Pulling 4oz off 1 plant ?

Hi,
I really hope you dont rely on the areo set up to 'grant you' the four oz a plant. More often you see in hydro, people with more plants per bulb and try to veg half or original thought about veg time. This is true because roots do grow fast in a hydro set up. So, again, when you think about what factors will give you four oz a plant, it really starts at what light source you have. Than look at how many plants and system you want to run. Pick your strain carefully because their are lot of people saying alot of stuff and they really just repeat what they hear. Make sure you pick a plant that loves a hydro set up if you insist on hydro.
I know theirs going to be people argue this one but they are arguing on this fact just because they are more interested in talking about themselves. Expect a better yield per plant in soilless medium than soil and hydro (hydro in most case's) Hydro is better PRIMARY for cutting veg time back- not for bud size (love the misconception!). I mean, aruge if you want, just so happens I know the true basis of hydro because of some very important people that prob are responsible for alot of the food you eat. They are educated in their fields.

So, your in areo, try it out, see if it's for you. Dont expect to get what others claim on the web When someone say's they got 2lb with it, you know they got 1lb They new readily available G13 strain looks interesting.. I would look into that. its 100% indica too. Think it is by barneys or DNA, its on the new skunk and high times.

High quality lights, high quality nutrients, attention to detail, and a good training technique and it is totally possible with less than 4 ft of head space. Scrog or LST is your best bet, honestly. Topping is great too, but personally I can LST to be 2-3ft wide in all direction with no additional support. All you need is a strong stem from excellent veg practice and diet, and some constant training, and you can pull 4oz off a plant if you are pro, maybe 2.5-3oz your first time with a good strain. But SCROG seems to be the absolute most effective method. I still haven't tried it though, but have observed several grows in person and online. I have used topping, FIM, and LST, and I love them all, but LST is my favorite.

You need at least 2 lamps, 600w+
That's assuming you aren't the next Jack Herrer.

Jozikins, prob one of the most honest person i meet on this forum in a while!

Rep for that

JLStiffy said:

Hi,
They new readily available G13 strain looks interesting.. I would look into that. its 100% indica too. Think it is by barneys or DNA, its on the new skunk and high times.

Click to expand...

Dr. Greenthumb has a claimed G-13. He has an impressive reputation but also is very expensive.

Jozikins said:

High quality lights, high quality nutrients, attention to detail, and a good training technique and it is totally possible with less than 4 ft of head space. Scrog or LST is your best bet, honestly. Topping is great too, but personally I can LST to be 2-3ft wide in all direction with no additional support. All you need is a strong stem from excellent veg practice and diet, and some constant training, and you can pull 4oz off a plant if you are pro, maybe 2.5-3oz your first time with a good strain. But SCROG seems to be the absolute most effective method. I still haven't tried it though, but have observed several grows in person and online. I have used topping, FIM, and LST, and I love them all, but LST is my favorite.

Click to expand...

Jozikins, how long do you think you need to veg to shoot for 3-4oz/plant if you topped via Uncle Ben's method for example? Would LST or SCROG provide similar results? I have only done 5 day veg single cola SOG for now, but would like to reduct my plant count to 12 for each 4x4' area. The plan is to veg for 4 weeks, Uncle Ben top, and shoot for 3oz/plant in a flood and drain. Not sure if that is realistic or not...

medicine21 said:

Dr. Greenthumb has a claimed G-13. He has an impressive reputation but also is very expensive.



Jozikins, how long do you think you need to veg to shoot for 3-4oz/plant if you topped via Uncle Ben's method for example? Would LST or SCROG provide similar results? I have only done 5 day veg single cola SOG for now, but would like to reduct my plant count to 12 for each 4x4' area. The plan is to veg for 4 weeks, Uncle Ben top, and shoot for 3oz/plant in a flood and drain. Not sure if that is realistic or not...

Click to expand...

That should be very doable, if the genetics are capable. I veg 4-6 weeks, depending on strain and I get an average of around four.

I can get 70+ grams for every 100 watts of light with a basic soil SoG and 6-8 week vegetative period.

Not sure of g/kwh off the top of my head, which is a better measure of yield, albeit still somewhat flawed for direct comparison.

Wolverine97 said:

That should be very doable, if the genetics are capable. I veg 4-6 weeks, depending on strain and I get an average of around four.

Click to expand...

Is it possible to fit 12 of those 3-4oz topped plants in a 4x4' area?

medicine21 said:

Is it possible to fit 12 of those 3-4oz topped plants in a 4x4' area?

Click to expand...

You're going to need some serious light to get that kind of weight from a 4x4.

Thanks for the kind words everyone Being as realistic as possible keeps your expectations from getting to high, and you'll end up extremely pleased with your results. Is that a picture of your own crop JL? If so, I'm very jealous of the successful outdoor grower!

Realize if you want 12 plants with 4oz each in a 4x4 space you will be growing very tall, very thin plants with a lot of fluff on the bottom. I think we need to rethink this. Less plants, more bush.

Let's think about strains. Grape Kush is a easy favorite of mine right now, super easy to grow with excellent buds, and huge huge yields! So is AK 47. Larry's OG and SFV OG can make any first time grower feel like a stud. Right now I am having my mind blown by Strawberry Cough, which is usually a very small grower. It was originally a mom from seed I had to flower, it was to gorgeous to clone to death once it got big. I vegged her for about 5 weeks, and at week 5 I cut her in half. I topped her too low and she had a big fat hole in her stem, so I clamped it with a paper clamp and left 6 sets of branches on, let her veg for another week and threw her into flower. OMG she is huge! But not too big for my 600w, she takes up at least a 2.5'x2.0 footprint, and I have a feeling she is going to yield a bit more than a qp. She is in a soiless medium with organic additives, and I agree with JL when he says you can get more off one single plant without SCROG in soiless than you can in hydro. But hydro is so versatile, and the word "hydro" means a lot of different growing styles, and I'm sure someone on here could prove me wrong with their hydro set up.

If you really want to get a lot of plants in a small space, with lots of dank herb, Northern Lights is a excellent choice, and should be put at the top of your consideration list.

A grow like this in a 4x4 space is very ambitious, but it is not unfeasible! If you scrog it is not impossible to pull a pound off a single lamp, I've seen it done. Keep it simple, keep your attention on it, keep a check list, and don't skip steps. Anybody who has been browsing here a while remembers Integra21's legendary SCROG grow! He had 2 3x4 screens (correct me if I'm wrong), in a DWC unit no more than 11" high, his max head height was 3 1/2 feet in his crawl space, and he pulled a pound on each screen! He had two 600w air cooled Sun System Yield Master II deluxe hoods with digital ballasts, and I believe either Sun Master or Hortilux bulbs. He used the Technaflora Recipe to Success kit, it is 35 dollars and one of the VERY BEST nutrients I have EVER used, and I have spent 350+ on House & Garden line ups. The bastard's first grow was the same deal but with one screen and only 1 430w aircooled HPS, and he still pulled just under a pound! That is in a 3x4 space. Integra's grow was the poster boy grow of how to simply produce lots of killer dank buds! Strains I can remember him using were Blue Kush, Piss, and he had some papaya for a while he didn't much care for. Blue Kush and Piss were local strains, and you would be hard pressed to find them outside the southwest.

Pulling more than a pound in a 4x4 space starts with a lot of reading, and replicating success.

I'm going to post some pictures of some plants, something I seldom do on here. Pictures come tomorrow though, I need a better camera, and have to bring them out of the garden. I'll tell you the veg time, the flower time, and weather or not it is in soiless or DWC. I'm starting to prefer potted plants. The veg time and training technique will allow you for the weight you want, but they won't fit in the space unless you are just down-right crappy at vegging. If you LST them you can kind of abuse them to fit in any space you want, I usually train them into different shapes and fit them together like tetris, that way I waste no light on the ground, and I don't have plants shading each other that way. Right now I have a bunch of Christmas trees growing, and as pretty as they are I much much much prefer the LST. I have so much light on my tray right now it's fading, what a horrific waste! I'm about to throw 3 more plants in there right now. What do you think? I'm thinking my purple Old Skool Kush could get a lot of attention

But a 4x4 space is probably going to take at least a 1000w bulb, if not, 2 600w bulbs. I am not a 1000w grower, and if you go that route, you just read all this for nothing, but 1000w growing is not like 600w growing. 600w is the most efficient bulb available, so my grows are all about keeping temps way down, and getting my bulbs as close as freaking possible without burning my plants at all times. you can do one bulb, but 200 more watts with two 600w bulbs would give you a lot more, even light.

medicine21 said:

Is it possible to fit 12 of those 3-4oz topped plants in a 4x4' area?

Click to expand...

Yes, I usually run 12 in a 5x5 footprint.

Wolverine97 said:

Yes, I usually run 12 in a 5x5 footprint.

Click to expand...

I think a picture of your garden would probably give him the more insight than anything.

You need the right strain,pheno and I lst the shit out of them in veg. I had a bubblelicious Qtr pound plant my last harest grown in soil with 2 vertical 600 hps.

get good soil and a decent strain, I feel I could pull it off using my ceiling lights

Jozikins said:

Realize if you want 12 plants with 4oz each in a 4x4 space you will be growing very tall, very thin plants with a lot of fluff on the bottom. I think we need to rethink this. Less plants, more bush.

Click to expand...

The idea was to do Uncle Ben's topping for 4 colas and trim inner leaves to focus all plant energy on those 4 colas. I'd rather not get into LST or scrogging, if I could avoid it, to retain plant mobility and avoid all that rope/canopy management. The footprint would be smaller, I think, if I focus on those 4 colas and I should be able to fit 12 in a 4x4'.

Jozikins said:

She is in a soiless medium with organic additives, and I agree with JL when he says you can get more off one single plant without SCROG in soiless than you can in hydro. But hydro is so versatile, and the word "hydro" means a lot of different growing styles, and I'm sure someone on here could prove me wrong with their hydro set up.

Click to expand...

What do you mean by soiless here? Aero? I am doing RW cubes in a flood and drain now, not sure if 6" cubes (1gal) would be enough to pull 3oz/plant.

Jozikins said:

A grow like this in a 4x4 space is very ambitious, but it is not unfeasible! If you scrog it is not impossible to pull a pound off a single lamp, I've seen it done. Pulling more than a pound in a 4x4 space starts with a lot of reading, and replicating success.

But a 4x4 space is probably going to take at least a 1000w bulb, if not, 2 600w bulbs. I am not a 1000w grower, and if you go that route, you just read all this for nothing,

Click to expand...

I am in fact doing a 1000W HPS over the 4x4', but your input is still very much appreciated. To be honest I would be disappointed if the 12 plants topped didn't produce 1.5-2lb, since this is what I'm getting now with 30 plant SOG 5-day veg. I figure with 4 week veg and topping it should be achievable with 12 plants, but no real experience with this method to base this on. To hit 1.5-2lb I would need the 12 plants to average 2-2.7oz/plant in the 4x4'.

Wolverine97 said:

Yes, I usually run 12 in a 5x5 footprint.

Click to expand...

Nice to know I'm not that far off.

Jozikins said:

I think a picture of your garden would probably give him the more insight than anything.

Click to expand...

It would indeed be great to see what your canopy looks like in this setup. +rep to both of you for your input.

ataxia said:

if you could sum all this up in a good answer ( i know i'll catch shit) it seems as though the best yields are coming from plants in larger containers ... bigger root zone = bigger plants = bigger yields..

Click to expand...

Yup..bushes, wide plants in big containers with healthy roots equal yield.

Jozikins said:

I think a picture of your garden would probably give him the more insight than anything.

Click to expand...

I don't do pictures, sorry.

If you top them while they are small I bet you could get them all together in there, with 12 plants in a 4x4 space, 2.0-2.7 oz off each plant is much more realistic, especially since you haven't tried this before. I am so very unfamiliar with rockwool, I usually avoid it like the plague (but I do start clones in it), not that there is all that much wrong with it, I just don't like it. However, I do know that in any flood and drain system, you can always put a mat at the bottom of the tray, and your cubes will grow into it. They sell coco mats, and giant wrapped rockwool slabs, but it allows your plants to continue growing, long after you thought it was too late to change anything about it. LST probably would be a fracking pain in the ass in rockwool cubes because you would need a counter tie for every bend you make. You can try the lost and forgotten art of super cropping: Squeeze and bend, squeeze and bend!

Soiless is a medium that mimics soil, but contains none. A basic soiless mix is often pete fiber, coco fiber, pumice, and perlite. There are certain things that qualify soil as soil, and as long as I keep that out of my mix, I get to retain my beautiful hydroponic formula with the same pH. You can throw a bunch of organic additives in there and it still wont be considered "soil." But you now get the organic benefit of soil. And I know how plants take in organics, and I know that organic doesn't mean a whole lot when you already have a safe and balanced diet, but it does add a little flavor, and it's worth the money to me.

When are you thinking about starting this? I think we should do a side-by-side with our preferred techniques. I would shit bricks if I could pull 4 pounds out of my 4x8 garden!!

Jozikins said:

If you top them while they are small I bet you could get them all together in there, with 12 plants in a 4x4 space, 2.0-2.7 oz off each plant is much more realistic, especially since you haven't tried this before. I am so very unfamiliar with rockwool, I usually avoid it like the plague (but I do start clones in it), not that there is all that much wrong with it, I just don't like it. However, I do know that in any flood and drain system, you can always put a mat at the bottom of the tray, and your cubes will grow into it. They sell coco mats, and giant wrapped rockwool slabs, but it allows your plants to continue growing, long after you thought it was too late to change anything about it. LST probably would be a fracking pain in the ass in rockwool cubes because you would need a counter tie for every bend you make. You can try the lost and forgotten art of super cropping: Squeeze and bend, squeeze and bend!

Soiless is a medium that mimics soil, but contains none. A basic soiless mix is often pete fiber, coco fiber, pumice, and perlite. There are certain things that qualify soil as soil, and as long as I keep that out of my mix, I get to retain my beautiful hydroponic formula with the same pH. You can throw a bunch of organic additives in there and it still wont be considered "soil." But you now get the organic benefit of soil. And I know how plants take in organics, and I know that organic doesn't mean a whole lot when you already have a safe and balanced diet, but it does add a little flavor, and it's worth the money to me.

When are you thinking about starting this? I think we should do a side-by-side with our preferred techniques. I would shit bricks if I could pull 4 pounds out of my 4x8 garden!!

Click to expand...

Supercropping is where it's at.

Jdubb203 said:

You need the right strain,pheno and I lst the shit out of them in veg. I had a bubblelicious Qtr pound plant my last harest grown in soil with 2 vertical 600 hps.

Click to expand...

Bubbalicious is a EXCELLENT strain for this kind of grow. Extra-dank and dense nugs, monster yields, happy and easy plants. It is also the best outdoor plant I've ever had the pleasure of chilling with

I'm fraking going insane, my care taker gave away his bubbalicious mom without giving me another clone to carry it on first!! I was so sad, I never kept mom's of his clones... that was his job!!