Overlimed soil Help!

Rasta Roy said:

So I used too much dolomite lime in my soil mix. The pH of my water runoff is 7.8, yikes! I'm two weeks into flower, plants look good for the most part but I'm noticing a few issues that are definitely being caused by pH lockout.

Should I top dress with a soil acidifier to bring down the soil pH? Or should I lower the pH of my water when I feed? I'm concerned the former will do too much and I'm worried the latter won't do enough!

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Run off is a useless number. Your are using an electrode to measure pH. The are many thing that effect how the electrode works. Mainly salt.

To correctly measure soil pH, take an equal part dry soil and deionized water and stir. Then test the pH.

I'm saying that a proper living soil determines your ph. But most people try adding extra stuff and drowning their dirt in god knows what because some label says "bigger buds". Then end up chasing their tails bottle after bottle, and start reading into ph levels, then start listening to people that tell them to put low ph water, or buy a meter, or flush with high ph water, it's all rubbish and devastating to any sort of microbial activity.

elephantSea said:

I'm saying that a proper living soil determines your ph. But most people try adding extra stuff and drowning their dirt in god knows what because some label says "bigger buds". Then end up chasing their tails bottle after bottle, and start reading into ph levels, then start listening to people that tell them to put low ph water, or buy a meter, or flush with high ph water, it's all rubbish and devastating to any sort of microbial activity.

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I don't buy bottles that say bigger blooms, with the exception of molasses, fish hydroslate, and humic acid I'm not buying any bottles at all. Ive done everything by the book to create a living soil. I have micronutrients that are locking out because of pH being too high. What is your solution? Because it seems like you're saying every bit of advice I've been offered so far is useless.

a good flush never hurt microbial activity.

hey man, obviously do what you want. Im just sheading some experience. Checking and worrying about ph reminds me of my younger years, and wouldnt life be so much better if you didnt have to worry about it? well, there are people saying that they dont worry about it, and think you shouldnt either. Why would you not wanna follow their advice and get away from having to do all this extra shit just to grow some silly plant.

this isn't complicated, so why do people always make it seam so. I realize Im giving advice too, and also telling you not to listen to people. but this isnt some science experiment. listen to the people that have pot growing out of their ears, and dont fuss around with anything other than some organic material and water. That's where you should be wanting to get to. Not down some rabbit hole of a chemistry experiment.

a good flush never hurt micro activity, i'm not so sure. But if that good flush has a ph of 5 from a bunch of phosphoric acid. then yeah, it would hurt quite a bit, and this is in the organic section, why would you be flushing?

Can you elaborate a bit more on your process? what micro's do you think are being locked out? when do you add molasses and how? you're using azomite right? how much? why the lime in the first place? I obviously don't know what you're doing, but if you're dumping molasses into your dirt or using too much of it in your teas, I bet that's your problem right there. how hard is your water? RO? Tap? do you know the initial ppm of your water? what's in this dirt that you mixed for yourself?

after thinking about it for a moment, I guess what im saying is that I'm not completely convinced you have a 'too much lime' problem. you really havent given anyone enough information to help you properly diagnose the problem, and jumping to the conclusion that its a liming issue based on runoff ph is daft.

Trust me I want your experienced opinion. I never wanted to bother with pH, that's why I switched to growing organic. I have two different sets of soil mixes though they are pretty similar.

They are both
Three parts perlite
Three parts compost
Two parts peat moss
One part worm castings

And amended with the recommended amounts of

Kelp Meal
Azomite
Greensand
Gypsum
Dolomite Lime

One set of soil mix has blood and bone meal, the other set has Mexican and indo bat guano.

Then as a control group I have one girl, that has no meals or guano. And another is solely in mushroom compost with some azomite. Too much node stretching on her but she is one solid color!

I use compost teas every two weeks, made with molasses, castings, and Kelp. I have used the fish hydroslate in the teas as well but not recently. I also have used humic acid (liquid from bio ag) in my most recent tea.

I alternate between plain water, and water with 1/2 tablespoon of molasses per gallon. I thought the every other water feeding would prevent over doing it.

I didn't check my soil ph when I let my mixes cook up. Clearly the peat moss didn't do much to bring down the pH of the compost and I probably didn't need to use as much lime as I did. I think I have boron lockout. But I'm color blind I can only see that I have discolorations and then I need help to know what they are. I posted pictures can you take a look and help me better diagnose?

elephantSea said:

hey man, obviously do what you want. Im just sheading some experience. Checking and worrying about ph reminds me of my younger years, and wouldnt life be so much better if you didnt have to worry about it? well, there are people saying that they dont worry about it, and think you shouldnt either. Why would you not wanna follow their advice and get away from having to do all this extra shit just to grow some silly plant.

this isn't complicated, so why do people always make it seam so. I realize Im giving advice too, and also telling you not to listen to people. but this isnt some science experiment. listen to the people that have pot growing out of their ears, and dont fuss around with anything other than some organic material and water. That's where you should be wanting to get to. Not down some rabbit hole of a chemistry experiment.

a good flush never hurt micro activity, i'm not so sure. But if that good flush has a ph of 5 from a bunch of phosphoric acid. then yeah, it would hurt quite a bit, and this is in the organic section, why would you be flushing?

Can you elaborate a bit more on your process? what micro's do you think are being locked out? when do you add molasses and how? you're using azomite right? how much? why the lime in the first place? I obviously don't know what you're doing, but if you're dumping molasses into your dirt or using too much of it in your teas, I bet that's your problem right there. how hard is your water? RO? Tap? do you know the initial ppm of your water? what's in this dirt that you mixed for yourself?

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it's tough to tell from your photo. it almost looks like you have some heat stress, but those plants in focus dont really seem to be under a light. can you take a better photo?

You're kinda on your own when you mix your own soil, so it can be both good or bad, but I would stop putting molasses into your dirt directly. just use it in your teas in my opinion.

actually, I really do think you have heat stress now that I look a bit closer. The plants underneath the light are way too close. some of them look like they are touching the hood. do you have a fan blowing around in there? adequate ventilation?

I think they say 30" from the bulb gives you optimal light coverage

Rasta Roy said:

I don't buy bottles that say bigger blooms, with the exception of molasses, fish hydroslate, and humic acid I'm not buying any bottles at all. Ive done everything by the book to create a living soil. I have micronutrients that are locking out because of pH being too high. What is your solution? Because it seems like you're saying every bit of advice I've been offered so far is useless.

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In a true living soil I have never worried about pH. You looking at the run off and freaking. You said your plants look good. If its not broke, don't fix it.

elephantSea said:

it's tough to tell from your photo. it almost looks like you have some heat stress, but those plants in focus dont really seem to be under a light. can you take a better photo?

You're kinda on your own when you mix your own soil, so it can be both good or bad, but I would stop putting molasses into your dirt directly. just use it in your teas in my opinion.

actually, I really do think you have heat stress now that I look a bit closer. The plants underneath the light are way too close. some of them look like they are touching the hood. do you have a fan blowing around in there? adequate ventilation?

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Yeah I have a fan directly on the light and the plants and it's a 600 watt light so that's why they're so close. I posted a pic of one of the leaves from the mid section of the plant. Most of the leaves don't have this discoloration but some of them do.

whitebb2727 said:

In a true living soil I have never worried about pH. You looking at the run off and freaking. You said your plants look good. If its not broke, don't fix it.

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I didn't think I had to worry about pH but I have some discoloration, things look good but not great

is that one of the worst leaves? if so, I wouldn't worry about anything. that leaf doesnt appear to have heat stress, but I run a 600, in a tent with great ventilation and fresh air coming in. that bulb distance would be too close for me even with a fan blowing on them. I really think you should back the light off. at a certain point, its not really doing them any good being so close.

your losing a lot of ligh to the sides, I would worry about keeping that light and bouncing in back in, rather than getting your bulb closer. If you can pocket it, invest in a tent. they're cheap and very much worth it. you have plenty of room to do things proper

PH fluctuates as soil dries. The more water in soil the higher the pH. Just let the soil dry and you will get a pH swing which is needed for proper nutrient uptake.

http://www.cfr.washington.edu/classes.esrm.410/ph.htm

Rasta Roy said:

I didn't think I had to worry about pH but I have some discoloration, things look good but not great

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Unless it is moving fast or wide spread don't panic. I wouldn't try to hold pH steady. I would let it swing.

Sometimes a plant rids itself of a leaf or two. Could be from various reason. Do a couple of guerilla grows in harsh conditions like drought or heat waves.

Hell this year here it was 90-100 outside and rained about every day during flower here.

A few odd leaves that die is not a big thing.

totally agree. if anything, you didnt let your mix cook long enough. but seriously, don't worry about it.

Yeah that is the worst one, they are mostly solid.

My room is sealed with an intake and outtake that I kick on when the lights go off and the co2 shuts off. I'll look into grow tents after Christmas I have wanted one to do my veg in. In the meantime I'll raise up the light a little bit.

I'll just let the pH do its thing, I won't be so knit picky about it.

I've been growing with bottles for years, this year has been my first foray into organic growing, I'm just a little panicky about things going wrong. But the whole point of this approach is that you don't have to worry as much. I just need to keep reminding myself that. Lol

Thanks for your help guys!

Im not knocking anyone. I'm saying let it ride for a minute and if it continues follow what @ShLUbY said.

I think they will be fine. Start a journal that you can write the dates down. Maybe even put pics with it. When you water and how much. Things like that.

Take note and watch it but stay calm.

yeah i would stop with the molasses feedings. just feed molasses to your microbe teas. don't need it other than that my friend.

Word! I'll lay off the molasses. What are your thoughts on humic acid? I'm using the bio ag liquid brand and have been putting in some of my teas. Should I keep it to the teas? Or would throwing it in some of my plain waterings help kick up my plants uptake of nutrients in the soil?

I've got some granular humic acid concentrate from bio ag as well but I haven't used it yet. Just got it on clearance from the local grow shop.