To catch a predator

Seamaiden · Aug 13, 2008

jsn9333 said:
The problem with the death penalty is that innocent people get convicted of death crimes. DNA clears people that have been convicted to death all the time. Also, just as frequently, the INNOCENT person is killed before DNA can clear them (or if there is no DNA to clear). We don't even know how many people this happens to because no one has the time to count. Groups (like the one I'm a part of in my law school) that get innocent men off death row with DNA evidence don't even have enough time to find all the innocents that are still alive, much less go looking for ones that have been killed. The only way to prevent the State from killing innocent people is to abolish the death penalty.

I'm all for making prison more hard and harsh... but the death penalty is wrong because mankind does and *will* make mistakes. You may think it is worth it for the deterrent effect the death penalty has on crime... but there are no statistics to prove that the death penalty deters crime. In fact, many in prison for life would rather die! The death penalty may increase crime for all we know! And your support for the death penalty would end rather quickly when you were that innocent guy about to be convicted to death.

The death penalty is ignorant and evil. It should have no part in our society. The U.S. needs to catch up with the rest of the world in that regard.

Word. Double-word, actually. You are probably pretty familiar with the company we (the U.S.) keep with regard to nations that still use the DP, too, I bet.

JOEGALLO · Aug 13, 2008

I dont think its entrapment. If you listen to most of them when they start reading it seems that the guys always start the conversation so I dont think its any differant then an undercover cop doing undercover work. That show is awsome though. Shows you that molesters come in ALL walks of life. Does anyone remember that dumb ass that got caught twice???

South Texas · Aug 13, 2008

Cool Dude. You spoke the unsung truth. Stone Casters don't know. Ask Randall Dale Adams about being innocent has nothing to do with the death penalty. Law was my passion for years... 1930's, finest minds in America was called together, because while Johnny was imprisoned, treated like a dog, He came out, acting like a dog. Thus, the first prison rules was established. Get with me Dude, I'm one of them writ-writers.

jsn9333 said:
The problem with the death penalty is that innocent people get convicted of death crimes. DNA clears people that have been convicted to death all the time. Also, just as frequently, the INNOCENT person is killed before DNA can clear them (or if there is no DNA to clear). We don't even know how many people this happens to because no one has the time to count. Groups (like the one I'm a part of in my law school) that get innocent men off death row with DNA evidence don't even have enough time to find all the innocents that are still alive, much less go looking for ones that have been killed. The only way to prevent killing innocent people is to abolish the death penalty.

I'm all for making prison more hard and harsh... but the death penalty is wrong because mankind does and *will* make mistakes. You may think it is worth it for the deterrent effect the death penalty has on crime... but there are no statistics to prove that the death penalty deters crime. In fact, many in prison for life would rather die! The death penalty may increase crime for all we know! And your support for the death penalty would end rather quickly when you were that innocent guy about to be convicted to death.

The death penalty is ignorant and evil. It should have no part in our society. The U.S. needs to catch up with the rest of the world in that regard.

SocataSmoker · Aug 13, 2008

South Texas said:
Storm Trooper, 1943. You refuse to believe innocent people is on death row, you don't care if it's entrapment. You would like to kill them yourself.... Who's to guard our children's future from people like you? The US Constitution, asshole!

Look here asshole, I've protested MANY death penalty cases, exactly why I said do you know who the hell you're talking about. In every To Catch a Predator show I've seen, the molester knew the child was between 12-13... Now, if you're 18 and you wanna fuck a 15 year old that's fine if it's consentual, but these guys are not 18, everyone I've seen was well over 25. Yep, I'll kill'em and gut'em too if they'd like. My children will be guarded by me, and my Smith&Wesson, it's no one else's job, and if another human touches my child in a perverse way, he is going to go through hell on earth for a few days locked in my basement. Fact is, pedophiles cannot be cured or turned into normal humans... they will always have thoughts about children and therefore must be taken care of, and I do not want my tax dollars going to feed a child molester.

And jsn, I think you're talking about statutory rape... say a 16 year old is dating an 18 year old, parents find out and press charges, I of course am against that because nearly the same thing happened to me! But when a 30 year old man wants to talk dirty to a 13 year old girl and then proceed to want to fuck them, feed them to the wolves, no exceptions.

SocataSmoker · Aug 13, 2008

South Texas said:
Randall Dale Adams about being innocent has nothing to do with the death penalty.

Did he rape little kids? Don't think so. This is about the death penalty for repeat child molesters... stop being a pussy, I'm sure you would be on my side if a man raped your daughter eh? In fact I think you'd probably PM me asking for my help in hiding the body... of which I'd be more than happy to assist. :blsmoke:

South Texas · Aug 13, 2008

Yeah, Hiding a body isn't easy. Anybody hurting an innocent, well, legally I'd be wrong. I just don't promote Government sanctioned crimes against humanity. You & I are dead on taking care of business, but also, there is the innocent folks on death row.

SocataSmoker · Aug 13, 2008

I understand, heard anything about Cleve Foster? I wrote him 2 years ago and never heard back... he's on Texas death row, really sad story. I only advocate the DP in cases of repeated child molestation, and murder where there's no doubt of guilt, I value human life greatly but those two things will change my mind in an instant.

Seamaiden · Aug 13, 2008

Our justice system, and the humans who run it, are fallible. They have passions and desires and ideas and prejudices and grievances and they act on them. No death penalty. Hard labor, sure, but no death penalty.

SocataSmoker · Aug 13, 2008

Seamaiden said:
Our justice system, and the humans who run it, are fallible. They have passions and desires and ideas and prejudices and grievances and they act on them. No death penalty. Hard labor, sure, but no death penalty.

Nope, I refuse to pay for some child molester to live while his victims have to live everyday with the torment they've been through. If you abolish the death penalty, then we'll just take it into our own hands. Alaska is a great place to get "lost"... :eyesmoke:

Sorry, but I'm touchy on this subject... and besides we're all animals, we just let our conscience get in the way too much, I just think of it as the circle of life.

jsn9333 · Aug 13, 2008

JOEGALLO said:
I dont think its entrapment. If you listen to most of them when they start reading it seems that the guys always start the conversation so I dont think its any differant then an undercover cop doing undercover work. That show is awsome though. Shows you that molesters come in ALL walks of life. Does anyone remember that dumb ass that got caught twice???

They rarely read how the conversation starts. And there have been on-air occasions where the guy indicated he wanted to stop talking and the girl baited him back.

And from what I understand, the show and the contractors have denied requests of law enforcement abuse groups that have requested the transcripts.

The contractors make a *ton* of money off the show, so they are *highly* motivated to get as many guys in there as they can. I'm not saying they only get innocent guys. They catch a lot of predators and that is *great*. But they also most likely prey on and entrap people who otherwise never would've messed around with something like that.

matthew · Aug 13, 2008

jsn9333 said:
Entrapment is wrong whether they hold a bag of weed in front of your face asking you to smoke it or a 17 year old girl asking you to hit it. Those girls they use to bait the guy into the house are adults! Age is just a number when the girl is pursuing you! In some states 15 or 16 is still legal with consent... most girls are through puberty by 12.

Do you know what entrapment really is? Do yourself a favor and google it. Also the girls used at the house are only there to lure the pervs into the house once they are there and to talk on the phone, they use pictures of the staffers when they are pre-pubescent online.

jsn9333 said:
I don't want to get into that argument though. My main point is this: You have to remember those girls go find those guys online. They call the guys predators, but the show is the real predator (much of the time). I admit, they do catch some nasty predators. But also, you have to remember that many times the guys say, "I should be getting offline now..." and the girls on the show will be like, "Oh, come on, talk dirty a little more."

Go into any romance chatroom and type "13/f/pick any state" and watch how many private messages you get. I used to have a BALL doing it and then posting the pervs pictures on various sites. I actually emailed a picture (the guy was naked) and chat transcript to a guy's work (a bank no less). I made it adundently clear that he was chatting with a 13 year old girl.

Also who are the people biting at these "13/f/tx" lines? I mean as an adult male with no interest in sex with prepubsent girls I know I wouldn't PM her and ask her cup size or if she was shaved. The only people doing this are interested in sex, some might not be brave enough to actually meet but the ones that do ought to do us all a favor a felate a .45

jsn9333 said:
That is entrapment, and it is wrong. The company they contract to bait the guys in get paid a lot of money to do it for the network and the advertisers. You should not support them by watching the show, it is wrong. They should only go after the real predators, the guys who seek out the girls. In this case, the show and the girls they contract with are often the predators, they are seeking out the guys mujch of the time and end up entrapping them with adult women who overtly tempt them online and into the house.

Again you are not understanding what entrapment is. If you are walking down the street and a guy asks if you want some free weed and you take it, it STILL isn't entrapment. Again I also want to point out that NORMAL people are not interested in sex with children and therefore would not IM them and talk dirty. Honestly if a 13 year old girl PMed you 1000 times asking for sex would you ever give in and drive over to her house? This is not how PJ works but the fact remains that no matter how much a little girl solisits me for sex, I am never going to give it to her.

jsn9333 said:
The show does some good by catching nasty predators. But it does a lot of harm also by entrapping otherwise innocent, lonely dudes.

I have never been sitting home alone and thought about chatting up children for sex, if you have you need to seek some serious help.

matthew · Aug 13, 2008

South Texas said:
Storm Trooper, 1943. You refuse to believe innocent people is on death row, you don't care if it's entrapment. You would like to kill them yourself.... Who's to guard our children's future from people like you? The US Constitution, asshole!

I have no problem executing those who actively seek sex with children, hell I don't even mind if the child has to beg them to have sex. If you have try to have sex with children, no matter how lonely you are, you are still a pedophile.

Also read up on entrapment, the constitution is on my side.

ToastedFox · Aug 13, 2008

castrating sex offenders is a bad idea imo... no evidence left behind then at all.

A lot of those dudes need some serious mental help, and all they do is just throw them in jail, and very little mental help for their release so they just repeat the offense.

Plus honestly, who the fuck is watching the real kids on the net that do try to get sex from those sick people? Noone, not even the gov.

stickyicky77 · Aug 13, 2008

jsn9333 said:
Entrapment is wrong whether they hold a bag of weed in front of your face asking you to smoke it or a 17 year old girl asking you to hit it. Those girls they use to bait the guy into the house are adults! Age is just a number when the girl is pursuing you! In some states 15 or 16 is still legal with consent... most girls are through puberty by 12.

I don't want to get into that argument though. My main point is this: You have to remember those girls go find those guys online. They call the guys predators, but the show is the real predator (much of the time). I admit, they do catch some nasty predators. But also, you have to remember that many times the guys say, "I should be getting offline now..." and the girls on the show will be like, "Oh, come on, talk dirty a little more."

That is entrapment, and it is wrong. The company they contract to bait the guys in get paid a lot of money to do it for the network and the advertisers. You should not support them by watching the show, it is wrong. They should only go after the real predators, the guys who seek out the girls. In this case, the show and the girls they contract with are often the predators, they are seeking out the guys mujch of the time and end up entrapping them with adult women who overtly tempt them online and into the house.

The show does some good by catching nasty predators. But it does a lot of harm also by entrapping otherwise innocent, lonely dudes.

Ok short eyes, which episode were you on?? ...lol

jsn9333 · Aug 13, 2008

matthew said:
I have no problem executing those who actively seek sex with children, hell I don't even mind if the child has to beg them to have sex. If you have try to have sex with children, no matter how lonely you are, you are still a pedophile.

Also read up on entrapment, the constitution is on my side.

I have no problem with executing such people either... if it can 100% be proven with 100% reliability each and every time with never any error at all. The problem with the death penalty is, as with everything mankind does, sometimes errors occur. Life in prison allows those errors the most chance of being corrected. You would no longer be pro death penalty if you were the innocent person who ended up there simply because of the color of his skin and he was in the wrong place at the wrong time (which still happens A LOT in this country).

As for entrapment, it is defined as inducing someone to commit a crime that they otherwise were "unlikely" to have committed without your inducement. The court ultimately decides if entrapment occurred, the constitution doesn't get into the specifics for each possible case.

Like I said, the show catches many people who need to get caught, and for that I'm thankful. However, given that they are motivated by a very high paying network and advertisers to get as many guys in there as they can, they most likely entrap some of the people.

Also, like I said, I have seen where a guy was uncomfortable with the situation and wanted to get offline, and the girl kept baiting him in and tempting him to keep going. This guy would've not done it if she hadn't had entrapped him. That is wrong. It is especially wrong when the guy is 19 and she is saying she is 14 or 15 (and looks 18 when he sees her).

Would I ever screw around with a 14 or 15 year old? No, of course not. But I'm just saying entrapment is always wrong, and it is especially wrong when the lines are blurry (in some states consent is okay at 14, etc.).

When the show profits off catching predators who prey on children, that is fine. I'm all for that. When it profits off preying on and entrapping young men who otherwise would never have gotten into that trouble... that is wrong.

ToastedFox · Aug 13, 2008

jsn9333 said:
I have no problem with executing such people either... if it can 100% be proven with 100% reliability each and every time with never any error at all. The problem with the death penalty is, as with everything mankind does, sometimes errors occur. Life in prison allows those errors the most chance of being corrected. You would no longer be pro death penalty if you were the innocent person who ended up there simply because of the color of his skin and he was in the wrong place at the wrong time (which still happens A LOT in this country).

As for entrapment, it is defined as inducing someone to commit a crime that they otherwise were "unlikely" to have committed without your inducement. The court ultimately decides if entrapment occurred, the constitution doesn't get into the specifics for each possible case.

Like I said, the show catches many people who need to get caught, and for that I'm thankful. However, given that they are motivated by a very high paying network and advertisers to get as many guys in there as they can, they most likely entrap some of the people.

Also, like I said, I have seen where a guy was uncomfortable with the situation and wanted to get offline, and the girl kept baiting him in and tempting him to keep going. This guy would've not done it if she hadn't had entrapped him. That is wrong. It is especially wrong when the guy is 19 and she is saying she is 14 or 15 (and looks 18 when he sees her).

Would I ever screw around with a 14 or 15 year old? No, of course not. But I'm just saying entrapment is always wrong, and it is especially wrong when the lines are blurry (in some states consent is okay at 14, etc.).

When the show profits off catching predators who prey on children, that is fine. I'm all for that. When it profits off preying on and entrapping young men who otherwise would never have gotten into that trouble... that is wrong.

Just remember there are people who think the same about us potheads too and other races! Thank goodness for the wonderful pieces of hemp paper that are the foundation for our government.

Stoney McFried · Aug 13, 2008

He can say NO.

jsn9333 said:
But also, you have to remember that many times the guys say, "I should be getting offline now..." and the girls on the show will be like, "Oh, come on, talk dirty a little more."

That is entrapment, and it is wrong. The company they contract to bait the guys in get paid a lot of money to do it for the network and the advertisers. You should not support them by watching the show, it is wrong. They should only go after the real predators, the guys who seek out the girls. In this case, the show and the girls they contract with are often the predators, they are seeking out the guys mujch of the time and end up entrapping them with adult women who overtly tempt them online and into the house.

The show does some good by catching nasty predators. But it does a lot of harm also by entrapping otherwise innocent, lonely dudes.

jsn9333 · Aug 13, 2008

Stoney McFried said:
He can say NO.

He shouldn't have to say no. He has *zero* chance of a real 15 year old girl begging him to fuck her. So this guy is no danger to society. The only people he is a danger to is 25 year old women pretending to be 14 or 15 and begging him to talk dirty and come over.

If the girl were pubescent or pre-pubescent or if he was initiating the deal... then yeah, bust his ass. And the show does get people like that, so in those cases it is good... it is great!

But sometimes the show just fucks people over by entrapping them. That's all. Most of the time it is right on the money. Sometimes it fucks people by luring them into a situation they never would have gotten into were it not for the show. That is wrong. That's my opinion.

donWonton · Aug 13, 2008

its funny and boringly repetitive

Stoney McFried · Aug 13, 2008

But it makes no difference.He should have the common sense not to talk to a person that says they are that age in a sexual manner.And obviously, you haven't been around a lot of 15 year old girls nowadays.If he can't say, no, I'm going now...and THEN, is still led to come over and see whats up, then he is a danger, because he can be coerced into fucking an underage girl.

jsn9333 said:
He shouldn't have to say no. He has *zero* chance of a real 15 year old girl begging him to fuck her. So this guy is no danger to society. The only people he is a danger to is 25 year old women pretending to be 14 or 15 and begging him to talk dirty and come over.

If the girl were pubescent or pre-pubescent or if he was initiating the deal... then yeah, bust his ass. And the show does get people like that, so in those cases it is good... it is great!

But sometimes the show just fucks people over by entrapping them. That's all. Most of the time it is right on the money. Sometimes it fucks people by luring them into a situation they never would have gotten into were it not for the show. That is wrong. That's my opinion.

To catch a predator

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