Vote for Ron Paul-----Great idea
- Thread starter chillwills
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chillwills
Well-Known Member
Nope. So if he decides not to run all this debate will have been for naught.
chillwills
Well-Known Member
It still brings up the relevant issues.
deprave
New Member
Our third president and author of our Declaration of Independence in 1776, President Thomas Jefferson on U.S. Bank, December 13, 1803:
From a passage in the letter of the President, I observe an idea of establishing a branch bank of the United States in New Orleans. This institution is one of the most deadly hostility existing, against the principles and form of our Constitution.
The nation is, at this time, so strong and united in its sentiments, that it cannot be shaken at this moment. But suppose a series of untoward events should occur, sufficient to bring into doubt the competency of a republican government to meet a crisis of great danger, or to unhinge the confidence of the people in the public functionaries; an institution like this, penetrating by its branches every part of the Union, acting by command and in phalanx, may, in a critical moment, upset the government.
I deem no government safe which is under the vassalage of any self-constituted authorities, or any other authority than that of the nation, or its regular functionaries. What an obstruction could not this bank of the United States, with all its branch banks, be in time of war? It might dictate to us the peace we should accept, or withdraw its aids.
COPY PASTE FROM A DESCENT ARTICLE BELOW:
1 - The Federal Reserve was created as a way to enslave the U.S. government with debt. The truth is that the U.S. government only goes into debt if it chooses to. Theoretically, one day that U.S. government could simply decide to print as many U.S. dollars as it wants and pay off all government debts. But under the current system that is not allowed. You see, today the U.S. government does not issue any money. The Federal Reserve issues all money. That is why they are called "Federal Reserve notes".
Under the current regime, whenever the U.S. government wants more currency to be created it has to go into more debt.
2. The Federal Reserve creates money out of thin air. In this article, It is noted how this fact comes out in congressional hearings and yet the American people just don't seem to get too upset about it....
During a recent Joint Economic Committee hearing on Capital Hill, U.S. Representative Ron Paul directly confronted Federal Reserve Chairman Ben Bernanke about this 1.3 trillion dollars. As Ron Paul described how this 1.3 trillion was just created out of thin air, all Bernanke could do was nod his head. Why? Because it was the truth.
3. Inflation - Its still there - its still a problem - The Federal Reserve manipulates the U.S. economy by setting national interest rates. By keeping rates high or low, the Federal Reserve has the power to create economic growth or to destroy it. The have the power to inflate massive bubbles and to pop them. Most Americans give way too much credit and blame to presidents like Bush or Obama for how the economy is doing. The truth is that they really don't have that much control over the economy compared to the Federal Reserve.
4 The huge predator megabanks that now dominate the U.S. banking system use the Federal Reserve as a tool to make money. One of the ways they do this is called the U.S. Treasury carry trade. What happens is that the Federal Reserve lends huge amounts of money to the megabanks for next to nothing, and then these megabanks use all that cash to buy U.S. government debt. This little "trick" helped enable four of the biggest U.S. banks (Goldman Sachs, JPMorgan Chase, Bank of America and Citigroup) to have a "perfect quarter" with zero days of trading losses during the first quarter of 2010. Wouldn't you like to have a perfect batting average?
5 The Federal Reserve devalues our currency. Since the Federal Reserve was created in 1913, the U.S. dollar has lost 96 percent of its purchasing power. The truth is that just a two percent inflation rate will wipe out half of your purchasing power within a single generation. In the chart below, you can clearly see that the beginning of the rapid rise of inflation in the United States coincided with the creation of the Federal Reserve....
6 The Federal Reserve also controls the national money supply. They can pump trillions into the economy or pull trillions out without being accountable to anyone. This can have disastrous consequences. For example, after the U.S. stock market crash of 1929, the Federal Reserve continued to contract the money supply. Many analysts believe that this was one of the key things that precipitated the Great Depression.
7 The Federal Reserve is not part of the U.S. government. The truth is that the Federal Reserve is about as "federal" as Federal Express is. In defending itself against a Bloomberg request for information under the Freedom of Information Act, the Federal Reserve objected by declaring that it was "not an agency" of the U.S. government and therefore it was not subject to the Freedom of Information Act. It is kind of funny how Fed officials are always talking about how important their "independence" is, but whenever anyone starts criticizing them for being private they start stressing their ties with the government.
8 The Federal Reserve has become far, far too powerful. The reality is that those running the Federal Reserve are not elected and yet have an enormous amount of control. In fact, Ron Paul recently told MSNBC that he believes that the Federal Reserve is more powerful than Congress.....
"The regulations should be on the Federal Reserve. We should have transparency of the Federal Reserve. They can create trillions of dollars to bail out their friends, and we don’t even have any transparency of this. They’re more powerful than the Congress."
9 The Federal Reserve is dominated by Wall Street and the New York banks. The New York representative is the only permanent member of the Federal Open Market Committee, while other regional banks rotate in 2 and 3 year intervals. The former head of the New York Fed, Timothy Geithner, is now U.S. Treasury Secretary. The truth is that the Federal Reserve Bank of New York has always been the most important of the regional Fed banks by far, and in turn the Federal Reserve Bank of New York has always been dominated by Wall Street and the major New York banks.
10 Federal Reserve Chairman Ben Bernanke wants to completely eliminate minimum reserve requirements for banks. Fractional reserve banking has always been a way that the bankers have conned the public, but now Bernanke wants to get rid of the pretense of "reserves" altogether.
It is almost too bizarre to believe, but it is right there in black and white on the Federal Reserve's own website....
The Federal Reserve believes it is possible that, ultimately, its operating framework will allow the elimination of minimum reserve requirements, which impose costs and distortions on the banking system.
11 The Federal Reserve is not accountable to anyone. The Federal Reserve has never undergone a true comprehensive audit since it was created back in 1913. Ron Paul’s proposal to audit the Federal Reserve, which had previously been co-sponsored by 320 members of the U.S. House of Representatives, ultimately failed by a vote of 229-198.
But shouldn't the American people be able to see what is going on inside the Federal Reserve?
Shouldn't we have some way to keep them accountable?
After all, they have an incredible amount of power over us, shouldn't we have at least a little bit of power over them?
Unfortunately, the truth is that they desperately do not want light to be shined on the elaborate "shell game" that they are running.
Have you ever wondered if it was just a coincidence that the personal income tax was implemented just about the same time that the Federal Reserve was created?
Why does the U.S. government have to tax us?
Why can't the U.S. government just print up all the money that it needs?
Well, the way that our Congress spends money that would probably create horrific hyperinflation, but that is the subject for another article.
The point is that the U.S. government should not have to get U.S. dollars from someone else.
If you take a few minutes to stop and think about it, an America where there is no Federal Reserve, no personal income tax and no IRS is not that hard to imagine.
If the U.S. government functioned just fine without all of them at one time, then why couldn't the U.S. government function just fine without all of them now?
The system we have now clearly is not working. The Federal Reserve was supposed to guarantee that our financial system would be perfectly stable, but in reality our financial system has become much more unstable.
It is time for different thinking. It is time for the U.S. government to take back control of our currency and of our economy. It is time to start electing some people with common sense to represent us in Washington.
mame
Well-Known Member
haha I guess you got me there
londonfog
Well-Known Member
on some things I agree with Ron, but I still say he needs to be a Presidential advisor...until he decides that he will run we can only assume thats all he will be ... hell yeah audit the Fed, then we will see whats behind the curtain..but do you think a POTUS will stay alive trying to do that??
UncleBuck
Well-Known Member
besides the fact that the rest of what you listed is all pipe dreams, let's focus on this one.
it is simply not true. he will not protect the essential freedoms and liberties of women in this country.
any libertarian will tell you that ron paul is not a true libertarian as long as he keeps favoring the government controlling what my wife does with her own body.
i guess he gets 50% marks on this point. but 50% is still failing.
unless you are in canada...and i can let the grammar of a typical canadian speak for itself.
Ron Paul wouldn't attack Libya.
You are so wrong, you couldn't be any more wrong. Show me a single instance where Ron Paul advocates for the side of the Federal Government deciding these issues? Show me a single instance where Ron Paul wants to make it Federal law against abortion? You can't because he doesn't have that viewpoint at all. ""I think we ought to return the issue to the states so that local opinions could better determine the specific regulations concerning this deeply personal issue".
deprave
New Member
Well actually he has voted against abortion on quite a few occasions and infact he did vote for making it a federal crime to take a minor across borders to get an abortion so there is your one example, his voting record is mixed an abortion but it does looks like he is pro-life at glance but I am not going to pretend I read every bill
ChubbySoap
Well-Known Member
if the man has no plans to do something about my juice and soda having lemon flavorings in them while my dishsoap has REAL fucking lemons in it....then....then...
....
>_<
i don't care.
The most qualified person who least wants the actual job, has my vote.
It's the only way it'll ever work you see...
....
>_<
i don't care.
The most qualified person who least wants the actual job, has my vote.
It's the only way it'll ever work you see...
mame
Well-Known Member
The problem with the fed is that it only ever does part of it's job.
When the economy tanks the fed has no problem doing what it's supposed to do (lower interest rates). But when the economy is doing too well, creating bubbles like 2000-01, the fed is indifferent and doesn't increase interest rates as they should(the last time the fed participated in tight monetary policy was in the 80's when core inflation dropped from over 10% to ~4%... target inflation is generally 1-3%). Another example of failure of the fed to do it's job was Alan Greenspan's defense of derivatives and how we shouldn't regulate them(bad idea) - when one of the reasons the fed was made was to further understand and regulate banking activities. Why would the fed fail to perform it's duties fully? I dont know... but I do know the Fed has shown both glipses of genius and idiocy in our history. It seems as if the fed's success is too dependent on a few people making the right decisions which suggests power is too concentrated (which even leaves it open to corruption... ALL OF THOSE DAMN BANKERS WITH CONFLICTING INTERESTS).
But the general idea behind the creation of the fed is sound... The free market works in cycles, the fed seeks to minimize these cycles - hoping to create steady growth as opposed to boom and bust... I'd still keep the fed, but I'd seek reforms for transparency and accountability. The problem here is, who is qualified to hold the fed accountable? Certainly not the general population.
When the economy tanks the fed has no problem doing what it's supposed to do (lower interest rates). But when the economy is doing too well, creating bubbles like 2000-01, the fed is indifferent and doesn't increase interest rates as they should(the last time the fed participated in tight monetary policy was in the 80's when core inflation dropped from over 10% to ~4%... target inflation is generally 1-3%). Another example of failure of the fed to do it's job was Alan Greenspan's defense of derivatives and how we shouldn't regulate them(bad idea) - when one of the reasons the fed was made was to further understand and regulate banking activities. Why would the fed fail to perform it's duties fully? I dont know... but I do know the Fed has shown both glipses of genius and idiocy in our history. It seems as if the fed's success is too dependent on a few people making the right decisions which suggests power is too concentrated (which even leaves it open to corruption... ALL OF THOSE DAMN BANKERS WITH CONFLICTING INTERESTS).
But the general idea behind the creation of the fed is sound... The free market works in cycles, the fed seeks to minimize these cycles - hoping to create steady growth as opposed to boom and bust... I'd still keep the fed, but I'd seek reforms for transparency and accountability. The problem here is, who is qualified to hold the fed accountable? Certainly not the general population.
UncleBuck
Well-Known Member
and i'm sure women from south dakota to mississippi love hearing that!
hell, as long as their rights are stripped from them at a state level, it's ok, right?
nice job shooting yourself in the foot.
edit - his stance on abortion is irreconcilable with libertarianism and indefensible with respect to assuring basic rights for ALL americans. not just the ones in the blue states.
GottaHaveIt
Active Member
I'm a Libertarian, and I think abortion as birth control is disgusting. For Christ's sake, my 13 year old daughter can't get stitches without me signing thirty fucking forms; but she can get an abortion without my knowledge. (ask me how I know this and then shove your 'it's my body' arguments right up your wazoo.)
How about its mandate is to keep full employment, (BIG FAIL) a Stable Currency ( Lost 96% of it value so far, BIG FAIL) and moderate long term interest rates (1/4% is LOW LOW LOW, another BIG FAIL!!!!)
supervising and regulating banking institutions to ensure the safety and soundness of the nation's banking and financial system and to protect the credit rights of consumers /..... ANOTHER HUGE FUCKING FAILURE!!!!!! Big Banks were allowed to make every shitty investment possible and were never regulated at all.
maintaining the stability of the financial system and containing systemic risk that may arise in financial markets .................... How many times does the economy have to go to shit before we see the fed for the huge failure it has become?
providing financial services to depository institutions, the U.S. government, and foreign official institutions, including playing a major role in operating the nation's payments system.......Why are we bailing out foreign Banks with American Money? FAIL FAIL FAIL, the Fed would get a F minus if it were graded on performance.
END THE FED!!! BOOM AND BUST EVERY 10 Years with them at the helm.