The Truth About Ron Paul - Part 2

By Jeremy Redmon

The Atlanta Journal-Constitution
Gov. Nathan Deal on Tuesday offered what he called a “partial solution” to Georgia’s farm labor shortage: put people on criminal probation to work picking fruits and vegetables in South Georgia.
Enlarge photo

Vino Wong, [email protected]te survey suggests that there is potentially a need to fill as many as 11,080 agricultural jobs this year in Georgia.


The Republican governor’s idea is drawing concern from the head of the American Probation and Parole Association and getting mixed reviews from farmers and their organizations, who have complained that a new immigration law was scaring away migrant farmworkers they need.



Deal outlined his proposal the same day his office released the results of a state survey of farmers showing they have 11,080 jobs open, which is about 14 percent of the full-time positions that are filled annually. Deal asked for the survey last month

LESLIE, Ga. (AP) - It's 3:25 p.m. in a dusty cucumber field in south Georgia. A knot of criminal offenders who spent seven hours in the sun harvesting buckets of vegetables by hand have decided they're calling it quits - exactly as crew leader Benito Mendez predicted in the morning.
Unless the cucumbers come off the vine soon, they will become engorged with seeds, making them unsellable. Mendez's crew of Mexican and Guatemalan workers will keep harvesting until 6 p.m., maybe longer. Not so for the men participating in a new state-run program aimed at replacing the Latino migrants Georgia farmers say they've lost to a new immigration crackdown with unemployed probationers.
"Tired. The heat," said 33-year-old Tavares Jones, who left early and was walking down a dirt road toward a ride home. He promised Mendez he'd return the next morning. "It's hard work out here."
Mendez urged another man to stay. "I need you today," he said. "These cucumbers not going to wait until tomorrow."

Migrant farmworkers are bypassing Georgia because of the state’s tough new immigration enforcement law, creating a severe labor shortage among fruit and vegetable growers here and potentially putting hundreds of millions of dollars in crops in jeopardy, agricultural industry leaders said this week. [...]

Charles Hall, executive director of the Georgia Fruit and Vegetable Growers Association, said he has been in close contact with Labor Commissioner Mark Butler and Agricultural Commissioner Gary Black about the shortage, calling it the most severe he has seen. Hall said it's possible state officials could hold job fairs to steer some of Georgia’s unemployed workers to these farm jobs, which pay $12.50 an hour on average. The state’s unemployment rate is now at 9.9 percent.
Farmers, however, say they often have little luck recruiting Georgia residents to work in their fields because it is temporary, hot and physically demanding. To recruit more workers, some farmers are offering signing bonuses, Hall said.

dukeanthony said:

They rotted in the feilds and georgia lost billions

BTW
That was 2 months ago

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Where did you pull the magical billions number from? I looked and the only number I saw was 300 million. With that being said I must respond... "So what?" Even if it was 10 billion, I fail to see your point. You are justifying breaking the law because it made money for big business? Who lost those 'billions' of dollars? Oh, thats right, people who were breaking the law. Fuck em.

The fact that no one else wants the jobs just goes to show you that those 10% of people who aren't working are lazy fuckers who don't want to work for 10 bucks an hour. Remove their government support and I bet they will want those jobs. Of course, the farms may have to pay more. I don't see a negative in all this. This is is the free market fixing the issue. Vegetables will cost what they cost to produce in the coming years. If they don't pay enough - they wont get produced. It is very simple. You can't point out 1 growing season as the failure of a policy.

If they just gave those people the ability to be legal and pay taxes or perhaps just did away with the income tax altogether this wouldn't be as big of an issue.

dukeanthony said:

Migrant farmworkers are bypassing Georgia because of the state’s tough new immigration enforcement law, creating a severe labor shortage among fruit and vegetable growers here and potentially putting hundreds of millions of dollars in crops in jeopardy, agricultural industry leaders said this week. [...]

Charles Hall, executive director of the Georgia Fruit and Vegetable Growers Association, said he has been in close contact with Labor Commissioner Mark Butler and Agricultural Commissioner Gary Black about the shortage, calling it the most severe he has seen. Hall said it's possible state officials could hold job fairs to steer some of Georgia’s unemployed workers to these farm jobs, which pay $12.50 an hour on average. The state’s unemployment rate is now at 9.9 percent.
Farmers, however, say they often have little luck recruiting Georgia residents to work in their fields because it is temporary, hot and physically demanding. To recruit more workers, some farmers are offering signing bonuses, Hall said.

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None of those said how much was lost in crops, or how many citizens got jobs because the illegal immigrants weren't there. Maybe if welfare, unemployment, social security, disability, ect weren't so generous people would want jobs? Those 10% of Georgia obviously are living somehow. If they offered more, more people would come to work there. It sounds to me like the farms just don't care to pay enough to get their stuff picked.

Carthoris said:

Of course, the farms may have to pay more. I don't see a negative in all this. This is is the free market fixing the issue. Vegetables will cost what they cost to produce in the coming years. If they don't pay enough - they wont get produced. It is very simple. You can't point out 1 growing season as the failure of a policy.

If they just gave those people the ability to be legal and pay taxes or perhaps just did away with the income tax altogether this wouldn't be as big of an issue.

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How will the Free Market Fix a Farmer that goes out of business? And do you think rising food prices will create Inflation?
Do you actually think agribusiness begins and ends with a farmer?

Monday, June 27, 2011

GEORGIA AGRIBUSINESS LOSS MAY BE $1 BILLION



The Georgia Agribusiness Council is estimating that the state of Georgia might lose up to $1 Billion (!) if crops would not be picked and rot in the fields, or not be processed after they are picked, because of the HB87 induced farming job shortage. This figure only includes this season's fruit and vegetables, and does not not include cotton and pecans that are up next for harvest in our state's cycle. Republicans who voted for HB87 sure found a great way to increase the state's budget problems!

Crop Losses Could Top $1B
By Jeanne Bonner
Updated: 2 months ago


ATLANTA — Farmers are picking a variety of signature Georgia crops right now. Some have said they are seeing labor shortages among migrant workers who fear the new immigration law.

An agriculture industry group estimates a shortage of migrant labor may wind up costing Georgia fruit and vegetable farmers $300 million in crop losses. Officials worry the total economic impact will be even greater if crops from the next harvest are lost.

The Georgia Agribusiness Council estimates the total loss stemming from spoiled and unpicked produce to be close to $1 billion.

And that doesn’t include other crops such as pecans and cotton that will be harvested next.

dukeanthony said:

How will the Free Market Fix a Farmer that goes out of business? And do you think rising food prices will create Inflation?
Do you actually think agribusiness begins and ends with a farmer?

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Rising prices don't create inflation. Keeping the prices of food artificially low is a bigger problem. The farmer wouldn't go out of business if he had a sound business plan. Tough titty for him. Will anyone cry for people who are making 10s of thousands of dollars a month growing marijuana if they make marijuana legal and those people can no longer make a living? Owning a business is a risk, and you know it going in. I am guessing you don't know anything about business in general.

Stop trying to turn a short term problem into something else. This is like pulling your hand out of a fire and bumping your elbow. Sure the elbow hurts, but you wouldn't suggest leaving your hand in the fire.

dukeanthony said:

Crop Losses Could Top $1B
By Jeanne Bonner
Updated: 2 months ago


ATLANTA —

Farmers are picking a variety of signature Georgia crops right now. Some have said they are seeing labor shortages among migrant workers who fear the new immigration law.

An agriculture industry group estimates a shortage of migrant labor may wind up costing Georgia fruit and vegetable farmers $300 million in crop losses. Officials worry the total economic impact will be even greater if crops from the next harvest are lost.

The Georgia Agribusiness Council estimates the total loss stemming from spoiled and unpicked produce to be close to $1 billion.

And that doesn’t include other crops such as pecans and cotton that will be harvested next.

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So it wasn't 'billions' it wasn't even 1 billion.

dukeanthony said:

Monday, June 27, 2011

GEORGIA AGRIBUSINESS LOSS MAY BE $1 BILLION



The Georgia Agribusiness Council is estimating that the state of Georgia might lose up to $1 Billion (!) if crops would not be picked and rot in the fields, or not be processed after they are picked, because of the HB87 induced farming job shortage. This figure only includes this season's fruit and vegetables, and does not not include cotton and pecans that are up next for harvest in our state's cycle. Republicans who voted for HB87 sure found a great way to increase the state's budget problems!

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I wonder if the people who write the headlines read their own articles, or if you do for that matter. The billion dollar number was entirely made up, and the 300 million might be true. Once again - who cares? The rich people who own farms and profit from illegal labor. Why aren't they offering 20 dollars an hour to have people pick fruit and veggies then if they are rotting in the fields rather than losing their crops? Why is making people follow the law an issue in your eyes?

Carthoris said:

Why is making people follow the law an issue in your eyes?

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Why do bad laws need to be Followed?

What site are you on again?

300 Pages in this thread! Woot Woot.

Ohh were you having a conversation?

dukeanthony said:

How will the Free Market Fix a Farmer that goes out of business? And do you think rising food prices will create Inflation?
Do you actually think agribusiness begins and ends with a farmer?

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The free market doesn't physically "fix" anything because it doesn't use manipulation. We tell the market if we want something or not through the peoples purchasing power.
Rising food prices are because of inflation you twit. Don't you know anything about the Federal reserve and how they print money?
Why work when you can get money from the government for free?

dukeanthony said:

Why do bad laws need to be Followed?

What site are you on again?

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Got to admit, first thing you've said that I liked .

I love how you guys are talking about free markets here and I will get involved and finished reading your post probably tomorrow, but I just want to add one thing: Electing Ron Paul for 4 to 8 years would not enable him to activate his entire philosophy into every aspect of our society, electing Ron Paul is at the least a step in the right direction. The politicians are very distant from the people right now, down in the authoritarian and centrist areas. Electing Ron Paul is a shove back in the direction of the people but unfortunately it would not be such a dramatic leap as some speculate, although i wish it was, because with Ron Pauls philosophy we all prosper and we restore the republic.

It may be fun to speculate about such changes or perhaps you fear them, but in the end it won't be as radical as most of you are imagining. Please listen and read about Ron Pauls plans for president, they really aren't all that dramatic as some would make you think. Also lets get real here for a minute, Ron Paul a man in his late 70's who served in congress and fought for the people for over 30 years and the founder of the liberty movement isn't plotting some kind of conspiracy or plans to take over the world or to give to the rich and steal from the poor or to bring back slavery, anarchy, hitler, or anything so ridiculous it should be blatantly obvious, GET REAL!

This is it the real shocker, Ron Pauls evil plot, its not complicated, brace yourself:

its the idea of liberty, written of by great revolutionaries like Thomas Jefferson and all great revolutionaries before and after him, real simple, Love for Humanity and Equality. This is the position Ron Paul consistently identifies with, you can call Ron Paul "Pro-life" but its not the pro-life your thinking about, the neocons and social conservatives with their ridiculous bills...the radical pro-lifers...Ron Paul has stated he will not support these people in their radical mission.

Thomas Jefferson said:

We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable rights, that among these are life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness.

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When you equate Ron Paul to the radical politicians that identify with items such as "Pro-Life" its like equating Gandhi to to King George because they both wore robes, without listening to what either of them has to say or looking at what they have done, Ron Paul has his own unique philosophy and he is a free-thinker. It all comes back to another thing, Identity Vs Philosophy, The Issues Vs Sexiness, sadly many Americans would prefer to see Britney spears over Pink Floyd or watch 2 and a half men or Monday night football instead of studying. This is why watching cable news is like watching Entertainment Tonight 24 hour coverage.

Regarding Cannabis and Religion

What Would Jesus Do? I think he would support Ron Paul in ending the war on humanity and this includes the war on drugs, the slaying of young people for profit, the imprisonment of our youth.


We as a society deserve cannabis, we need it, its our right, we need this more than ever, its a god given human right. It is also freedom of religion. Ask yourself what would Jesus do

- Jesus said that god gives us every herbs are "meat" given to us by god, he said that a time will come when cannabis will be forbidden and it is our duty to protest.

source: http://www.equalrights4all.org/religious/bible.htm

God said, "Behold, I have given you every herb bearing seed which is upon the face of all the earth.…To you it will be for meat." … And God saw everything that he had made, and, behold, it was very good. (Genesis 1:29-31) The Bible predicts some herb's prohibition. "Now the Spirit speaketh expressly, that in the latter times, some shall … speak lies in hypocrisy … commanding to abstain from meats which God hath created to be received with thanksgiving of them which believe and know the truth. (Paul: 1 Timothy 4:1-3)


The Bible speaks of a special plant. "I will raise up for them a plant of renown, and they shall be no more consumed with hunger in the land, neither bear the shame of the heathen any more." (Ezekiel 34:29) A healing plant. On either side of the river, was there the tree of life, which bare 12 manner of fruits, and yielding her fruit every month; and the leaves of the tree were for the healing of the nations. (Revelations 22:1-2) A gift from God.




Cannabis - especially medical cannabis...IS A RIGHT ...NOT A PRIVILEGE! Do what is right

I believe the question was brought up, how will farmers make money? Or something over dramatic like that, I believe on the previous page, anyway......with cannabis anyone can be a farmer and make good money and start a business doing all kinds of things with cannabis and they wont need government subsidies, even without cannabis or hemp, in a truly free market its not necessary. We don't feed the world because a government entity controls the price of corn, its because of these government programs and because of Monsanto that the small guys don't stand a chance, the individual, corporations win, people lose(their health, their rights, their property, their American Dream, and unfortunately sometimes their loved ones or their own life)

You didn't read enough b You apparently don't see the part where it talks about SFA and his 300 families. I guess you don't get that it was after Texians outnumbered mexicans that it was made illegal to come to Mexico. They were allowed to be there. You should read more books about it other than a Wikipedia article.

I'm from Texas and own many books on the subject.

dukeanthony said:

Why do bad laws need to be Followed?

What site are you on again?

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By your logic I should go build a bunch of machine guns if I want. Why are the laws in question bad? You see what you did right? You tried to make me the enemy of the forum by comparing immigration to a harmless weed. Marijuana should be legal for adults, and immigration should be fixed so there are legal paths for people to become citizens of the United States. I also stated that if I were in the position of the Mexican's that I would cross the border and look for work, in fact I think my opinion of it is rather blunt

"They aren't evil drug dealers coming over to mooch welfare, they are human beings who are coming here because they know they can make their lives better. Anyone who wouldn't break the laws if their family was starving and destitute is a coward. It isn't like they are robbing people or murdering, they are just crossing a border to come here for work."

The issue is more than just immigration. The issue is welfare, medicare, immigration, entitlements, ect. I am not suggesting that immigrants get a disproportionate percentage of those or that they come here to milk the system. However, allowing millions of dirt poor illegal immigrants citizenship is going to be a horrendous drag on those things. Those things are also in large part the reason we need the illegal immigrants here to begin with. If stupid people didn't get the government to take care of them, they would have to work doing something. The fact that food is artificially priced low in this country which in turn causes the wages for farm workers to be low so that people in this country refuse to do it is in large part caused by allowing illegal immigrants to work here in the fields. If American's did the jobs, the pay would be higher, the food prices would be higher, and would be sustainable without getting illegal immigrants. Either that or they would mechanize it.

I think the immigrants bring a much needed work ethic to America, and in all honesty, I would trade quite a few 'americans' to Mexico for immigrants. Unfortunately, our civilization is toxic and after the first generation they completely lose their way and start acting like a big part of our population. Lazy, stupid, and ignorant.