Recommendations for True Landrace Strains?

Thundercat · Nov 9, 2019

WinterSoldier89 said:
What do you think a landrace has that a hybrid doesn't, genuinely interested.

I am interested in "landrace" because its different. Modern hybrids have many similarities between strains, because everyone makes crosses with the newest hype out. Like currently MASSIVE amounts of the market are some sort of cookies cross. I would love to get some genetics that are sitting on a hillside in india, or afghanistan that are different. As much as I like sativas I'm much less interested in the African sativa landraces that everyone usually talks about. I would want high mountain indian or afghan plants so they were hardier and would actually finish in a normal time frame.

conor c · Nov 9, 2019

Ailalelo said:
What I say is that many of the seeds sold as landraces are not, but there are also quite a lot that look like the real thing. I guess a genetic analysis would provide the definitive diagnosis. I think we should make our opinion on every strain based in our experience, and I can speak only of these seeds I've already grown.

I don't know about this seedbank you say, but even while they sell real strains from exotic places (I suppose what they claim is true) it is very believable that not all of their strains are technically landraces. But they could still be nice exotic 100% sativas and indicas that may satisfy more than a client, or cultivars that have been hybridized decades ago and have started to "evolve back" to what they were. I've found very nice herbs like that, in fact I prefer them before real real landraces. The real thing, specifically tropical sativas, is a hell to grow.

I'll have a look to that pot cast you say; where can I find it? Thanks

Cheers

Unlike most
The real seeds is unworked lines ace cannabiogen etc are all selected lines

conor c · Nov 9, 2019

Ailalelo said:
What I say is that many of the seeds sold as landraces are not, but there are also quite a lot that look like the real thing. I guess a genetic analysis would provide the definitive diagnosis. I think we should make our opinion on every strain based in our experience, and I can speak only of these seeds I've already grown.

I don't know about this seedbank you say, but even while they sell real strains from exotic places (I suppose what they claim is true) it is very believable that not all of their strains are technically landraces. But they could still be nice exotic 100% sativas and indicas that may satisfy more than a client, or cultivars that have been hybridized decades ago and have started to "evolve back" to what they were. I've found very nice herbs like that, in fact I prefer them before real real landraces. The real thing, specifically tropical sativas, is a hell to grow.

I'll have a look to that pot cast you say; where can I find it? Thanks

Cheers

Think he meant the adam dunn show on youtube

yesum · Nov 9, 2019

Landrace means a strain that has acclimated to a area. So a OG Kush that has been grown outdoors for 20 years in one spot is a landrace.

What you are chasing are old lines that have been selected/hopefully by farmers who grow outdoors, More accurately called heirlooms. If no selection the thc level will drop and effects will be whatever....

Because ACE or whoever selects from heirlooms and breeds them a bit does not mean the strain is lost. If they cross it then that is different. You do not want wild landraces because the thc is going to low in most cases.

Real Seeds is the most unworked of the places to get seeds. They get the seeds and reproduce them but do not select afik. The hashish lines they carry can be quite low potency.

Coalcat · Nov 9, 2019

Ailalelo said:
What I say is that many of the seeds sold as landraces are not, but there are also quite a lot that look like the real thing. I guess a genetic analysis would provide the definitive diagnosis. I think we should make our opinion on every strain based in our experience, and I can speak only of these seeds I've already grown.

I don't know about this seedbank you say, but even while they sell real strains from exotic places (I suppose what they claim is true) it is very believable that not all of their strains are technically landraces. But they could still be nice exotic 100% sativas and indicas that may satisfy more than a client, or cultivars that have been hybridized decades ago and have started to "evolve back" to what they were. I've found very nice herbs like that, in fact I prefer them before real real landraces. The real thing, specifically tropical sativas, is a hell to grow.

I'll have a look to that pot cast you say; where can I find it? Thanks

Cheers

definitely not Adam Dunn show. They are night and day different. Your gonna love this. It’s amazing info and great to listen to.

Also on itunes.
https://soundcloud.com/the_pot_cast

Michael Huntherz · Nov 10, 2019

yesum said:
Landrace means a strain that has acclimated to a area. So a OG Kush that has been grown outdoors for 20 years in one spot is a landrace.

That final assertion is false, according to the way “landrace” is used in agriculture and biology.

yesum said:
What you are chasing are old lines that have been selected/hopefully by farmers who grow outdoors, More accurately called heirlooms.

Yeah, that’s accurate, faith restored.

Thefarmer12 · Nov 10, 2019

@fullpowerselections on Instagram. Believe the email is [email protected]

They have legit landrace, many of them them the Indian varieties you're looking for as well as SE Asian varieties. Doesn't get much more authentic than these guys for true landrace genetics...

Ailalelo · Nov 10, 2019

conor c said:
Unlike most
The real seeds is unworked lines ace cannabiogen etc are all selected lines

For me, that's a good reason not to have any of their seeds. I understand that a professional geneticist, or sometimes even a breeder could make use of these raw unselected herma genetics, maybe trying to find-analyze-awake-activate (whatever) some specific genetic properties, like resistance to illness and drought, for example, or just for learning, sequencing or whatever scientific work geneticists do. I don't think that we must believe that these genes we seek for are going to disappear once we make a work of selection, but I can understand that this could happen and the wider the gene pool the better.

But I don't really understand why normal pot smokers would grow them. Much better to start from a selection that joints the best characteristics of the strain, and saves you the years of work that are needed for selection, for example sexual traits. You can't work with hermas. That's my experience.

"Authenticity" doesn't mean shit if the "legitimately authentic" is a weak herma sativa that never finishes and is going to be terrible in taste and effect once grown. People back in the day (60's... 70's) liked their weed, so I can't believe that in the seek of "authenticity" people are growing plants much worse than these they had back in the day because it is "more authentic". I also believe that some cultivars, like for example Jamaican strains, have degenerated due to lack of selection.

All the varieties of cannabis have been made this way from thousands of years ago: selecting. Like any other vegetable like rice, potato, tomato, whatever. It is plain stupid not to get seeds from the best specimens if your objective is not scientific and what you want is to smoke weed.

Cheers

Ailalelo · Nov 10, 2019

Thundercat said:
I am interested in "landrace" because its different. Modern hybrids have many similarities between strains, because everyone makes crosses with the newest hype out. Like currently MASSIVE amounts of the market are some sort of cookies cross. I would love to get some genetics that are sitting on a hillside in india, or afghanistan that are different. As much as I like sativas I'm much less interested in the African sativa landraces that everyone usually talks about. I would want high mountain indian or afghan plants so they were hardier and would actually finish in a normal time frame.

I am also very interested in what is different. I don't like much modern hybrids, in my threads here I work with different strains, none of them being commercial. But I'd like to point that there are a lot of grays in between commercial and landrace.

There are "old" hybrids and very nice and diverse strains that are different and offer much more fun than landraces, or heirlooms, or whatever "natural" weed you can find. There are very nice hybrids NOT made with OG, Gorilla, NL, White Widow, Super Silver Haze, etc. These feminised hybrids made just crossing two elite clones are a lack of respect of what breeding is. That's how Dinafem, Sweet Seeds and many others "work".

I guess that if you like indicas you are going to find something you like in these banks these guys have recommended. I've grown some heirloom sativas and are a pain in the ass, but a very nice growing experience.

Cheers

Thundercat · Nov 10, 2019

Ailalelo said:
I am also very interested in what is different. I don't like much modern hybrids, in my threads here I work with different strains, none of them being commercial. But I'd like to point that there are a lot of grays in between commercial and landrace.

There are "old" hybrids and very nice and diverse strains that are different and offer much more fun than landraces, or heirlooms, or whatever "natural" weed you can find. There are very nice hybrids NOT made with OG, Gorilla, NL, White Widow, Super Silver Haze, etc. These feminised hybrids made just crossing two elite clones are a lack of respect of what breeding is. That's how Dinafem, Sweet Seeds and many others "work".

I guess that if you like indicas you are going to find something you like in these banks these guys have recommended. I've grown some heirloom sativas and are a pain in the ass, but a very nice growing experience.

Cheers

I actually prefer sativas, but I have some great C99 and crosses I count on for that. I said "landrace" in parenthesis, heirlooms is probably the better term. I've ran 16 week sativas with very few problems other then it takes time. I havn't had the space though in years, and now I live in an area where I can do some outdoor, but its too short of a season for those sativas

.

I totally agree that all the S1 elites, and untested pollen chucks are very disrespectful. That's why I don't get all that excited about the newest hype strains. I like seeing breeders spend time on their lines, and put love into the selections. I'd like to run some Mandala seeds some time, because it seems like that's how they bred/breed (not sure how active they still are).

yesum · Nov 10, 2019

Michael Huntherz said:
That final assertion is false, according to the way “landrace” is used in agriculture and biology.

Yeah, that’s accurate, faith restored.

Well you can tell that to all the people that call maui wowie and other lines landraces. It is known that maui is not even close to 100 years old and who knows how long Acapulco Gold or many other lines were grown without being messed with. So my 'assertion' is more like fact as far as cannabis followers are concerned. Pedantic types not withstanding.

Michael Huntherz · Nov 12, 2019

yesum said:
Well you can tell that to all the people that call maui wowie and other lines landraces. It is known that maui is not even close to 100 years old and who knows how long Acapulco Gold or many other lines were grown without being messed with. So my 'assertion' is more like fact as far as cannabis followers are concerned. Pedantic types not withstanding.

We “cannabis followers” should pay attention to real science and agriculture a lot more, and our own bro-flavored pseudoscientific echo chamber less, pedantic types not notwithstanding.

I would be fascinated to see a molecular phylogeny study of those Hawaiian strains, to see what their genetic background is and see when/if and how far they have diverged from wild landraces.

I realize my posts in threads like this tend to be critical, but they are not mean spirited, try not to twist it too hard. Cheers.

Vishalॐ · Jun 24, 2020

Here is a pure landrace Sativa from Himalayas. Requires alot of patience though. The buds are quite lean.

conor c · Jun 30, 2020

Ailalelo said:
For me, that's a good reason not to have any of their seeds. I understand that a professional geneticist, or sometimes even a breeder could make use of these raw unselected herma genetics, maybe trying to find-analyze-awake-activate (whatever) some specific genetic properties, like resistance to illness and drought, for example, or just for learning, sequencing or whatever scientific work geneticists do. I don't think that we must believe that these genes we seek for are going to disappear once we make a work of selection, but I can understand that this could happen and the wider the gene pool the better.

But I don't really understand why normal pot smokers would grow them. Much better to start from a selection that joints the best characteristics of the strain, and saves you the years of work that are needed for selection, for example sexual traits. You can't work with hermas. That's my experience.

"Authenticity" doesn't mean shit if the "legitimately authentic" is a weak herma sativa that never finishes and is going to be terrible in taste and effect once grown. People back in the day (60's... 70's) liked their weed, so I can't believe that in the seek of "authenticity" people are growing plants much worse than these they had back in the day because it is "more authentic". I also believe that some cultivars, like for example Jamaican strains, have degenerated due to lack of selection.

All the varieties of cannabis have been made this way from thousands of years ago: selecting. Like any other vegetable like rice, potato, tomato, whatever. It is plain stupid not to get seeds from the best specimens if your objective is not scientific and what you want is to smoke weed.

Cheers

Obviously man had been influencing weed forever and selecting for what we like but your forgetting that raw landraces have alot of variation resistance and without them you wouldnt have the alphabet soup of strains that we have today plus your forgetting people may wanna grow these types of strains purely for nostalgia purposes especially if there from the generations who grew up with imported cannabis and hash on the regular

Coalcat · Jun 30, 2020

Ailalelo said:
For me, that's a good reason not to have any of their seeds. I understand that a professional geneticist, or sometimes even a breeder could make use of these raw unselected herma genetics, maybe trying to find-analyze-awake-activate (whatever) some specific genetic properties, like resistance to illness and drought, for example, or just for learning, sequencing or whatever scientific work geneticists do. I don't think that we must believe that these genes we seek for are going to disappear once we make a work of selection, but I can understand that this could happen and the wider the gene pool the better.

But I don't really understand why normal pot smokers would grow them. Much better to start from a selection that joints the best characteristics of the strain, and saves you the years of work that are needed for selection, for example sexual traits. You can't work with hermas. That's my experience.

"Authenticity" doesn't mean shit if the "legitimately authentic" is a weak herma sativa that never finishes and is going to be terrible in taste and effect once grown. People back in the day (60's... 70's) liked their weed, so I can't believe that in the seek of "authenticity" people are growing plants much worse than these they had back in the day because it is "more authentic". I also believe that some cultivars, like for example Jamaican strains, have degenerated due to lack of selection.

All the varieties of cannabis have been made this way from thousands of years ago: selecting. Like any other vegetable like rice, potato, tomato, whatever. It is plain stupid not to get seeds from the best specimens if your objective is not scientific and what you want is to smoke weed.

Cheers

I don’t think you get the point. Land races themselves can be very excellent with great effects and flavors but take forever and grow too big and have poor structure...so some smart guy breeds that out of them with other strains and tries to get the best of both worlds to max yield and indoor growing ability ect. It doesn’t mean the original was bad. As a matter of fact I would say the original might have been better because the results of hybrids muddle everything. Don’t get me wrong there are significant drawbacks to land races, but I think your blanket Implication people who grow land races are just for the good old days and there is no true quality is wrong.

Your tomato analogy is actually very apt. The tomatoes in the store are big, red, yield well, store long, and don’t bruise easy. But honestly I think they are shit. They are flavorless. Give me a heirloom any day. They may be ugly, harder to grow, yield less but they are far superior.

Coalcat · Jun 30, 2020

Ohh btw I’m just trying to give you another POV. I would agree that alot of what you say is very true. Just don’t totally discount that there are some killer wierd and strong land races (or as close as there can be now a days). People are willing to put up with a lot of bs if the effect is usual or unique.

waterproof808 · Jun 30, 2020

yesum said:
Well you can tell that to all the people that call maui wowie and other lines landraces. It is known that maui is not even close to 100 years old and who knows how long Acapulco Gold or many other lines were grown without being messed with. So my 'assertion' is more like fact as far as cannabis followers are concerned. Pedantic types not withstanding.

Pretty much every knowledgeable grower in Hawaii knows there is no such thing as a Hawaiian Landrace, there isnt even a real strain called "Maui Wowie" it was just a general term used to describe any weed that came from Maui. The only people that refer to Hawaiian strains as landraces are clowns like Pua Mana Seed company and that dude has been proven to be a fraud dozens of times on this forum alone.

Ailalelo · Jul 1, 2020

Coalcat said:
I don’t think you get the point. Land races themselves can be very excellent with great effects and flavors but take forever and grow too big and have poor structure...so some smart guy breeds that out of them with other strains and tries to get the best of both worlds to max yield and indoor growing ability ect. It doesn’t mean the original was bad. As a matter of fact I would say the original might have been better because the results of hybrids muddle everything. Don’t get me wrong there are significant drawbacks to land races, but I think your blanket Implication people who grow land races are just for the good old days and there is no true quality is wrong.

Your tomato analogy is actually very apt. The tomatoes in the store are big, red, yield well, store long, and don’t bruise easy. But honestly I think they are shit. They are flavorless. Give me a heirloom any day. They may be ugly, harder to grow, yield less but they are far superior.

conor c said:
Obviously man had been influencing weed forever and selecting for what we like but your forgetting that raw landraces have alot of variation resistance and without them you wouldnt have the alphabet soup of strains that we have today plus your forgetting people may wanna grow these types of strains purely for nostalgia purposes especially if there from the generations who grew up with imported cannabis and hash on the regular

Guys, I recommend you spend years growing and crossing landraces, heirlooms or any kind of herb and make your own experience. I've shared mine. Enjoy

Coalcat · Jul 1, 2020

Ailalelo said:
Guys, I recommend you spend years growing and crossing landraces, heirlooms or any kind of herb and make your own experience. I've shared mine. Enjoy

I will!
http://instagr.am/p/B4yHyKXBISN/

blueberryrose · Jul 2, 2020

Coalcat said:
I will!
http://instagr.am/p/B4yHyKXBISN/

I just popped a mango thai - got my order form RSC recently. Germinated easy. Soaked in water 17 hours, another 24 hours with wet paper towel, and already in a rockwool cube to see how it goes.

Also got:
3 Himalayan sativas
Malana Cream
Rasoli (free)
Kumaoni (free)
Mango Thai (Lao sativa landrace reportedly has phenos with insane thc levels)
Tirah
Assorted afghans (free)

Most of Realseedco's stuff is cultivars anyway, he only has a few real wild types.

Ok so probably they won't yield as high as many modern hybrids, so what?
For me, it would be interesting raising these plants and exploring their natures. Probably won't let any of the sativas grow to the advertised 3 meters. I also firmly believe that once I start finding some phenos I like better, they could be nicely combined with more contemporary Western hybrids.
I wonder what that Lao sativa might be like crossed with a WhiteCookies or a BruceBanner, I think it could be worth trying.
Who knows, I may just make seeds and eventually have them available to other collectors.

Recommendations for True Landrace Strains?

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