Science behind chemical nutrients and flushing???

Does anybody know the science behind flushing and chemical nutrients? I used to be a huge "flush" guy, until recently. Scientifically, it makes no sense to starve the plants of vital nutrients needed to carry out functions of life, metabolic processes, etc. at any point of its life. I grow organically anyway, but my question, in general, is what form of the nutrient actually enters the plant? Here is an example of what I'm asking...Let's take two common fertilizers - Ammonium Nitrate and let's say Bat Guano. Both of these contain Nitrate as well as ammonia, so what is the difference between the chemically processed nutrients and organic nutrients that the plant uptakes? They use anhydrous ammonia gas and nitric acid to make ammonium nitrate. Do particulates from this chemical reaction find their way into the plant? If the chemical formula for Ammonium nitrate is (NH3NO3), are there other contaminants in the fertilizer that lead to bad taste? Can two molecules of ammonium nitrate (one natural and one synthetic) exist, yet react differently with the plant, or smell/taste differently? Does ammonium nitrate even exist naturally??

Anybody????

depriving nutes makes the plant use up what nutes it has stored up in its leaves then i think its easyer to get the hay smell out while curing im not to sure.

I would like to know the same thing as OP I hope someone replies soon, I can't decide whether to flush or not. Doing chemical nutes in rockwool! Just a few weeks left

doesnt matter if your using natural or chemical nutes. you flush the soil at the end of the grow to remove the nutrients from the medium and the plants so your not smoking them after they have been harvested. one also might flush when switching to flower to remove the veg nutes.

There are natural nitrate minerals, but no natural ammonium ones ... plants like'm too much.
But the difference between an organically or industrially sourced molecule of nutrient salt is precisely dick.
The principal advantage of organics is a hands-off timed release as the complex nutrients get broken down by microbuial action into something the plant can use.

I feed chemically and reserve flushing for correcting salt imbalance or buildup. I don't do a preharvest flush ... I simply feed less and less ... cn

cannabineer said:

There are natural nitrate minerals, but no natural ammonium ones ... plants like'm too much.
But the difference between an organically or industrially sourced molecule of nutrient salt is precisely dick.
The principal advantage of organics is a hands-off timed release as the complex nutrients get broken down by microbuial action into something the plant can use.

I feed chemically and reserve flushing for correcting salt imbalance or buildup. I don't do a preharvest flush ... I simply feed less and less ... cn

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Less and less until just water? or something like 1/4th doses?

A ramp, from full feed (3 weeks prior)'til zip (1 week prior). In soil. In hydro, I just let'm run full boogie until the last week. cn

@cn

Sorry to pick at what you said. Last week as in, during last week also? or you actually do just plain water the last week? T ^T trying to do right

lol, ValueD; I can see how that might be unclear. When I'm (estimated) 21 days out from harvest, I'm still feeding full strength. When I'm seven days out, nute strength is zero. The waterings in between are on a ramp down, depending on what day. The final week is just water.

As far as doing it "right", what you read here on this site should be considered guidelines, rules of thumb. If you do it differently ... and it works ... the blue part is all that matters! Jmo. cn

cannabineer said:

There are natural nitrate minerals, but no natural ammonium ones ... plants like'm too much.
But the difference between an organically or industrially sourced molecule of nutrient salt is precisely dick.
The principal advantage of organics is a hands-off timed release as the complex nutrients get broken down by microbuial action into something the plant can use.

I feed chemically and reserve flushing for correcting salt imbalance or buildup. I don't do a preharvest flush ... I simply feed less and less ... cn

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but, but, but, but, organic tastes sooo much better then inorganic, chemical nutes cannabineer, surely you must be off of your rocker m8..

i'm so glad you said this c/n as i find you to be a very intelligent person and i have respect for your opinion.. to me, i could never understand the difference between nitrogen atom that comes from worm shit and a nitrogen atom that was made in a chemical plant.. in my eyes, nitrogen is nitrogen is nitrogen.. same with any chemical imo..
i hate reading all of these people say that organic tastes best when in my eyes there is no real difference between the two.. i just always thought i was overlooking something or simplifying something that wasn't meant to be simple..

You know what I think would be a lovely experiment? Have two growers (one hardcore soil-organic, the other full-synth hydro) share a clone and identical or comparable lighting and conditions ... then have a blind taste/quality test of the two batches of nug groomed and cured by a neutral third party ... cn

[video=youtube;JjI7VeIA7ZI]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JjI7VeIA7ZI[/video]

cannabineer said:

You know what I think would be a lovely experiment? Have two growers (one hardcore soil-organic, the other full-synth hydro) share a clone and identical or comparable lighting and conditions ... then have a blind taste/quality test of the two batches of nug groomed and cured by a neutral third party ... cn

[video=youtube;JjI7VeIA7ZI]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JjI7VeIA7ZI[/video]

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i'd even settle for organic soil vs chemical soil cannabineer as my one friend says she can spot the difference between a hydro grow and a soil one very easily.. i'm not sure if i've never really smoked enough hydro or any for that matter to be able to tell the difference, but this girl is a soil vs hydro nazi to say the least..

racerboy71 said:

i'd even settle for organic soil vs chemical soil cannabineer as my one friend says she can spot the difference between a hydro grow and a soil one very easily.. i'm not sure if i've never really smoked enough hydro or any for that matter to be able to tell the difference, but this girl is a soil vs hydro nazi to say the least..

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I've done it all three ways ... organic soil, hybrid soil (Happy Frog until it ran dry, then GH 3-part to feed from there) and full-synthetic hydro. I've liked the bud from all three ... and couldn't really tell a big diff.
But yes; putting a soil plus salt ferts run in there would be nice.
I didn't suggest an organic hydro run because I find using "teas" for hydro inelegant to the point of offense. Organic and soil seem made for each other, in a sense. cn

op.. the diffrence between organic and chemical fertilizer is just a carbon atom... meaning organic nutes just break down easier no heavy metals in them like harsher chemical nutes have... also the science behind flushing is you cutt off all nutes for last 2 lweeks.. and you start flushing it with heavy amounts of water for those 2 weeks.. one your leaching any remaining nutes left in the soil... and 2 by not adding adding any more food just clean water for plants it helps "flush" the remaining harshness from the nutes by the plant sweating... just how we do too.... curing is also a must... it brings out the true flavor and taste of whatever strain, takes away remaining left harshness from the end product, and also mature the cannaboids a bit depending on how long you cure... simply it provides cleaner, smoother, but yet slightly stronger medicine that should burn the whitest white ash..

cannabineer said:

I've done it all three ways ... organic soil, hybrid soil (Happy Frog until it ran dry, then GH 3-part to feed from there) and full-synthetic hydro. I've liked the bud from all three ... and couldn't really tell a big diff.
But yes; putting a soil plus salt ferts run in there would be nice.
I didn't suggest an organic hydro run because I find using "teas" for hydro inelegant to the point of offense. Organic and soil seem made for each other, in a sense. cn

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i can always spot out full synthetic hydro....its usually the best solid sexiest looking rock hard nugget that fucking burns the shit outta your throat and burns a dirtier grey

theexpress said:

op.. the diffrence between organic and chemical fertilizer is just a carbon atom... meaning organic nutes just break down easier no heavy metals in them like harsher chemical nutes have... also the science behind flushing is you cutt off all nutes for last 2 lweeks.. and you start flushing it with heavy amounts of water for those 2 weeks.. one your leaching any remaining nutes left in the soil... and 2 by not adding adding any more food just clean water for plants it helps "flush" the remaining harshness from the nutes by the plant sweating... just how we do too.... curing is also a must... it brings out the true flavor and taste of whatever strain, takes away remaining left harshness from the end product, and also mature the cannaboids a bit depending on how long you cure... simply it provides cleaner, smoother, but yet slightly stronger medicine that should burn the whitest white ash..

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I challenge the bolded. cn

cannabineer said:

I challenge the bolded. cn

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http://voices.yahoo.com/organic-molecules-carbon-atoms-cell-molecules-4209415.html?cat=5

the most importent part of that was the very first few lines....


One thing that can be difficult for people to understand is the study of organic molecules and carbon atoms. Organic molecules are molecules of the living world. These molecules contain both carbon and hydrogen, while inorganic molecules, such as H2O, do not.

theexpress said:

http://voices.yahoo.com/organic-molecules-carbon-atoms-cell-molecules-4209415.html?cat=5

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Even in an organic grow, all the nutrient molecules are inorganic (by the chemist's definition). There's no carbon atom inserted anywhere. Nutrient precursors can indeed be organic (e.g. phospholipids or amino acids) but for the plant to use them, microbial action has to first knock them down to the old classics: nitrate, phosphate etc. cn