Do you believe Americans who work full time should earn a living wage?

[panhead]

My math works fine. You said 50 split 3 ways = 16.666 you also pay a dollar bonus for every hour worked. I figure about 48 weeks at 40 a week... give due to generosity and make it an even 2000.
Do you also help towards any schooling ? Do you give paid vacation and sick days? Did you offer any healthcare ?

Again until you answer my questions posed to you on multiple pages you've hit your limit .

I'll narrow it down to just 2 to make it easy .

1 How much do you pay the Attendant ?

2 Whats the net of the business .

3 questions , i lied , how many attendants a year do you burn thru ?

 

[Fogdog]

i've seen them do exactly this..but do they ever consider:

1. how much it costs to train the new employee?
2. learning curve and how much business they piss off or lose because of 'new employee'?
3. disruption/pick up the slack of office/work environment with 'new employee'?

I've seen the same thing, the response to the pain caused by unabated employee turnover is:

1. Run to the government and complain there are not enough trained workers.
2. Expect the same amount of work gets done with fewer workers
3. Threaten more firings if the work does not get done and if anybody complains
4. Above all blame somebody else and make em pay

 

[Padawanbater2]

I've seen the same thing, the response to the pain caused by unabated employee turnover is:

1. Run to the government and complain there are not enough trained workers.
2. Expect the same amount of work gets done with fewer workers
3. Threaten more firings if the work does not get done and if anybody complains
4. Above all blame somebody else and make em pay

There's always a way in the minds of right wing folk to blame the poor person for begging for equal pay for equal work..

It's a way to sidestep the problem in the minds of the public; blame the little guy, pocket his earnings, then liquidate the assets and start all over leaving thousands out of work.. Just ask Mitt Romney about it..

 

[sheskunk]

You so don't get it. The current minimum wage equals not living wage, you said it, I said it, god only knows how many others said it.. The discussion point is if it would be a good thing to have a designated living wage for 40 or more assigned hours of work, full time workers that do a job that needs to be done. There have been many side line discussions around what kind of work would be reasonable to fit into this category. Perhaps you should do an emergency defibrillator pulse to your frontal lobes, they don't seem to be working.

Since you have decided to resort to personal attacks, after thanking me for not using personal attacks, I am done here.

Want more money? Learn a better skill set.

 

[Padawanbater2]

I am done here.

Fucking tragic!

 

[Fogdog]

Since you have decided to resort to personal attacks, after thanking me for not using personal attacks, I am done here.

Want more money? Learn a better skill set.

goodbye, I'll miss you, well not really

 

[londonfog]

Again until you answer my questions posed to you on multiple pages you've hit your limit .

I'll narrow it down to just 2 to make it easy .

1 How much do you pay the Attendant ?

2 Whats the net of the business .

3 questions , i lied , how many attendants a year do you burn thru ?

1. The lowest gets 11 an hour the highest 17.55

2. Unless you are my accountant. None of your business.

3. None this year. Last year I lost two. One was always late or no show. the other finished school and did what she sat out to do.

 

[Padawanbater2]

 

[UncleBuck]

Actually several tenants in three different states lost out because local idiots keep fucking with my bottom line.

See how that works.

they keep raising property taxes and all you get in return is an educated populace and protection from the police force.

you white folks have it tough.

 

[londonfog]

How much should a person make working the cash register at Walmart ? What about the person who just greets you and checks your bags on the way out ?

 

[panhead]

I'm convinced the answer is unionization. The national union membership in America today is something abysmal, like 10%.. I really need to do a little bit of research on the decline of unions because when membership was high, workers didn't get fucked over so much, now, at an all time low, we haven't seen income inequality like this since the great depression..

I wish i colud like this post 100 times , you didnt just hit the nail you drove that bitch home , i know for a fact unions are the answer , I worked union 32 yrs & rember every job having a union & people lived well , all of us not just the suits , in the 80's i watched unions get busted right & left by right to work bullshit & the government cheered as if it was a victory , what the public & unions werent aware of was a secret organization of ultra wealthy businessmen who banned together to fight unions by spending billions on campaign finance of anti labor politicans who made good on their promises in exchange for further contributions .

We now now this secret lobby as the ABC & they spend ship loads of money convincing the public they cant pay higher union wages , the vast monies spent on anti union propaganda like the anti union films many workers are forced to watch , or the countless billions they funnel to anti labor politicans could be used to bolster worker pay packages to exactly what unions pay , or more .

Ive seen the figures from non union shops for decades so i know they can afford to pay , the problem is they are hell bent on keeping wages low to keep workers hungry for work, the union busting ABC lobby will spend 10 million to keep workers from getting a 50 cent raise , its about control as much as its about money .

 

[Padawanbater2]

How much should a person make working the cash register at Walmart ? What about the person who just greets you and checks your bags on the way out ?

A living wage

You and I seem to have different metrics we use to determine an employee's wage. When it comes to businesses like Walmart, I think it should go without saying a living wage is the least acceptable wage that should be paid, we're talking about the top earner in the country, numero uno. The highest grossing company in America should pay their fucking employees enough so they don't have to go to the government (ME & YOU) to ask "please, sir, can I have another?"... I seriously hope you would agree with that much. As far as mom and pop shops employing less than 10 people, if a "living wage" breaks their business then that's obviously bad for the economy, right? So why don't we devise a system where the mom and pop shops pay as much as they can while the gov. subsidizes the rest? Right now, we pay fuckin' Walmart subsidies to pay their bills, that's bullshit. Transfer that payment to the mom and pop shops and make fuckin' Walmart pay what the fuck they should to their employees. Since Walmart is the largest employer in America, that will SUBSTANTIALLY decrease the amount of government subsidies paid out to mom and pop shop employees who can't pay their bills due to the increasing minimum wage paid. Problem fuckin' solved.

FUCK WALMART.

 

[Fogdog]

I'm convinced the answer is unionization. The national union membership in America today is something abysmal, like 10%.. I really need to do a little bit of research on the decline of unions because when membership was high, workers didn't get fucked over so much, now, at an all time low, we haven't seen income inequality like this since the great depression..

Go ahead and let right wing idiots tell you that's just a coincidence... The thinking man knows better..

One of Bernie Sanders top priorities is reestablishing union bargaining power for the American working middle class. None of the critics in this thread will touch on why they think improving conditions for the middle class is a bad idea because none of them want to look bad, like they're fighting for the super wealthy and against the middle class. They think their GOP candidates fight for the middle class, that the democrats raise their taxes and the republicans lower them.. Need I bring up the county in.. I think it was Tennessee, that's 95% white, 99% require government assistance, and 99.? voted republican in 2012? Fucking embarrassing..

I've said this in a different thread so I'm probably repeating myself too much. A good picture of what happened to the white vote in the south can be found in a photo taken during the sit in protest at Walgreens in Jackson Mississippi in 1963:

The young men surrounding the protesters were sons of solid south Democrats. Over the past 40 years, southern white baby-boomer men switched to the Republican party in huge numbers. The process began after Nixon appealed to the Silent Majority and accelerated during Reagan's coded words that appealed to racist whites in the south that had lost their power base in the Democratic party. I'd venture to say that practically all those young men are now southern Republicans. By winning this sector of votes and guaranteeing them a place at the table when it comes time to hand out favors, they will vote against their own economic interests to protect their Christian, white community. This is a classic example of how an elite ruling class divides a population to smooth their path to power.

 

[panhead]

1. The lowest gets 11 an hour the higher $17 an hour

Amazing simply amazing , you can afford to pay $17 an hour when your & my income is 1/1000 th of Shitmart or McDonalds ,yet you preach utter collapse if those businesses pay that much .

You pay $17 an hour for a laundromat attendant & i pay $17 an hour to a self storage unit manager , both extremely low in skill level but somehow our unskilled labor force we are able to absorb & remain profitable but multi billion dollar corporations cant do what we do.

Why do you think corporations who have ceo's with 100 million dollar golden parachutes cant afford to pay the same wages us two schmucks pay ?

 

[panhead]

How much should a person make working the cash register at Walmart ? What about the person who just greets you and checks your bags on the way out ?

Atleast as much as self storage clerks & coin op laundromat workers make .

I think the greeter should make more than the manager of Shitmart , who in their right mind wants to say Welcome To Shitmart I Love You to 20,000 morons a day , that jobs one step up from dressing up in the chicken suit & dancing around outside KFC .

 

[Padawanbater2]

Amazing simply amazing , you can afford to pay $17 an hour when your & my income is 1/1000 th of Shitmart or McDonalds ,yet you preach utter collapse if those businesses pay that much .

You pay $17 an hour for a laundromat attendant & i pay $17 an hour to a self storage unit manager , both extremely low in skill level but somehow our unskilled labor force we are able to absorb & remain profitable but multi billion dollar corporations cant do what we do.

Why do you think corporations who have ceo's with 100 million dollar golden parachutes cant afford to pay the same wages us two schmucks pay ?

I'm glad there are good people out there like you. I guarantee your employees appreciate it

 

[Padawanbater2]

Where have all the critics run?

 

[Padawanbater2]

Amazing simply amazing , you can afford to pay $17 an hour when your & my income is 1/1000 th of Shitmart or McDonalds ,yet you preach utter collapse if those businesses pay that much .

You pay $17 an hour for a laundromat attendant & i pay $17 an hour to a self storage unit manager , both extremely low in skill level but somehow our unskilled labor force we are able to absorb & remain profitable but multi billion dollar corporations cant do what we do.

Why do you think corporations who have ceo's with 100 million dollar golden parachutes cant afford to pay the same wages us two schmucks pay ?

What led you to adopt these kinds of business practices? You're a somewhat older dude, you grew up in the height of Reaganomics, so what made you want to pay your employees what you felt was a legitimate wage at your own expense, out of your own pocket? Why do you think so many others have rejected your style of business?

 

[Harrekin]

Your question isnt as cut & dried as yes or no.

I dont think that small private owned businesses who are making low yeild returns from their business should be mandated to pay a wage that will shut their doors .

I also dont think huge corporations like Shitmart should be allowed to pay as low a wage as businesses like Londonfogs stores , the huge corporate companies allready recieve tax breaks & government incentives that most small business owners do not recieve .

I do not think wildly profitable business should be able to take advantage of the minimum wage laws , if they are allowed to pay the same wages as small private business then all the incentives they recieve in tax breaks & low to non existant property tax rates should be taxen away from them .

I can't disagree with that.

I also would pay the best price I could for solid employees, I just don't feel I should dictate to others how to run their business.

I guess I could poach underpaid talent from elsewhere in that scenario too.

 

[Harrekin]

Atta boy, I knew you wouldn't let me down

Here, this might be more palatable for you;

● Make work pay by increasing the minimum wage, empowering unions to bargain collectively, ending abusive scheduling practices for hourly workers, getting people the overtime pay they deserve, ensuring equal pay for equal work and making sure employers follow the law and respect the rights of workers.

● End the squeeze on working parents by passing a paid family leave requirement and investing in child care, after-school programs and extended learning days. Let families with children have a chance to balance careers with quality time together.

● Ensure everyone can get a great education without drowning in debt. Rein in the cost of college and allow families to refinance student loans at lower rates. Give every child access to full-day pre-kindergarten. Education is still the best ticket to the middle class.

● Focus on research and innovation needed to develop the technologies of the future. Investments in medical and scientific research let us build whole new industries and give us the chance to create good jobs right here in America.

● Invest in infrastructure — in roads, bridges, rail, water, power and broadband. Businesses can’t grow if the foundation crumbles beneath them. A 21st-century economy needs 21st-century infrastructure.

● Strengthen and expand Social Security, not just for today’s seniors but also for today’s young people. Work is changing. A strong Social Security system will ensure that all workers, no matter the number of jobs they piece together during their careers, can count on a secure retirement.

● Strengthen the rules of the marketplace. We don’t build a future by turning the biggest banks loose to do whatever they want, and markets don’t create value when corporations can cheat people or roll over their upstart competition.

● Promote fair trade by embracing only those trade policies that strengthen our economy, create good jobs with good wages and establish fair rules of the road for companies around the world. Our trade agreements shouldn’t help multinational companies gut environmental, health and safety standards here and abroad under the guise of promoting commerce.

● Reform the tax code by ending the billions in tax breaks for corporations shipping jobs overseas and big oil companies, while leveling the playing field so that millionaires and billionaires pay their fair share.

Pick one of those points and tell me what's wrong with it

I mean, if you want to be part of the adult conversation that is. If instead you just want to call poor people with two or three jobs lazy, or if you want to call college graduates with degrees uneducated, by all means, feel free to keep that right wing bullshit to yourself for the remainder of this discussion.

Thanks

Same goes for @Uncle Ben & @MuyLocoNC

You keep picking the wrong fight, genius.

We already have all that shit here

You need to stop picking on the "rich" tho, fuck the corporations for their fair share of taxes and let individuals all pay the same rate.

What's more?

10% of 20k

Or

10% of 2 mill?

That sounds pretty fair to me.