years in a row.. you are a newbie act like one..

 

[qballizhere]

No, it's not. With the right amount of light, proper nutes, and proper training, the plant grows itself. It's really not that hard, so you should cut the shit like it's esoteric, occult knowledge that few possess. My lights are optimal, my nutes are optimal, and I'm confident in my ability. So you should probably fuck off.

Never said it was esoteric knowledge but you are right it does take those things and you have already said that you need to add more light so how is that optimal? If it needs more of something its not optimal YET. Stop trying to pretend you have years of growing your just newbie your making it harder for cob growers in general
If it really was so easy to grow there would be so many more doing it.
Here in CO you see so much used equipment for sale from people that tried and failed for one reason or another.

 

[GreenSanta]

come on guys give the know it all a break I mean it took him 4 or 5 weeks to get the plants this tall
Its so comical you have only 4 or 5 grows under your belt and no one can tell you anything you think your a master grower but its all in your mind.

5 grows counting 2 grows at another location (someone else s grow) and we are talking big grows too like 3 or 4 plants each. What s that a year, wait at year 2 they get even worse.

 

[Budley Doright]

"For not knowing what I'm talking about, I seem to have a lot of approval and support."
Ummm not so much really lol.
"Prove to me that I have no idea what I'm talking about?"
Yup ok seems that's happening now lol.
"We'll see what I get at the end of this run. I'll bet it'll drop your jaw."
As soon as I add a few more lights lol.
" I'm putting out PPFD equivalent to 500w (between 400-600w) of Super HPS in a smaller area."
I'm not sure but I think you just proved the math lol.

Like I said, it's like running a marathon that never ends lol.

 

[Budley Doright]

See, if each of my lights averages about 900, plus crossover, and each fixture fills an 18x18, and I have 3, and my closet is only 4x2, I'm actually saturating my closet with more light than it has capacity for, causing reflection from the walls as well. I'm easily going to be between 900 and 1000. PPFD can't go down if the capability exceeds the area given. So fuck all of you.

 

[guerillagrowr]

Except you'll realize when using COBs that HPS doesn't yield more. It's just the LED panel that can't match the HID. COBs can.

Olive Drab... I am brand new to LEDs, so I appreciate the info my friend! Can you tell me more about COBs, or do you have a link to any good articles on those? Any COB's you would recommend to buy, or am I better off building my own?

 

[GreenSanta]

Sure glad I don't need to know all this stuff to grow dankus maximus. High tech lighting might be a future hobby to geek out on some day, but it makes my head hurt right now.
Feels like politics...

I'm here to tell u that u don't need to know anything about high tech lights to own them. Simply buy what most cob users are rocking at this point (cxb3590,vero29...) Once u have them set them up at 40-60 watts per sq ft 18-36 inches from the tops., all there is to know.

 

[Olive Drab Green]

I'm here to tell u that u don't need to know anything about high tech lights to own them. Simply buy what most cob users are rocking at this point (cxb3590,vero29...) Once u have them set them up at 40-60 watts per sq ft 18-36 inches from the tops., all there is to know.

Actually, you can place the Tasty fixtures between 14-16 inches. But yes. And by your calculations, I also have enough light for my closet with 3 lights.

 

[Olive Drab Green]

Olive Drab... I am brand new to LEDs, so I appreciate the info my friend! Can you tell me more about COBs, or do you have a link to any good articles on those? Any COB's you would recommend to buy, or am I better off building my own?

You would be better off building your own if only for money's sake alone. Otherwise, if you aren't electrically inclined (For instance, I know how to rig it, I just never learned to solder and I have hands used to disassembling and cleaning a 240B, not for handling fragile shit) or otherwise don't mind spending the money, you've got:

Tasty
https://www.tastyled.com/

Johnson
https://www.johnsongrowlights.com/

GrowMau5
https://www.cutter.com.au/products.php?cat=MAU5+KITS

Northern
https://northerngrowlights.com/

ALSO, even though COBs are LED technology, the performance of COBs in contrast to LED panels is so vast, you should refer to them separately; that is COB = COB, LED Panel = LED. They really are two different animals.

Your emitter choices are Cree CXB3590s, Vero29C (I think 6th or 7th gen?), and not too familiar with Citizen, but it's either their 1818 or 1212? Your driver will be some configuration of Meanwell's, always.

 

[GreenSanta]

Actually, you can place the Tasty fixtures between 14-16 inches. But yes. And by your calculations, I also have enough light for my closet with 3 lights.

You have to look daily with measuring tape to keep it optimal (between 14-16)
(Joke!!)

Guess what ?? I have plants that sometimes grow to the lights so quick they fry, you can have tops within 8 inches and they ll be fine, so my recommendation to any new grower is shoot for 18-36, got it? I often have lights almost 4 ft from the tops for the first week of flowering.

 

[Olive Drab Green]

You have to look daily with measuring tape to keep it optimal (between 14-16)

Guess what ?? I have plants that sometimes grow to the lights so quick they fry, you can have tops with 8 inches and they ll be fine, so my recommendation to any new grower is shoot for 18-36, got it? I often have lights almost 4 ft from the tops for the first week of flowering.

I wasn't necessarily disagreeing with you, I was just giving the "official recommendation" by that particular vendor. But I see what you mean.

 

[BecauseIgotHigh]

everyone all arguing at which is better, but I don't think none have actual answered the OP's question, gave him a answer on is it worth it the switch? LED evangelists will immediately try to convert you over. Just like those crazy christian people, trying to convert you over to their religion, when you clearly tell them that you're happy with yours but they still pressure you on converting over.. ignorant fucks..

Going through this thread, it looks like its just been jacked by ODG, and whats funny is like I mention above, no one has actually considered answering the OP'S question properly. It's always about efficiency efficiency... well guys I just had a thought.. what about the big commercial growers, say examples the Vietnamese growers. Go tell them to switch to LEDs cobs... they'll tell you go fuck yourself... and still continue with there same setup 600-1000w all the way. When you think of it, it is probably cheaper to use HPS. - how many grows do you think you will do, and actually change bulbs. if you can't afford to spend 20-50 for a new bulbs... you're fucked... and a tight ass..

Also, how much money do we actually save after using these COBS in 3 years? The only reason i went from HPS to COBs, it produces less heat, but still I have to extract the heat somewhere. plant can only use up to about 80000lux. full sunlight gives about 2000umols/sqm2, however only 20% of the light is absorbed - something to do with PAR. rest is heat transfer to some bio chemical process within the plant.

 

[Dankistino]

everyone all arguing at which is better, but I don't think none have actual answered the OP's question, gave him a answer on is it worth it the switch? LED evangelists will immediately try to convert you over. Just like those crazy christian people, trying to convert you over to their religion, when you clearly tell them that you're happy with yours but they still pressure you on converting over.. ignorant fucks..

Going through this thread, it looks like its just been jacked by ODG, and whats funny is like I mention above, no one has actually considered answering the OP'S question properly. It's always about efficiency efficiency... well guys I just had a thought.. what about the big commercial growers, say examples the Vietnamese growers. Go tell them to switch to LEDs cobs... they'll tell you go fuck yourself... and still continue with there same setup 600-1000w all the way. When you think of it, it is probably cheaper to use HPS. - how many grows do you think you will do, and actually change bulbs. if you can't afford to spend 20-50 for a new bulbs... you're fucked... and a tight ass..

Also, how much money do we actually save after using these COBS in 3 years? The only reason i went from HPS to COBs, it produces less heat, but still I have to extract the heat somewhere. plant can only use up to about 80000lux. full sunlight gives about 2000umols/sqm2, however only 20% of the light is absorbed - something to do with PAR. rest is heat transfer to some bio chemical process within the plant.

NO
it's nothing like "the crazy christian people".

"When you think of it, it is probably cheaper to use HPS. - how many grows do you think you will do, and actually change bulbs. if you can't afford to spend 20-50 for a new bulbs... you're fucked... and a tight ass.."

Is that your idea of "think of it"? That's not thnking it's talking out your ass.