VPD or small pot issues.

I had two plants in solo cups. They started displaying symptoms (bottom leaves were turning crispy brown, leaves were wilting downwards). Now. These plants were both too big for the solos (they overgrew the cups) AND my vpd was way off (high temp and low rh leading to a high vpd number).

This is what the plants looked like.



They got a bit bigger in those cups, and the browning on the leaves spread more (just on those leaves affected). I then transplanted AND turned light intensity down to get temps around 75 and rh of 50 to 55 (best i can do atm).

Three days after transplanting, and a day after turning the light down, they looked like this.






Im trying to deduce whether my issue was high vpd number or the plants didnt like the cups (they got a bit bigger in those cups before transplanting). Roots looked like this at transplant.



What do you guys think. Wouldnt a high vpd number equate to leaves curling inwards and not drooping down like that? And could my plants being left too long in the cups cause that?

They now look like this.

You couldn’t have waited much longer to transplant. Did you break up the plug in the solo cups? Or did you just drop it in? If you didn’t break it up then be patient.

you were probably overwatering in the cups, transplanting helps because that extra media draws the water away from the root ball. Plants look good now.

NOT VPD
Rootbound

Rurumo said:

you were probably overwatering in the cups, transplanting helps because that extra media draws the water away from the root ball. Plants look good now.

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Thats exactly what i thought. They are at a friends house, as i cant grow here. He waters for me on the days i cant make it. When they were still small in their cups, he told me how much water he had put, and i told him it was way too much for how small they were. So you think that the over-watering plus the small cup compounded the issues?

Herb & Suds said:

NOT VPD
Rootbound

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Thats what i was leaning towards too. Over-watering plus the small solocups/plants wanting to burst past said cups. What kind of symptoms would a high vpd number cause exactly. I haven't been able to find anything too clear on the subject. I know it means increase of nutrient uptake/closing of stomata, but is there anything else? I would have imagined that high vpd would cause curling upwards and taco.

hotrodharley said:

You couldn’t have waited much longer to transplant. Did you break up the plug in the solo cups? Or did you just drop it in? If you didn’t break it up then be patient.

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I know XD by plug, do you mean like a jiffy seed thing? Cause yeah, i just dropped seed in solo/promix.

Apocalyptical said:

Thats what i was leaning towards too. Over-watering plus the small solocups/plants wanting to burst past said cups. What kind of symptoms would a high vpd number cause exactly. I haven't been able to find anything too clear on the subject. I know it means increase of nutrient uptake/closing of stomata, but is there anything else? I would have imagined that high vpd would cause curling upwards and taco.

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Always look to common issues
The stuff many people think are the problem is because they made the mistakes

Don't know for sure on VPD but it tends to wilt plants
But it isn't root related and repotting wouldn't have fixed it

Apocalyptical said:

I know XD by plug, do you mean like a jiffy seed thing? Cause yeah, i just dropped seed in solo/promix.

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I mean the root plug. Certainly it was one lump. Did you manually break this up to free the roots? If not try it next time. Watch your transplants quickly take off.

Herb & Suds said:

Always look to common issues
The stuff many people think are the problem is because they made the mistakes

Don't know for sure on VPD but it tends to wilt plants
But it isn't root related and repotting wouldn't have fixed it

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i didnt just repot though. In OP, i explained how i also lowered my temp and raised my rh from the extremes it was at (80f and 20 to 30rh). Now it sits around 75f and 50 to 60 rh. The plants looked better three days after transplanting, and one day after lowering light intensity to control temps/rh. Why im trying to eliminate through deduction of symptoms as to which it actually was. Im not sure lmao -_- buddy says its vpd, but im leaning towards over-watering and needing to repot. Ill keep scouring for vpd info/high vpd symptoms.

Hotrod means this https://davesgarden.com/guides/articles/fluffing-roots-carefully-in-transplanting

Apocalyptical said:

i didnt just repot though. In OP, i explained how i also lowered my temp and raised my rh from the extremes it was at (80f and 20 to 30rh). Now it sits around 75f and 50 to 60 rh. The plants looked better three days after transplanting, and one day after lowering light intensity to control temps/rh. Why im trying to eliminate through deduction of symptoms as to which it actually was. Im not sure lmao -_- buddy says its vpd, but im leaning towards over-watering and needing to repot. Ill keep scouring for vpd info/high vpd symptoms.

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What are your buddies credentials?

hotrodharley said:

I mean the root plug. Certainly it was one lump. Did you manually break this up to free the roots? If not try it next time. Watch your transplants quickly take off.

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Ahhh i see what you mean. Untangling any clumps of roots in order to speed up the process. No i didnt. Something to try next time. Is this for extreme cases like mine? Or generally. I operated under the assumption that its best not to disturb roots as much as possible.

Herb & Suds said:

What are your buddies credentials?

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Lmao nothing really XD were both pretty much just starting indoors.

Herb & Suds said:

NOT VPD
Rootbound

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Apocalyptical said:

i didnt just repot though. In OP, i explained how i also lowered my temp and raised my rh from the extremes it was at (80f and 20 to 30rh). Now it sits around 75f and 50 to 60 rh. The plants looked better three days after transplanting, and one day after lowering light intensity to control temps/rh. Why im trying to eliminate through deduction of symptoms as to which it actually was. Im not sure lmao -_- buddy says its vpd, but im leaning towards over-watering and needing to repot. Ill keep scouring for vpd info/high vpd symptoms.

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@hotrodharley and @Herb & Suds are right. This is because you were root bound. I grow completely outside the VPD envelope. I run a 105 canopy most of the summer. So don't worry about VPD yet, worry about the basics. VPD Is something to be concerned about when you can easily get a plant to harvest and are tuning your grow up.

Apocalyptical said:

Ahhh i see what you mean. Untangling any clumps of roots in order to speed up the process. No i didnt. Something to try next time. Is this for extreme cases like mine? Or generally. I operated under the assumption that its best not to disturb roots as much as possible.

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Do it every time. Also recommend sprinkling those roots with Great White before dropping into the new container. It pays off quickly. You won’t hurt the plant breaking this up gently. Water the day before and it’s easy.

hotrodharley said:

Do it every time. Also recommend sprinkling those roots with Great White before dropping into the new container. It pays off quickly. You won’t hurt the plant breaking this up gently. Water the day before and it’s easy.

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I love Great White! I can't second that enough.

Thank you to everyone who has taken the time to reply!

curious2garden said:

I love Great White! I can't second that enough.

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Several years ago I had multiple well known RIU members laugh their asses off when I claimed microbes were the key to great pot that nobody was using. I’m telling you mocking laughter.

Now look.

And I didn’t think it up. Saw it in Pro Mix in 2011 when I bought my first bale. Started researching. But you couldn’t just buy it. Because it was not a thing yet. So learned to get it from a slurry using molasses, water and dirt from your yard. That really got the laughs.