A great explaination of why our contry is going to the shitter.

UncleBuck

UncleBuck

Well-Known Member
earnest_voice said:
The AFRICOM commander at the time (Gen. Ham) didn't have direct control over assets assigned to joint special operations command JSOC. He only has control over assets from special operations command who are in his AO. JSOC became their own 3 start command back in '08 i believe and their orders come directly from National Security Council/SecDef and higher.
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good job, armchair patton.

tell us more about how you were privy to getting the info that got bin laden.
 
Red1966

Red1966

Well-Known Member
AlecTheGardener said:
FUCK.

The DOJ Report is 514 pages long!

I hopefully find specifics.

So far it appears that the actual operations started to take place in 2009.

I am reading further into the report currently.
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Different operations. The first used guns with tracking devices in them and was done conjointly with the Mexican government. It was halted when it was discovered the cartel was removing the tracking devices. The second used no tracking devices, many more guns, and was kept hidden from the Mexican government.
 
Rob Roy

Rob Roy

Well-Known Member
Red1966 said:
The biggest, meanest, or best armed.
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They usually end up as the people that get their way, but getting your way is not the same as having an intrinsic right to do something.

I would submit that NOBODY has a right to make another serve them. Following that path sets a FOUNDATION of a peaceful society Since no individual has that right, no collection of individuals has that right either.

The answer to the question is obvious, that's why Uncle Poopy Pants and others cannot / will not ever answer it.

It exposes that at the foundation of many things which they think are "good" are actually based in something not good. A utilitarian argument, the kind used by sycophants, and government is so wonderful types, is one that ignores the means and only focuses on the result.

Which of course is a biased way of looking at things as the means IS part of the process and should not be looked at as a separate thing from the result. In other words, when you initiate aggression against another person to achieve something you perceive as good, you can't simply ignore the initiated aggression as if it never occurred, that is if you still want to be considered a rational person.

Hence, coercive government and all that it spawns is a piece of shit on a fast food bathroom floor.
 
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jahbrudda

jahbrudda

Well-Known Member
AlecTheGardener said:
:D

I was reading the wrong report!

Yeah it started in 2006.
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"gun walking" is a term contrived by the media.

Under Bush there was a gun tracing program called Operation Wide Receiver where a small amount of guns were equipped with tracking chips to monitor their movements.
The Obama administration's attempts to claim that Fast and Furious was a continuation of the same program under Bush has been debunked over and over.

Here are the stark differences between Wide Receiver and Fast and Furious:

Wide Receiver - Only 200 -300 guns were used in total
Fast and Furious - over 2,000 guns

Wide Receiver - used RFID chips to track the guns
Fast and Furious - no tracing of these guns

Wide Receiver - ended in 2007
Fast and Furious - began in 2009 and allowed 1,400 guns to disappear.

Wide Receiver - Zero deaths resulted from this program
Fast and Furious - A minimum of 200 Mexican civilians and 2 US Federal Agents died as a result of Fast and Furious..
 
overgrowem

overgrowem

Well-Known Member
Red1966 said:
Different operations. The first used guns with tracking devices in them and was done conjointly with the Mexican government. It was halted when it was discovered the cartel was removing the tracking devices. The second used no tracking devices, many more guns, and was kept hidden from the Mexican government.
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Red you've missed, but I'm happy to see you are giving thought to this issue. Very few have this thing figured out. for some reason those with a voice won't use it and I can't even twitter, making it very hard for me to reach those that can get the story out. If your understanding on this changes perhaps you and the readers of this thread will help spread the word. Rather than just telling the story in 2 sentences and maybe being thought nuts, I would like to lay out a fact or two and present some info that is known about the operation, get thread followers input, and bring them to the truth as I believe it to be. Let me say that I have followed events in Mexico closely for 5 or 6 years so I have a base for my beliefs. (1).The Mex. gov. did know of Fast & Furious( a borderland beat referance) but could NEVER admit it.The easy start to this is (2).Why was there no tracking,some would be better than none,(3)Why were there no arrests? They couldn't build a case after more than a thousand gun purchases?(4). Why did they allow such a large number of guns to cross the border. If the thread follower will feed back on these points i will try to advance the story and You may also see this story in a light I believe to be the truth,
 
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N

NoDrama

Well-Known Member
You can just build your own AR15, no serial number needed, legal. If you have a drill press and a mailing address it is all you need.
 
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