Who is Fascist?

medicineman said:

Talk about the harbinger of gloom. according to you, there is no hope, everything has been tried and failed. I see the situation with a little less rancor.

Click to expand...

The repukes have had it their way for 10-15 years, with the little guy taking it up the ass. Now there comes a chance to reverse this trend with the peoples choice, Obama, the prince of hope, the pendulum swings.

Click to expand...

Capitalism has run rampant over the land and all the main players are so fucking spoiled and corrupt that it will be a battle royal to take this land back for the people, but I say Obama is the right man to start the ball rolling. The rich elites have had it their way way too long, sitting in their mansions sucking on 100 year old scotch talking about how the masses need more control, this shit has to change or the masses will end up as more like slaves than workers.

Click to expand...

undertheice said:

ah yes; capitalism, the great evil.
it's time to wake up and smell the truth. capitalism run rampant is just what we need. capitalism without the restraints of an interfering government, without artificial limits and ill conceived bail-outs. a capitalism that allows the people to decide what is best instead of a few idiots who lied their way into office. the balances inherent in true capitalism only work if it is left alone to wend its way through its various stages. the monopolies and robber barons of old were born of government interference, the failures of the free market are born of those same meddlings. when capitalism is left to its own devices it is the people who determine the final outcome. those rich elites cannot maintain their lifestyles without the people. without consumers and workers they would starve in their mansions. the power of those consumers and those workers would be able to control prices and wages if it weren't for a meddlesome government. alas, that power has been stolen by the greed of our elected officials, the very ones whose lies you still believe.

Click to expand...

undertheice said:

this isn't gloom and i never said that everything has been tried and resulted in failure. this is the reality of the situation and i said that our system brings to the top mostly those so insipid that they are incapable of taking the road less traveled. the halls of government are so filled with these dullards that original ideas are immediately discounted as too frightening for the voters to even comprehend.

you just don't get it, do you? republican or democrat, it doesn't mean a thing. they keep running around in circles with the same dozen or so ideas, repackaging them as needed, and selling them to the people as if they were the greatest thing since sliced bread. your pitiful prince of hope, selling empty promises to a mind numbed populace, is merely following in the footsteps of other failures. he has nothing new. his rhetoric is the same socialist crap spewed by stalin and mao, just couched in gentler terms to fool the pseudo-intellectuals and appease those of his colleagues who aren't yet ready to embrace that vision of the future. the pendulum is merely spinning in place.

ah yes; capitalism, the great evil.
it's time to wake up and smell the truth. capitalism run rampant is just what we need. capitalism without the restraints of an interfering government, without artificial limits and ill conceived bail-outs. a capitalism that allows the people to decide what is best instead of a few idiots who lied their way into office. the balances inherent in true capitalism only work if it is left alone to wend its way through its various stages. the monopolies and robber barons of old were born of government interference, the failures of the free market are born of those same meddlings. when capitalism is left to its own devices it is the people who determine the final outcome. those rich elites cannot maintain their lifestyles without the people. without consumers and workers they would starve in their mansions. the power of those consumers and those workers would be able to control prices and wages if it weren't for a meddlesome government. alas, that power has been stolen by the greed of our elected officials, the very ones whose lies you still believe.

how can i convince you that your hero is just another tool to separate you from your power - or should i just give up. wealth redistribution is just another artificial limit, government give-aways are just more theatrics to steal from those who have managed to succeed, socialist institutions are just feeding grounds for bureaucratic blood suckers. something for nothing does not exist, no matter who promises it to you.

Click to expand...

Inneedofbuds said:

I find it hilarious that you site Obama for empty rhetoric. Did you read your own post? You've eloquently stated absolutely nothing at all.

Click to expand...

Inneedofbuds said:

I find it hilarious that you site Obama for empty rhetoric. Did you read your own post? You've eloquently stated absolutely nothing at all.

Click to expand...

ccodiane said:

Alas, Conservatism!

Click to expand...

undertheice said:

no, this is the way to the downfall of an easily corruptible system. without government support, corporate america is as doomed as the dodo. when the people are allowed to use their power for change they invariably tear down that which oppresses them and that is the way to the workers' state. conservatives have long protected the rabid greed of conglomerates and faceless corporations. without that protection and in the face of a truly free market their obscene profit taking would be curbed and smaller, more consumer and worker friendly organizations would be able to compete.

it's just a theory, but a sound one. and one of my favorites.

Click to expand...

undertheice said:

....but in this case there was a bit of meat. perhaps your lack of understanding is born of the fact that you don't like the message. i'll make it nice and simple for you and i'll even use small words.

the bad men are doing the same thing over and over again and hoping you won't notice (seems they have a pretty good chance of getting away with it ). the bad men are keeping you from choosing what's best for you by making stupid rules. the bad men are on both sides and are fooling you into believing they are different. the bad men are getting rich and you are getting poor.

now here's a cookie, go out and play.

Click to expand...

Inneedofbuds said:

do you have any reasons for saying he'll tax my ass into oblivion? You're also taking the bombing people in Pakistan terribly out of context. Obama was stating that instead of starting false wars, we could use smart weapons to destroy terrorists. He was talking about using precision bombing to take out Al Qaeda in Pakistan rather than the current tactics of bomb first, find terrorists later. Pushing business towards clean energy practices won't lose jobs, it will create them, especially since a huge potion of oil jobs are already given to engineers over seas. I think the last two you just kind of threw in there. I mean, you've given no basis whatsoever. You sound more like an angry teenager than someone interested in a political debate. If we're fucked anyway, stop talking about it.

Click to expand...

medicineman said:

How many countries have universal health care that aren't communist? Oh that's right, about thirty, so we will flip right into communism as soon as the first non-insured person gets medical, Genious. You are so fucking paranoid. This country will never go communist, It may go more socialist, but capitalism is here to stay., Tell me oh wise one, you think helping the less fortunate (school lunches for poor children that may be the one decent meal they get all day) is corruptible and communistic. What is your status in life. Do you own a corporation or are you one of the duped. Who says a corporate controlled state is any better than a state controlled corporation, why can't they exist separately within the confines of the same country, with the greed factor controlled by a board of employee-citizens. I believe the best system would be an employee owned corporation, with net profit limited to the COLA+5%, and an independent accouting firm to do the math. Excess profit would be used to better the community, not feather the pockets of grossly overpaid CEOs. I don't have all the answers, but a better wealth distribution system needs to be implemented. All the "A" type personalities have run rampant over this land for far too long. It has to do with the football mentality, the kick ass and take names mentality, damn the torpedos, full steam ahead philosophy. Maybe we need to take a look at what we've really done to America with the greed and avarice of the current system and start at the kindergarten level and teach helping one another is more important than outperforming each other. This is the basis of humanity. Helping each other instead of learning how to tackle the guy with the ball. It's very basic stuff and will take at least two generations but it is do-able.

Click to expand...

mockingbird131313 said:

Without corporate support, government is as doomed as the dodo. Corporations pay an enormous amount of taxes to a wasteful government.

The real problem is corporate and government leadership. The velocity of the M1 money supply is out of control. People have a very low savings rate. The government spends much more than it takes in. The printing presses are running full tilt, printing $. Finally, few average people invest in corporations anymore. So, boards of directors run wild.

All of these things are issues that have changed in the last 40 years. What works best is what was, not what is.
</IMG>

Click to expand...

undertheice said:

no, this is the way to the downfall of an easily corruptible system. without government support, corporate america is as doomed as the dodo. when the people are allowed to use their power for change they invariably tear down that which oppresses them and that is the way to the workers' state. conservatives have long protected the rabid greed of conglomerates and faceless corporations. without that protection and in the face of a truly free market their obscene profit taking would be curbed and smaller, more consumer and worker friendly organizations would be able to compete.

it's just a theory, but a sound one. and one of my favorites.

Click to expand...

ccodiane said:

Again, I think you speak, generally, of some so-called conservative Republicans, not Conservatives. I believe that free market systems are self correcting. It is government intervention that hinders the natural, and desirable, corrections.

Click to expand...

7xstall said:

i agree that "Free Lunch for the Suffering Poor Kids" sounds all nice but that school lunch program is just more corruption and waste! only the insiders are on the list to bid, they have to meet all kinds of expensive government requirements to be on the list. remember how the FCC basically wiped out small radio stations in the mid-90s?? same thing here. he wants to Authoritatively choke it down to only the companies that "play", forget the small businesses and also forget the state's own very effective school lunch programs and forget their liberty to develop new policies on an as needed basis!

at my boy's school there is already a state law telling them to put fruits and vegetables on the tray - even if the kid doesn't want it! in other words, they HAVE to throw food away. that's just what we need on a nationwide basis: more food imports from SA and china on money we borrowed so we can throw it away. strong economy on the way!

you already know what i believe about the "rule" of corporations OR government. neither is fit to rule unless the people are simply too lazy to do it themselves.

also, it seems cruel to pull the most gifted people down to the level of the average. maybe that's just me, but i don't see how letting people flourish automatically means someone will be trampled. that's absurd.




.

Click to expand...