White House Response to The New York Times Editorial Board's Call for Federal Marijuana Legalization

NLXSK1

NLXSK1

Well-Known Member
SmokeyDan said:
Ok, no one is saying that those are in your head. Those are the result of physical dependence, which is physical.

Rehab provides a cure to physical dependence. After your 28 days you feel great again.

Yet over half are back on their substance within days of returning home. There are no physical symptoms driving you to use after 28 days in rehab. It is all between your ears at that point and this is addiction.

My brother does anything, but he snorts the fuck out of roxies. It's a pain pill.

I talk to him about it. He still has intense cravings sometimes. After six months. This is called PAWS, post acute withdrawal syndrome. These feelings last from 18 to 24 months before they start to fade, and they're never gone forever.

If addiction was over when the feeling bad stopped, success rates among addicts would be much higher.

You can have withdrawal without being an addict, and you can be an addict and never use enough to become physically dependent.

At this point I'm not arguing with you to change your mind. I'm trying to get you to understand this counter intuitive relationship between the two. You don't seem to understand it.
Click to expand...
I have been addicted to alcohol and recovered. You by your own admission have never been addicted to anything but have a brother that is not cured.

You dont understand who is the teacher here and who is the student here.

What you are trying to teach me is stuff I already learned is bullshit through living it.

Your brother is trying to escape reality and he needs to face whatever it is inside him that makes him want to do that. Once the pain is gone he would not suffer PAWS or anything else because he wouldnt have triggers inside his head that make him want to run and hide in any drug that he can find...

Unless he chooses to address the shit in his head that makes him want to escape then he will never NOT be an addict.

If the industry treated the underlying reasons why addicts are addicts then the success rate among addicts would be much higher. But it isnt about curing anyone, it is about the money...

If there was money in people being sober then the failure rate wouldnt be 95% I guarantee you that...
 
Harrekin

Harrekin

Well-Known Member
SmokeyDan said:
What you propose is how we do it now, the two exceptions are that our current percentage rates for income earned is different from your proposal. Also we have a host of credits and deductions that complicate things.

A graduated income tax is not my first choice, but what makes ours so fucked up is all those deductions and loop holes.

I would have the 50% rate a little higher, 250k isn't as much as it sounds. We're all middle class until a certain point closer to 1 million. The more money you make, the more you spend, and a family making 80k has most of the same stuff the 250k family has, the difference is a 60 thousand dollar car instead of a 20 thousand dollar one, so on and so fourth.

All this tax is from the federal government, those fees you mention are from state and local. They need to be funded too.

Europe uses a VAT tax. I like consumption taxes. I live in a state that has no income and only sales taxes. We do have a form of capital gains tax. But you control how much tax you pay.

There is a consumption tax plan out there that is very well done. I like it. It has no chance because most people can't seem to understand it and most people are scared of it for something that isn't applicable to it. For instance, I know a guy that don't like it because it eliminates the mortgage interest deduction. He can't fathom there will be no income tax to deduct from. Our current system is so ingrained that people can't think outside of it.
Click to expand...
Europe is a poor example, why?

Because we have VAT and income tax and 100 other taxes.
 
SmokeyDan

SmokeyDan

Well-Known Member
Being an addict makes you no more an expert on addiction than being a drug deal makes you an expert in pharmacology.

I'm sorry you used to drink a lot, I'm glad you stopped. That don't make your opinion on what addiction is any more valid. Your input on how to stop is worthwhile, but the field has a vocabulary and you don't know it.
 
NLXSK1

NLXSK1

Well-Known Member
SmokeyDan said:
Being an addict makes you no more an expert on addiction than being a drug deal makes you an expert in pharmacology.

I'm sorry you used to drink a lot, I'm glad you stopped. That don't make your opinion on what addiction is any more valid. Your input on how to stop is worthwhile, but the field has a vocabulary and you don't know it.
Click to expand...

I never claimed to be an expert on addiction. It is you that is on the soap box attempting to teach us the truth... LOL!!!

Me being an addict gives me a much better perspective IMO than someone who has only viewed it from the outside.

You want to talk to me about the vocabulary of the field while missing that the entire field is simply set up to get more money from you and it has no significant effect. You want to ignore my points about addressing the underlying problems to remove the addiction.

You are an enabler. You would rather deal with the symptoms instead of the issue.

You are still wrong about physical vs psychological addiction and science is on our side. It isnt my job to fix you though. Have a great day!!
 
SmokeyDan

SmokeyDan

Well-Known Member
I'm ready to agree to disagree also, I don't care near as much as the number of posts on this topic would imply.

But with regard to your last topic, if I'm wrong about "physical addiction" (chemical dependence) and "psychological addiction" (just plane old regular addiction) then anyone who has ever bothered looking into it is also wrong. Keep in mind these were independent psychologists.
 
NLXSK1

NLXSK1

Well-Known Member
SmokeyDan said:
I'm ready to agree to disagree also, I don't care near as much as the number of posts on this topic would imply.

But with regard to your last topic, if I'm wrong about "physical addiction" (chemical dependence) and "psychological addiction" (just plane old regular addiction) then anyone who has ever bothered looking into it is also wrong. Keep in mind these were independent psychologists.
Click to expand...
Do you understand the field of Psychology? Can you figure out why there might be a profit motive for labeling something? Do you know how many billions of dollars are made per year for people suffering from PTSD? From ADHD? From Depression?? From Anxiety? Label something and you can make a profit off of it...

The concepts I am trying to pass on to you (that the industry is a lie) are simply being ignored by you as is all the 1st person data plus scientific data to show that there is no physical dependence to marijuana. You are not listening, you are not thinking, you are simply repeating what was told to you by people invested in making money off of your brother perpetually.

Good luck with that!!
 
SmokeyDan

SmokeyDan

Well-Known Member
I'm sure there is a profit motive. However I think there are enough people who join these fields who simply want to help people that they would blow the whistle on the big conspiracy you are hinting at.

It is a popular conspiracy theory in every thing. They won't cure diabetes, cancer, or anything because treatment earns more money.
 
Dr Kynes

Dr Kynes

Well-Known Member
SmokeyDan said:
I'm ready to agree to disagree also, I don't care near as much as the number of posts on this topic would imply.

But with regard to your last topic, if I'm wrong about "physical addiction" (chemical dependence) and "psychological addiction" (just plane old regular addiction) then anyone who has ever bothered looking into it is also wrong. Keep in mind these were independent psychologists.
Click to expand...
you have it bass ackward.

"Addiction" is a physiological mechanism ( often with a psychological component) which results in PHYSICAL withdrawal symptoms

"Habituation" is a psychological dependence or compulsion without physiological symptoms, save those which are psychosomatic.

only substances which produce physiological dependence are "addictive" while ANYTHING can be "habit forming", even brushing your teeth or flushing the toilet after you drop a deuce.

back in the 80's it took me weeks to break the long ingrained habit of flushing the toilet after i piss, when a calif water conservation campaign drafted the slogan "if it's brown, send it down, if it's yellow let it mellow"

even cracking your knuckles can be habit forming, or breaking the pull tab off your pop cans, or peeling the label off your beer bottle, or clicking your chips at the poker table, or rotating your joint three times before lighting it.

habits are psychological, not physiological.

addictions are primarily physiological, but often have a psychological component.
 
N

NoDrama

Well-Known Member
SmokeyDan said:
I'm sure there is a profit motive. However I think there are enough people who join these fields who simply want to help people that they would blow the whistle on the big conspiracy you are hinting at.

It is a popular conspiracy theory in every thing. They won't cure diabetes, cancer, or anything because treatment earns more money.
Click to expand...
Helping people is great and all, but after you lose your house, lose 40 pounds from not eating and have the IRS after you for taxes not paid, you find the money incentive almost too easily. If you have children that you love you don't get yourself into that situation in the first place, you sell yourself for the money so your kids can eat. The only way a person can live with very little money is someone who does not have any debt.

In the USA, every dollar in existence is someone elses debt.
 
tip top toker

tip top toker

Well-Known Member
Dr Kynes said:
nobody gives a shit "what you call addiction"

addiction is well defined, and you dont get to change that definition because you dont like the choices others make.

maybe Ricky Williams was a rasta and refused to give up his religious beliefs for a football contract.

maybe he was already feeling the effects of football's crippling punishment, and ddecided to quit while he was ahead.

maybe he was afraid he would be drafted by the Cleveland Browns or the Detroit Lions, and would rather work at Wendy's, cleaning up bucky's shit than live in either of those hellholes.

you just dont know.
Click to expand...
And the definition of addiction clearly shows that you can be addicted to cannabis.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Top