RIP Hostess

Fuck this little pissing match though, because it's detracting from the conversation.

Kelly4-

Do you honestly believe the company should be able to side-step it's contractual obligation to employees', and then turn back around and clear huge profits from selling off the brands' they own all while pocketing the difference?
 
FOUR20 SWG said:
Fuck this little pissing match though, because it's detracting from the conversation.

Kelly4-

Do you honestly believe the company should be able to side-step it's contractual obligation to employees', and then turn back around and clear huge profits from selling off the brands' they own all while pocketing the difference?
Click to expand...

Pissing match? I thought we were just joking around.

No, I don't think it's fair. There's a lot of things that aren't fair. The workers should have seen the writing on the wall a long time ago. Had I worked for that company I would have been lookin for a new job a while ago...
 
kelly4 said:
Pissing match? I thought we were just joking around.

No, I don't think it's fair. There's a lot of things that aren't fair. The workers should have seen the writing on the wall a long time ago. Had I worked for that company I would have been lookin for a new job a while ago...
Click to expand...
And they should of left the investment they made in Their Life?
You can easily find another job
You cannot get back the years you put into it
 
I really don't care if you want to bang old ladies bro, it's kinda weird that you put it on the net like that but to each his own.

What I think is really goin on here is that you know you can't contribute to the original topic and decided to run with this because I called you out on the fact that you live in your mom's basement.

But I digress.

Ok, so you admit it's not fair. And then what? Hindsight is 20-20, so of course they SHOULD have seen it coming but they didn't.

My original point is this; you can't absolve the company simply because "life sucks". The deterioration of society starts when average people throw in the towel and say fuck it.

I know getting on here and "bitching" doesn't do much, but honestly man? I'm pissed off.

I'm tired of feeling lied to and fucked over at every turn by every person who has the ability to do so. Corporate, political, religious. All pressure from all sides at all times now it seems. And this forum is pretty much the only real avenue to vent on because there is usually a sizeable collection of likeminded and equally disheartened people on here.

If you were joking and I didn't catch it, then that is my bad and it wouldn't be the first time I misread something like that. It's hard to scale down debate-mode when you go into it, something i'm sure others here can relate too.
 
FOUR20 SWG said:
Ok, so you admit it's not fair. And then what? Hindsight is 20-20, so of course they SHOULD have seen it coming but they didn't.

My original point is this; you can't absolve the company simply because "life sucks". The deterioration of society starts when average people throw in the towel and say fuck it.

I know getting on here and "bitching" doesn't do much, but honestly man? I'm pissed off.

I'm tired of feeling lied to and fucked over at every turn by every person who has the ability to do so. Corporate, political, religious. All pressure from all sides at all times now it seems. And this forum is pretty much the only real avenue to vent on because there is usually a sizeable collection of likeminded and equally disheartened people on here.

If you were joking and I didn't catch it, then that is my bad and it wouldn't be the first time I misread something like that. It's hard to scale down debate-mode when you go into it, something i'm sure others here can relate too.
Click to expand...
A long time ago I worked at a Kmart distribution center. The 401k company match was paid for in Kmart stock. Every single person who worked there knew what was eventually going to happen to Kmart. I paid a penalty and cashed out. 1 year later, all that Kmart stock was worthless. I was one of the few who cashed out early. Some longtimers lost hundreds of thousands of dollars. Every worker there knew what was going to happen, yet they all just hoped for the best. It never happened. It pays to be smart.

That Kmart DC has been closed for a while now. Despite all the stupid things that Kmart does, they are still kicking. But, they will go under. Anyone who works there and isn't preparing for their eventual downfall is a moron.

Who are you all going to blame when Kmart goes under? The writing has been on the wall for 20 years...
 
FOUR20 SWG said:
But why should they be forced to choose between less salary and no salary, while the bosses take raises?
Click to expand...
They should probably try become the boss...

How come less than ten years ago the common attitude was to attempt to better oneself? Now it's "I can't, so I won't try and just hate those who can".
 
FOUR20 SWG said:
But why should they be forced to choose between less salary and no salary, while the bosses take raises?
Click to expand...
Who is forcing them to work there? Were they being held captive?

The union and the workers put themselves out of work. Being in a union is not a guarantee of future well being. They had a choice and they voted.

Nobody ever foced those workers to do anything. Any worker can leave any job at any time. When they force those workers to work at gunpoint, give me a holler and I'll join the march with you.
 
Harrekin said:
They should probably try become the boss...

How come less than ten years ago the common attitude was to attempt to better oneself? Now it's "I can't, so I won't try and just hate those who can".
Click to expand...

Whatever happened to
You made a promise to me as an employee, And I loyally worked for you for years of my life I can never get back and now you want to go back on your obligations, promises and contracts. All while enriching yourself at the expense of my labor and lifespan?
 
Harrekin said:
They should probably try become the boss...

How come less than ten years ago the common attitude was to attempt to better oneself? Now it's "I can't, so I won't try and just hate those who can".
Click to expand...


I can't comment on the situation where you live man.

But what I do know, is that people here are starting to wake up to the fact that we won't all be millionaires, football players, or movie stars and that the concept of catering to the top perctile doesn't actually better the lives of average people.

I'm not calling for a communist-style system, I do recognize that competition is necessary for capitalism to work and that some will prosper some will fail. But that doesn't mean you tip the scales in favor of companies, because in this country in particular they already enjoy ridculous ammounts of freedom. Hell, half of our damn government thinks Wal-Mart counts as a person! Businesses have to be held accountable at times like this. A federal mediator being brought in to ensure that employee pensions are honored with the proceeds of brand sell-off and equipment/assest liquidation seems like a fair way to do it from where I sit. Maybe that's already the procedure they use and i'm being redundant, but it seriously bothers me to think that the people who ran the company into the ground (management) are going to be the people least effected by it's closing.

And Kelly, I understand where you are coming from in regards to the 401k that you salvaged before the company went tits up. And i'm sure plenty of those employees "saw the writing on the wall," but didn't have the means or abilities to find other careers so had to ride it out and hope for the best. That doesn't mean they should be punished for having faith in the company.

Everyone on here has been ranting about "$30-an-hour Union piracy" when in fact i'm pretty sure even the highest paid members were only making like $20-an-hour. Still good money, i'm just saying these guys aren't rich by any stretch of the imagination and aren't sucking the lifeblood out of a business. CEOs who take bonuses when the company is in The Shit, that is where I call foul.
 
FOUR20 SWG said:
Everyone on here has been ranting about "$30-an-hour Union piracy" when in fact i'm pretty sure even the highest paid members were only making like $20-an-hour. Still good money, i'm just saying these guys aren't rich by any stretch of the imagination and aren't sucking the lifeblood out of a business. CEOs who take bonuses when the company is in The Shit, that is where I call foul.
Click to expand...


What was this last/best/final offer? You'd never know by watching the main stream media tell the story. So here you go...
1) 8% hourly pay cut in year 1 with additional cuts totaling 27% over 5 years. Currently, I make $16.12 an hour at TOP rate of pay in the bakery. I would drop to $11.26 in 5 years.
2) They get to keep our $3+ an hour forever.
3) Doubling of weekly insurance premium.
4) Lowering of overall quality of insurance plan.
5) TOTAL withdrawal from ALL pensions. If you don't have it now then you never will.

Remember how I said I made $48,000 in 2005 and $34,000 last year? I would make $25,000 in 5 years if I took their offer.
It will be hard to replace the job I had, but it will be easy to replace the job they were trying to give me.
That $3+ per hour they steal totaled $50 million last year that they never paid us. They sold $2.5 BILLION in product last year. If they can't make this profitable without stealing my money then good riddance.
 
ChesusRice said:
And they should of left the investment they made in Their Life?You can easily find another jobYou cannot get back the years you put into it
Click to expand...
Correct.There is no "right" or "guarantee" that the time you spend in the employ of a company will be rewarded or even fairly compensated. It's not YOUR job, it's the company's job. You temporarily occupy it at the sole discretion of those that do OWN the job. This is the fundamental flaw of unions that clashes with common sense. You DON'T have a say in compensation, you DON'T have a say in benefits, you only have a choice to accept or decline employment based on the offered compensation.Just as those of us that run our own companies have no "right" or "guarantee" of success, regardless of how hard we work or how many years of our lives we have devoted to it. Why should employees have safegaurds that aren't even available to the owners? Free market bitches, everything else eventually leads to ruin...or some heinous flavor of "ism" and then ruin.
 
ChesusRice said:
What was this last/best/final offer? You'd never know by watching the main stream media tell the story. So here you go... 1) 8% hourly pay cut in year 1 with additional cuts totaling 27% over 5 years. Currently, I make $16.12 an hour at TOP rate of pay in the bakery. I would drop to $11.26 in 5 years. 2) They get to keep our $3+ an hour forever. 3) Doubling of weekly insurance premium. 4) Lowering of overall quality of insurance plan. 5) TOTAL withdrawal from ALL pensions. If you don't have it now then you never will. Remember how I said I made $48,000 in 2005 and $34,000 last year? I would make $25,000 in 5 years if I took their offer. It will be hard to replace the job I had, but it will be easy to replace the job they were trying to give me. That $3+ per hour they steal totaled $50 million last year that they never paid us. They sold $2.5 BILLION in product last year. If they can't make this profitable without stealing my money then good riddance.
Click to expand...
And he was drastically overpaid at 25k. Especially if there are people that would gladly do the job for 18k. You keep posting this like you're making a point. The only thing you're proving is you think 25k is underpaid for his job. That's an opinion and an incorrect one at that. What the selfish prick did accomplish by striking instead of quitting was, keeping others that would happily work for those wages from having the opportunity to do so.
 
MuyLocoNC said:
And he was drastically overpaid at 25k. Especially if there are people that would gladly do the job for 18k. You keep posting this like you're making a point. The only thing you're proving is you think 25k is underpaid for his job. That's an opinion and an incorrect one at that. What the selfish prick did accomplish by striking instead of quitting was, keeping others that would happily work for those wages from having the opportunity to do so.
Click to expand...

And you install window blinds
you are definatly overpaid for your skill-less profession
Your wages should be cut
 
ChesusRice said:
You gonna "like" his posts when he is replaced at a cheaper cost by legal mexican immigrants?

I will definatly be laughing

The guy installs window blinds
Click to expand...
Yeah and you basically run a "metal (instead of paper) printer" attached to a computer.

Plus you like little boys, you sick fuck.
 
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