Seed Predisposition

Great movie. had to fast forward through a few boring musical bits but overall it was a good watch.

closet.cult said:

But the other previous examples, it appears to me, are only minor 'possible' triggers. It depend on the genetic make-up of each particular seed. Just as some humans may have the genetic predisposition to aquire cancer or seasonal allergies, they may never experience those ailments if they are not exposed to the specific triggers for their genetic makeup.[/I]

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Yes exactly. just because one plant will change with one factor this does not mean that a whole bunch will. Also the hermie factor must come into play before any such event.

I was left very unsatisfied with that DP article the very first time I read it, and am still not happy with it now.

every summer i do an outdoor grow from s large collection of seeds that i have been growing with for about 10 years every year i take about 30 seeds (i have 1000's from selling all the ones i kept are from the same strain) of the 30 plants about 1/2 are female every year.
a few years ago we had a very cold overcast spring and most of summer. that year alone i had 6 hermies. maybe it was my seed but i usually have good outcome. also my brother lives nextdoor to me and 3 of his plants that year were hermie also. is this from environment?
i think so. we also had some mold on plants that year due to it being very damp all year.

Yes it's clear that the environment does play a part in hermies. What isn't clear is whether plants can completely change sex mid-veg'.

Hence the predisposition with seeds.

It is claimed that a plant will be predisposed to be one sex or the other but environmental factors can change the sex of that plant. So it will completely reverse sex.

skunkushybrid said:

Yes it's clear that the environment does play a part in hermies. What isn't clear is whether plants can completely change sex mid-veg'.

Hence the predisposition with seeds.

It is claimed that a plant will be predisposed to be one sex or the other but environmental factors can change the sex of that plant. So it will completely reverse sex.

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That is the complete opposite of what you were trying to say in the beginning of this thread...

nowstopwhining said:

That is the complete opposite of what you were trying to say in the beginning of this thread...

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I'm tired of explaining things to you. If you look at the last part of my post it says... IT IS CLAIMED... the first part of my post says that the environment causes HERMIES....

You want to stay over at GP NSW... or should I call you Rhinadonna. In fact, what are you still doing here? You here just to cause trouble? Maybe to enlist people for your new home (ghost town, rather)?

skunkushybrid said:

I'm tired of explaining things to you. If you look at the last part of my post it says... IT IS CLAIMED... the first part of my post says that the environment causes HERMIES....

You want to stay over at GP NSW... or should I call you Rhinadonna. In fact, what are you still doing here? You here just to cause trouble? Maybe to enlist people for your new home (ghost town, rather)?

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Yeah I do visit GP...did you know fdd is on other forums as well....holy shit what a surprise....

obviously you go there as well, "MUNCH BOX" shouldnt you be banned for multiple accounts? Your a fucking freak.

nowstopwhining said:

Yeah I do visit GP...did you know fdd is on other forums as well....holy shit what a surprise....

obviously you go there as well, "MUNCH BOX" shouldnt you be banned for multiple accounts? Your a fucking freak.

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Who are you calling a freak? me or munch box? I think it's me, as you perceive me as being munch box. OK. Fine.

nowstopwhining said:

Yeah I do visit GP...did you know fdd is on other forums as well....holy shit what a surprise....

obviously you go there as well, "MUNCH BOX" shouldn't you be banned for multiple accounts? Your a fucking freak.

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i do have an account over at the island. i check in maybe once a week. it looked really cool at first but it didn't feel like home. i'm permanently banned from GP. wonder why? i started an account at grasscity before i found rollitup. i think i have 5 or 6 posts over there. that's it. anywhere else and somebody is using my name.

he's said this twice now. i don't get the concern. am i at other sites bashing rollitup? i think not.

if skunk is munch then the guy needs help. i saw the two of them arguing in another thread the other day. very convincing skunk. you should write movies or something.

First, I'd just like to say that I believe that DP information was original falsely posted in OG, which is what led me to doing my own research. Second, I'd also like to say that, I am partially responsible for a recent revival in those DP beliefs simply because I can cut and paste the information without having to write such a long answer like this because until finding this thread and a thread on another forum I belong to, I thought that everyone was in general agreement about this issue. Apparently I was severely mistaken.

Third, I want you all to know I'm not enterting this thread late to try and start an argument, nor am I declaring what I say is fact because it isn't, only opinions based on my own personal grows and research. Over the course of the last 10 or 15 grows that I experimented these 'myths' on, I have discovered on my own semi-controlled grows that certain environmental factors do have an affect on the gender of the plant. I say semi-controlled because I have never had ph problems with my plants, therefore I use no ph meter. I am not disclosing scientific research, so please don't send an attack my way as if I am. Unless I am just a lucky guy and manage to get only 5-10% predetermined male seeds, then these are environmental factors I have noticed that seemed to have some sort of affect on the gender of my plants and only have an affect up until about 1 month of growth:

• 24/0 lighting seems to give me more males, which is why I no longer use it.

• 18/6 lighting seems to give me more females.

• Using 12/12 from sprout doesn't seem to give any higher of a concentration of females than 18/6.

• Constant temps between 65-75f seems to produce more females, while any constant above 80 gives me a higher concentration of males.

• A humidity above 40% seems to produce more females, while a humidity below 25% somehow has shown more males to develop.

I regret to inform all of you that I can't produce any information about different nutrient levels affecting the sex of the plant. And please remember, I am not submitting any of this as fact, only factors that have changed my grows. I'd also like to say that a Jorge Cervantes book was where DP got there information. Can anybody guess which one? I'll give +rep for that answer!

fdd2blk said:

i do have an account over at the island. i check in maybe once a week. it looked really cool at first but it didn't feel like home. i'm permanently banned from GP. wonder why? i started an account at grasscity before i found rollitup. i think i have 5 or 6 posts over there. that's it. anywhere else and somebody is using my name.

he's said this twice now. i don't get the concern. am i at other sites bashing rollitup? i think not.

if skunk is munch then the guy needs help. i saw the two of them arguing in another thread the other day. very convincing skunk. you should write movies or something.

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i have an account at every pot forum i can think of. ic, island, cdot, entho, botswap, i could go on for an hour.....

what's the point?

On topic,all of the info that i have read including that from wiki states that seeds are not predisposed and that environmental factors are the key.
This grow that i am currently doing has the highest ever ratio of males that i have ever had and i think its due to me using the hps for veg.
To much red light causing the wrong environmental factors making more males

Could very well be the problem. Come to think of it, my HPS grow may have had the highest ratio of males I've ever had. I'll be back let me check my notebooks.

natmoon said:

On topic,all of the info that i have read including that from wiki states that seeds are not predisposed and that environmental factors are the key.
This grow that i am currently doing has the highest ever ratio of males that i have ever had and i think its due to me using the hps for veg.
To much red light causing the wrong environmental factors making more males

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Hey nat', you need to read outside of cannabis to read about seed predisposition.

Why would more red light cause more males? I too have had high ratios of males, and likewise high ratios of females. I always veg the same way. Right now I have a 50/50 ratio. If environment played a part then my ratios would always lean one way or the other, and they don't.

I have plants that veg' like a fem and 99% of the time this is what they are and end up, likewise for males.

I just vegged 2 plants in a pure UV environment for 4 weeks, one plant started out like a fem, wider, shorter plant... the other started like a male, and they both followed suit into pre-flower. They followed their growth patterns.

If environment does play a part, then it is with the parents.

mal_crane said:

First, I'd just like to say that I believe that DP information was original falsely posted in OG, which is what led me to doing my own research. Second, I'd also like to say that, I am partially responsible for a recent revival in those DP beliefs simply because I can cut and paste the information without having to write such a long answer like this because until finding this thread and a thread on another forum I belong to, I thought that everyone was in general agreement about this issue. Apparently I was severely mistaken.

Third, I want you all to know I'm not enterting this thread late to try and start an argument, nor am I declaring what I say is fact because it isn't, only opinions based on my own personal grows and research. Over the course of the last 10 or 15 grows that I experimented these 'myths' on, I have discovered on my own semi-controlled grows that certain environmental factors do have an affect on the gender of the plant. I say semi-controlled because I have never had ph problems with my plants, therefore I use no ph meter. I am not disclosing scientific research, so please don't send an attack my way as if I am. Unless I am just a lucky guy and manage to get only 5-10% predetermined male seeds, then these are environmental factors I have noticed that seemed to have some sort of affect on the gender of my plants and only have an affect up until about 1 month of growth:

• 24/0 lighting seems to give me more males, which is why I no longer use it.

• 18/6 lighting seems to give me more females.

• Using 12/12 from sprout doesn't seem to give any higher of a concentration of females than 18/6.

• Constant temps between 65-75f seems to produce more females, while any constant above 80 gives me a higher concentration of males.

• A humidity above 40% seems to produce more females, while a humidity below 25% somehow has shown more males to develop.

I regret to inform all of you that I can't produce any information about different nutrient levels affecting the sex of the plant. And please remember, I am not submitting any of this as fact, only factors that have changed my grows. I'd also like to say that a Jorge Cervantes book was where DP got there information. Can anybody guess which one? I'll give +rep for that answer!

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I always veg' 24/0. I always get a decent ratio. I'm on or around 50/50.

Jorges Cervantes got the information from DP. Their experiment was on feminised seed and the environmental influences that can prevent 100% female plants.

This got confused with real plants and the bullshit spread very quickly. I don't think Jorges cares whether it's actually true or not.

Like you said i have no proof of anything only what i have read.
I have read a lot of material as well as what is written at wiki.
I have never had so many males as i have now after vegging with a hps instead of blue fluros.

Its just my own observations and not a claim to know.
The theory is based on the fact that a hps simulates autumn light and that the plant may be caused to become male thinking that it has not enough time to become a fully fledged female as balls are ready more quickly than buds.

I also tried the seed shape method recently and every single seed out of 18 is male and none of them are female.
Do you think it may be possible that using t8 cool blue tubes on their own help to make more females due to their flicker rate and simulation of blue making the seedlings think it is very early in the season?

Well all cannabis plants have the potential for hermaphroditism, it is possible that they are born with both, and one chromosome becomes more dominant depending on environment. Although the supposition seems very unstable to me.

It makes more sense as a survival mechanism to have a 50/50 ratio. The environment should not matter. If you think back nat' I bet you were very good at spotting fem's and males early. Sometimes you can pip them from the moment they get rid of their seed casings. I do it all the time. Male, female, male etc etc... 90% of the time I am right.

The only differnce light makes is in growth patterns. With more red the plants will have more defined leaf edges, and be of a darker green. You know yourself that cannabis adapts really well and will use whatever light you give it.

Cannabis is born with a genetic code, the environment is not enough to sex reverse a plant. Not unless this trait is somehow encouraged and through successive breeding, a plant is finally created that can be moulded in such a way.

Also, if you were to ask most people on this site that use HID's. They go for HPS, and most only have the space to have 1 light. Most of them go for HPS and use this light all the way through with no problems.

skunkushybrid said:

Well all cannabis plants have the potential for hermaphroditism, it is possible that they are born with both, and one chromosome becomes more dominant depending on environment. Although the supposition seems very unstable to me.

It makes more sense as a survival mechanism to have a 50/50 ratio. The environment should not matter. If you think back nat' I bet you were very good at spotting fem's and males early. Sometimes you can pip them from the moment they get rid of their seed casings. I do it all the time. Male, female, male etc etc... 90% of the time I am right.

The only differnce light makes is in growth patterns. With more red the plants will have more defined leaf edges, and be of a darker green. You know yourself that cannabis adapts really well and will use whatever light you give it.

Cannabis is born with a genetic code, the environment is not enough to sex reverse a plant. Not unless this trait is somehow encouraged and through successive breeding, a plant is finally created that can be moulded in such a way.

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Yeah totally agree with spotting the signs of possible males and females.
I have never vegged with a hps before though and i have never had 18 males from a batch before.
Nothing is different for my room other than the hps.
On my last grow i didn't even have the hps on for the first 2-3 weeks and i only had 2 or 3 males.

My dealer has said that my hps ballast will run mh bulbs as well so i will try this next time and make a veg cupboard as well with three 3 foot t8s in and see if the ratios are better or different.

Really without a proper lab analysis on millions of seeds its a hard call to make with any real sway

18 males is a very rare occurence. You might say impossible.

Surely you see though that a genetic propensity for sex reversal would work to cannabis' detriment. All males cannot continue the line.

Where were the seeds from?