Ok, I am genuienly asking for your input. Four foot tall indoor cfl grow.

All right, let's do this. I see some massive production occurring here, huge yields.

4x2x5 tent, 565w 2700k, 190w 6500k, 90w led, running a 4" outtake, temperature is high 70's 78.2 is my goal, and I make it work by opening and/or closing a window, fresh cool air, and also raising the lights in increments.

Vegetation at 18/6 for 68 days. 12/12 for 24 days now. Flowering for 18-20 of those.

5 gallon fabric pot, organic soil, topped with a layer of some good coco, and again when needed with more of the soil.

Tap water up to flower, (was around 8.5 out of tap, and then dropped to 7.5 by the duration of vegitaton) and RO water since 12/12.

Food is from Harvest Moon Organics in Oregon. A few of the early feedings were with GH BioThrive and CaMg, prior to HMO Nutrients.

She has at least 12 colas that to me look like solid medicine. Along with those are an abundance of shoots, some of which present a potential yield, and others that have just grown and grown, and are lighter green/yellow and may be consuming life force which may be of more value up top, and also allow for her to flower on the lower portions of the colas as they do show the calyxes(?) ready to flower out.

I did prune, gently, and I hope she feels my love in doing so, the lower most shoot which itself had scaled over heavily, and had another 4 shoots off it of the lighter green/yellow growth. To me, I can feel a change, a transformation, more life is available for the fruiting bodies of love.

I also fed again today, and this now makes feeding a daily occurrence, as her medium is able again to absorb nearly a full gallon. Each feeding has been 1 gallon since a bit before going 12/12. She is growing, and the soil is almost ready for more water, just over 4 hours prior to being fed earlier.

Have a look at the picture, and let's have a great dialogue about how we may help her direct the most of her work into the flowers, and about how to safely prune, and what might be worth pruning, and/or what might be worth to 'let it grow'.

I also have a 400w hps bulb/ballast, the lumens currently shining from the cfl's and led are around 60,000 (from 845 watts).
The 400w hps consumes around 450watts with the ballast, and emits 50,000 lumens. Though it is a single central bulb, and these cfls/led are incredibly placed might I say so myself. There is still over an inch for each of the lights to go up, it just me seeking out the way to make that happen.

Share some ideas on that as well, lights, lumens, going hps after running cfl's, putting them all together, I see potential possibilities of how to calibrate lighting, often though a good discussion shines on some of the best ideas.

Here she is.

A full capture.
Some of the lower shoots that I am looking at pruning.
One of the Colas
One of the Colas

You need real lights or you will be at it a long time for a massive yield.

tattooman1968 said:

You need real lights or you will be at it a long time for a massive yield.

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I've seen huge yields on CFL grows, I don't know what you're talking about. CFL's produce some good solid bud, it's just all about the light penetration.

If the lights are positioned well, like the OP says his/her's are, then as long as you look after the plant, she'll perform to a decent standard.

It should go ok with the 400w hid. Usually when plants get over 3 foot indoor you need 1000w hid to penetrate the lower branches. Its a nice plant but don't expect a big harvest, you need a 1000w at temps below 80 to get the heavy hard buds.

At least a lb.

At least 20 bud sites, and lower colas want to flower.

March winds gonna blow all my troubles away...

CFL's can produce some great quality bud and yields if done correctly. Don't let anyone tell you otherwise.

Your success will greatly depend on how well your plant is established in its container. An adequate veg period is very important. More roots=more fruits is what it comes down to. If you are running a all natural set up(free of synthetic salt based nutrients high in acids and other garbage) low light levels are really no big deal. I keep my lights(HID's, LED's, CFL's, etc) at a distance of 2 feet from the tops of the plants. This goes for clones, seedlings, flowering plants, etc. Lights that are to close to the plants will cause some issues that are not in the plants favor. Small CFL's can be places very close with no issues but for T5's and similar bulbs I keep them at least 2 feet from the plants.

Don't prune your plants during flower, you are doing more harm that good in 99% of cases. Plants can tap into vegetation as a resources for nutrients and other compounds, the plant knows what it needs more than you do. If you can't help it, then only prune the growing shoots that don't appear to be filling out to your standards, don't clip any big fan leaves or healthy vegetation if you can help it. You should be pruning at least 10 days before initiating the flowering period. Plants get flustered hormonally when you cut branches off, allowing them 10 days to reconfigure and bounce back to normal balanced growth is always in your favor as the grower.
Where and what to prune to me is plant dependent. I usually trim up the base of the plant where I know light penetration will be minimal and also the inside of the plant, clipping off only the smallest inner shoots that I think will not be of value come trimming time. If I'm producing seeds I leave mostly everything on the plant.

That's some great input. I have noticed her absorbing the life she needs from lower leaves/shoots as they dehydrate.
I am going to stay with cfl.

I would trim all that larf off the bottom until there was only main branches. I wait until the plants stretch out some during bloom so i can see what is worth keeping and what will become larf and take away energy for the top main colas. Example is on a 3ft veg plant with 8 tops going into bloom stretches to 5-6ft in bloom wait until its done stretching then remove all the branches the light wont penetrate through to. This eliminates all that little tiny larf bud, makes tops bigger, gives more air flow, gets rid of any low light stress branches that can hermi. Doing this in bloom is the ideal time to do it because the plant has shown its size, if done in veg you might take off the wrong branches or not enough. Ninja saying it hurts the plant 99% of time is only right if hes saying it hurts them into producing fatter denser heavier easier to trim buds.

Cutting anything off during flower does not help your case or increase production in any area. Prove to me that when you cut off lower branches you get better results. What you are failing to realize is that plants produce hormones(auxins) that control in large part how much flower the plant will produce. A steady supply of uninterrupted auxins will produce a more steady supply of buds than if you start cutting branches and leaves off. That plant mass you are cutting off represents energy. Why would you cut off the energy stores? Doesn't make any sense to me. There is chlorophyll in that plant matter, plants use a lot of energy to produce chlorophyll and growth hormones among other compounds. If you don't want the airy buds, cut off the branches ahead of time that will not produce a solid bud. If you can't judge what should be cut off before flowering your plants then you need to reassess your ability to read plants and predict what a plant is going to do after you flip the switch.
People who grow giant pumpkins don't wait until there are 100+ growing shoots to trim them back to just one(which will result as the one giant pumpkin), they actively trim off the new growing shoots before there is ever any pumpkin(s) visible, with the exception of one shoot throughout the entire growing period. Sure, they trim back growing shoots while the pumpkin is growing but that is because they are trying to concentrate ALL the growth energy they can into one pumpkin, its a trade off worth the extra weight for that one particular pumpkin, that doesn't mean they are going to achieve larger more valuable yields overall from that single pumpkin seed. If they left all the new growing shoots on when the plant starts to produce fruit they would end up with a lot of good mature pumpkins plus one extra large pumpkin.

Off-topic and unrelated but I have never seen a lower bud hermie because of low light conditions. Show me the evidence that suggests this is true, please.

fewer light fixtures = more reflection because there aren't objects absorbing light. Why not try with a single HID light? they get 125 lumens/watt compared to your 70 lumens per watt CFLs... HID about 75% more light than the CFL. HID is cheaper than 800w of CFLS/fixtures. A 400w would work well for that tent but you might get away with even a 600w if you have cool room temps and good airflow in the tent or possibly a cooltube.

Ninja Mechanics said:

Cutting anything off during flower does not help your case or increase production in any area. Prove to me that when you cut off lower branches you get better results. What you are failing to realize is that plants produce hormones(auxins) that control in large part how much flower the plant will produce. A steady supply of uninterrupted auxins will produce a more steady supply of buds than if you start cutting branches and leaves off. That plant mass you are cutting off represents energy. Why would you cut off the energy stores? Doesn't make any sense to me. There is chlorophyll in that plant matter, plants use a lot of energy to produce chlorophyll and growth hormones among other compounds. If you don't want the airy buds, cut off the branches ahead of time that will not produce a solid bud. If you can't judge what should be cut off before flowering your plants then you need to reassess your ability to read plants and predict what a plant is going to do after you flip the switch.
People who grow giant pumpkins don't wait until there are 100+ growing shoots to trim them back to just one(which will result as the one giant pumpkin), they actively trim off the new growing shoots before there is ever any pumpkin(s) visible, with the exception of one shoot throughout the entire growing period. Sure, they trim back growing shoots while the pumpkin is growing but that is because they are trying to concentrate ALL the growth energy they can into one pumpkin, its a trade off worth the extra weight for that one particular pumpkin, that doesn't mean they are going to achieve larger more valuable yields overall from that single pumpkin seed. If they left all the new growing shoots on when the plant starts to produce fruit they would end up with a lot of good mature pumpkins plus one extra large pumpkin.

Off-topic and unrelated but I have never seen a lower bud hermie because of low light conditions. Show me the evidence that suggests this is true, please.

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When you have plants that are 6ft+ indoor under 1k's the lower branches on certain strains can stress due to low light getting to them and sometimes show a hermi, ive seen it happen on diesel/chem lines. Were not growing pumpkins bro, who wants to trim 100 little airy buds that equal same finished weight as 10 big dense buds? Not me i hate larf branches and cant stand trimming for extra hours on airy buds that take away from the potential of the top buds.

cfls will work good i just find it so much work to move all the individual lights... too many potential fall hazards around the plants for me

I would love to put the 400w hps up, and supplement with cfls, temperature is the obstacle.
Though with the single hps bulb, most of the heat would be top center of tent as opposed to evenly spaced as it is right now.

Yes, a 600w with cooltube and supplementing with cfls is probably of the best options.

I have 5 cfl's and the 90w led up currently.

Ninja Mechanics said:

Cutting anything off during flower does not help your case or increase production in any area. Prove to me that when you cut off lower branches you get better results. What you are failing to realize is that plants produce hormones(auxins) that control in large part how much flower the plant will produce. A steady supply of uninterrupted auxins will produce a more steady supply of buds than if you start cutting branches and leaves off. That plant mass you are cutting off represents energy. Why would you cut off the energy stores? Doesn't make any sense to me. There is chlorophyll in that plant matter, plants use a lot of energy to produce chlorophyll and growth hormones among other compounds. If you don't want the airy buds, cut off the branches ahead of time that will not produce a solid bud. If you can't judge what should be cut off before flowering your plants then you need to reassess your ability to read plants and predict what a plant is going to do after you flip the switch.
People who grow giant pumpkins don't wait until there are 100+ growing shoots to trim them back to just one(which will result as the one giant pumpkin), they actively trim off the new growing shoots before there is ever any pumpkin(s) visible, with the exception of one shoot throughout the entire growing period. Sure, they trim back growing shoots while the pumpkin is growing but that is because they are trying to concentrate ALL the growth energy they can into one pumpkin, its a trade off worth the extra weight for that one particular pumpkin, that doesn't mean they are going to achieve larger more valuable yields overall from that single pumpkin seed. If they left all the new growing shoots on when the plant starts to produce fruit they would end up with a lot of good mature pumpkins plus one extra large pumpkin.

Off-topic and unrelated but I have never seen a lower bud hermie because of low light conditions. Show me the evidence that suggests this is true, please.

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Yes, I am most passionate about just letting her grow. I did no pruning throughout veg (aside from leaves that had dehydrated) and the one scaled shoot I removed during flower was the lower most, and cleared an abundance of space, helpful when feeding.

Also, there are four more plants in the tent under the same lights.

When you have plants that are 6ft+ indoor under 1k's the lower branches on certain strains can stress due to low light getting to them and sometimes show a hermi, ive seen it happen on diesel/chem lines. Were not growing pumpkins bro, who wants to trim 100 little airy buds that equal same finished weight as 10 big dense buds? Not me i hate larf branches and cant stand trimming for extra hours on airy buds that take away from the potential of the top buds.

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I'm not saying at all it isn't possible, Ive just never consider low light intensity as a factor. It most certainly is a possible factor just because its an obvious variable. Ive grown Chem 91 and the Sister and Ive grown them herm free with large and small plants. Ive seen both herm on lower branches and on the larger tops as well. Same goes for several other Chem/Diesel crosses/clones Ive grown. That hasn't been limited to just Chem/Diesel though, lots of lines will do that if something is off to far, could be anything, but how can you identify what is actually causing them to herm? Most of the time its another factor that can be blamed but not always is it identifiable.

I didn't say we were growing pumpkins, there was a message in that analogy. I didn't say anyone wanted to trim a bunch of airy buds either, I agree, airy buds are no fun to trim, waste of time usually. I'm saying figure out how much of the lower plant you can trim off prior to initiating flower. There are advantages to doing it that way as apposed to the way you are suggesting. 10 days doesn't seem like that much but in a plants mind it would. For an 8 week plant 10 days is 13% of the total flowering time. 10 days of recovery after pruning a plant has always been beneficial to all my plants in several ways IMO/IME. Yields being the main reason for doing it that way, consistent potency throughout the plant and density being the next two. Ive done it both ways, along with other ways. 13% of growth is huge for indoor cannabis, that's 13% more flowering time with a more stable growth rate just because the plant was given time to recover. Its an easy trade off in my eyes. As long as you can accurately judge how far up and where to cut the plant. I don't usually cut any of the large fan leaves off either, just the branches and shoots I want removed. That's an old school west coast growing technique that has been used for a long time because its a fact that cutting plant material off does more harm than good in a lot of cases(that's also one factor that can cause lower shoots to herm, they are imbalanced slightly more than the younger growth), that isn't not limited to only cannabis, plants need to recover from it if you want them to be growing as close to 100% of the potential vigor, indoor cannabis is the only plant and method I consider crucial to maximize, especially if you are someone who claims to be able to pull maximum yields of high quality herb.
If that is the case, why would you want less plant vigor? If everything is in your favor, yields are ultimately maximized. Honing your skills as a grower to figure out how to prune at least 10 days prior to flowering indoors is worth the effort, I personally go as long as I can, usually 10-14 days, I never push it past two weeks. IME going to far past two weeks is defeating about 33% of the purpose to pruning prior to flowering indoors. We are after the same thing right? High quality yields of the most plentiful and potent herb you can achieve? If we aren't on the same page just say so.

I'm with you there keysaremine, let them grow uninterrupted as long as you can.

Sub'd as my grow is almost identical to yours