Need a topping experts advice!!!

Malevolence · Dec 6, 2013

Not defending anything... just you and uncle fuck boy tossing around that stupid kiss acronym as if hydro is hard or difficult. I listed the extremes of soil same way you listed the extremes of hydro. High pressure sprayers undercurrent plumbing tri meters and water chillers are not needed.drop a bean in a starter plug put it in a net pot with a bucket of water and air stone from walmart. If that is still too difficult there are hempy buckets which should be simple enough for even the dumbest stoners. I don't think ppl should be deterred from hydro just because a couple stoners on some forums that have never tried hydro say it is too hard/complex.

lilroach · Dec 6, 2013

And I've just read his views on soil/water PH. I've been watering directly from my tap that has a PH of 8.1 and have not had any nutrient deficiencies or problems. None....zip. Look at any of my linked grow journals as proof.

lilroach · Dec 6, 2013

Malevolence said:
Not defending anything... just you and uncle fuck boy tossing around that stupid kiss acronym as if hydro is hard or difficult. I listed the extremes of soil same way you listed the extremes of hydro. High pressure sprayers undercurrent plumbing tri meters and water chillers are not needed.drop a bean in a starter plug put it in a net pot with a bucket of water and air stone from walmart. If that is still too difficult there are hempy buckets which should be simple enough for even the dumbest stoners. I don't think ppl should be deterred from hydro just because a couple stoners on some forums that have never tried hydro say it is too hard/complex.

Seriously dude....take a chill-pill. I've in no way have attempted to sway anyone to grow my way vs. hydro. I'm glad you get great grows via hydro......as you should with my soil grows. I've only shared my views of both.

Uncle Ben · Dec 6, 2013

Malevolence said:
Not defending anything... just you and uncle fuck boy tossing around that stupid kiss acronym as if hydro is hard or difficult. I listed the extremes of soil same way you listed the extremes of hydro. High pressure sprayers undercurrent plumbing tri meters and water chillers are not needed.drop a bean in a starter plug put it in a net pot with a bucket of water and air stone from walmart. If that is still too difficult there are hempy buckets which should be simple enough for even the dumbest stoners. I don't think ppl should be deterred from hydro just because a couple stoners on some forums that have never tried hydro say it is too hard/complex.

I never said hydro was "difficult or hard". It's a stupid choice for newbs, especially DWC. If it was such a great way to grow plants it would be a commercially accepted by nurserymen and greenhouse managers - it is not. What does that say about the cannabis community? Dats right - blind leading the blind. Case in point, I clicked on your forum posts and this was the first one I came up. I rest my case: "I'm new to DWC, and my set up is just a 5 gallon bucket filled all the way, with 5 plants on top in a circle around the lid."

If I had to guess this 28 posts guy has never grown a thing in his life, and now he's setting himself up for a costly failure. It's so typical.

Having said that, based on a 1,000 hours of classroom and field demonstrations on all kinds of plant material, and 45 years of gardening experience...... I'll be damned if I'm gonna fuck with some dumb ass air rock, pump, bucket, your high priced snake oils like AN and Bontanicare and monitoring this and that.

Now.....let's see your results, shit-fer-brains. You do grow (or have grown) now, eh? Put up or shut up.

Uncle Ben

Uncle Ben · Dec 6, 2013

lilroach said:
And I've just read his views on soil/water PH. I've been watering directly from my tap that has a PH of 8.1 and have not had any nutrient deficiencies or problems. None....zip. Look at any of my linked grow journals as proof.

Yep. Some of the best grows was using tap water straight out of the faucet, pH of 8.2. Don't know if you were referring to this - https://www.rollitup.org/marijuana-plant-problems/251235-stop-blaming-issues-ph-people.html#post3181437

Here's one of the best guides to soil container growing on the web - http://forums2.gardenweb.com/forums/load/contain/msg0316064615891.html?14

Malevolence · Dec 6, 2013

You might not be trying to sway anyone to your grow method but making hydro to be some difficult method does sway people whether you intend to or not. Dwc was my first method and it is fantastic for noobs because if you make a mistake you can dump the bucket and immediatle correct it. It is a great method for noobs willing to do an additional 1 hour of research on growing in dwc. Fuck up in soil... flush flush flush... stunted growth 2 weeks. UBs ignorant comments about AN and botanicare show nicely his total lack of knowledge about hydro or dwc. 2 words... dyna-gro.

I no longer post pictures, I assume all the risk for zero reward... but there are dozens in my older post history if you want to dig around. Anyway... way off topic which is pretty typical for the advanced troll tactics and techniques forums.

Uncle Ben · Dec 6, 2013

Malevolence said:
I no longer post pictures, I assume all the risk for zero reward...

There is no risk. I have posted cannabis photos on about a dozen different forums for over 15 years - no problem.

You're a 16 year old poser. They're a dime a dozen.

Dwc was my first method and it is fantastic for noobs because if you make a mistake you can dump the bucket and immediatle correct it.

Well, that's one way to add to a compost pile.

And pray tell, how do you "immediately correct"? You're telling me folks that fail really understand the dynamics of their failures and will make the correct choices next time? Hah!

This is a human trend I've seen over the years common to newbs. Let's say the newb starts with soil, has never grown a plant in his life, doesn't know what makes a plant tick so he spends a few hours reading about the many ways the blind lead their own, tries soil and either totally screws it up or comes up short and disgruntled, this after thinking that $600 worth of AN/Botanicare/Canna foods, additives and supplements and the new fancy full spectrum light and kewl equipment bought from the foxxy hydro chick will insure his success. So.....what does he do? Without digging into the nature of why he failed, why he made the wrong choices, he jumps into hydro, the kewl thing to do, and, FAILS AGAIN.

Kinda like getting a divorce and getting re-married. If you don't know what YOU DID wrong as part of your role as a partner, then you're doomed to repeat your mistakes and fail again.

UB

plaguedog · Dec 6, 2013

Malevolence said:
You might not be trying to sway anyone to your grow method but making hydro to be some difficult method does sway people whether you intend to or not. Dwc was my first method and it is fantastic for noobs because if you make a mistake you can dump the bucket and immediatle correct it. It is a great method for noobs willing to do an additional 1 hour of research on growing in dwc. Fuck up in soil... flush flush flush... stunted growth 2 weeks. UBs ignorant comments about AN and botanicare show nicely his total lack of knowledge about hydro or dwc. 2 words... dyna-gro.

I no longer post pictures, I assume all the risk for zero reward... but there are dozens in my older post history if you want to dig around. Anyway... way off topic which is pretty typical for the advanced troll tactics and techniques forums.

Hydro is less forgiving than growing in soil, and plenty of new growers have watched their plants die in a heartbeat. That is the point here. If you have never grown anything in your life, why add to the complexity of the situation with increased variables when soil growing in general is more forgiving and much easier to start out with?

Malevolence · Dec 6, 2013

Not sure where you pull all that from. Not everyone is clueless and incapable of learning from mistakes like you seem to think... new != idiot

You immediatly correct mistakes by saying oops i gave too much of this or i shoukldnt have tried that product... dumping the water out and mixing up a new bucket. Try that in soil. Yes you see dozens of noob posts over their heads and struggling with hydro... but you see the exact same thing with noobs in soil. Also who the fuck uses AN and why do you keep bringing them up? You can grow hydro and keep it simple too...

There is a risk in posting pics... although it is very small it is there. The reward and bragging rights are null which is infinitly less than the risk. Do you think I give a fuck about your opinion once I log off here or that it effect my garden in any way? Any time you connect to riu your ip adress is logged with a date/time stamp. In theory riu could be subpoenad to hand over your user records which show all your posts and the io address you connected from.

lilroach · Dec 6, 2013

Ok.....you keep going on about hydro is fine for new growers and then point to people screwing up soil....the thing about soil is that it acts as a buffer for new-grower mistakes. As far as I know, hydro offers no such buffer. Sure new growers make mistakes in soil...hell, I did for probably an embarrassing long time, but none of my mistakes killed my plants. I too have read post of new growers killing off all their plants by being way off on their PPM, their PH, etc. etc with hydro....and they end up buying swag from the dirt-bag on the corner.

I personally don't see hydro as the logical first step into growing....that's just my view. If you feel hydro is as simple as soil grows, then there's nothing I can say to change your mind. I have an IQ of 142 and even after a year of growing don't feel comfortable with all the in's-and-out's of hydro.

Malevolence · Dec 6, 2013

Obviously this is pointless... but if your shit dies overnight you made a gross noob fuck up which could have been prevented by my earlier comment - spend an extra hour to learn the basics of hydro.

Btw hydro has an even better buffer han soil for new grower mistakes: res swap. You don't need to know the ins-and-outs to begin... the basics can get you far. I am still learning every grow.

Uncle Ben · Dec 6, 2013

Malevolence said:
You immediatly correct mistakes by saying oops i gave too much of this or i shoukldnt have tried that product... dumping the water out and mixing up a new bucket.

Btw hydro has an even better buffer han soil for new grower mistakes: res swap.

Bullshit. Would that be just before or just after the plant bites the dust? One "aw shit" in hydro and you're done, son.

98% of these guys don't have a clue as to what's in that bottle of "Mal's Sunrise Super Tonic" when it comes to NPK values and micros. Knowing plant nutrition is about as basic as it gets. I pretty much stopped helping newbs who always recite the same old mantra, "Help, what's wrong with my plants!" It's useless as every new crop of newbs cries the same old cries of help because they don't know what they're doing. When I ask them what they used, how much and how frequently, I get this run off of snake oil label names without the science (chemistry) behind it. I'm a horticulturist and the kiddie bottle names are meaningless to me. If they don't know what their plants are receiving or need regarding the 16 essential elements, in the correct balance, they WILL repeat the same old mistakes.

They just throw stuff at their plants hoping something sticks. Botany does not work that way.

Yeah, this is really pointless...... Just now got back from your favorite watering hole just to check things out and see the EXACTLY the same old shit that I mentioned in posts #84 and 87. (Damn, I'm good

) Another failure ready to happen, in DWC no less. :hump:

https://www.rollitup.org/hydroponics-aeroponics/758350-going-soil-hydro-couple-questions.html

ott3r said:
.....Nutes: EarthJuice line (Grow, Bloom, Catalyst, Microblast, Meta-K), GH Rapid Start root stim, CalMag, and I have a bottle of superthrive concentrate as well (4oz) - A friend also gave me a 3-bottle collection of GH nutes, Flora series. Not sure if I should stick with my EJ line or use the GH nutes..

Huh?

Gentleman just destroyed the very foundation of a plant's health, the tender roots and roothairs, but not to worry, we got our bottle of SUPERTHRIVE handy for our new DWC setup!

Frickin' hilarious!

UB

lilroach · Dec 6, 2013

One last note on this hydro thing:

A friend of mine grows a large number of plants in hydro....it's his livelihood.. and went away for Thanksgiving for three days.

When he got home he found a dark grow-room and realized that the circuit breaker must have blown shortly after he left. It was the same breaker that also ran his pumps and coolers. Guess how well his 32 plants survived?

They didn't.

If he was growing in soil, he'd have some saggy plants that would have quickly revived once the power came back on.

Too many things can go wrong with hydro if you ask me.

Malevolence · Dec 6, 2013

Uncle Ben said:
Bullshit. Would that be just before or just after the plant bites the dust? One "aw shit" in hydro and you're done, son.

I stopped reading here... you have clearly never ran hydro and have no idea wtf you are talking about.

Fuck it I read your post. You are talking about nutes which is not reall a soil vs hydro thing. Noobs have nute issues with both systems. Again, your boy ott3r could have saved himself a headache with an hour of research beforehand. He violated a well known rule in dwc which is dont put organicshit in the res(EARTH JUICE). Superthrive is also a known slime bloom trigger in dwc which he would have found out. the problem is not hydro, part of the problem is noobs taking soil advice because 80% of the noobs here just assume yr running soil... and applying it to hydro.

The additives bullshit train goes down both tracks. Just like soil growers, hydro setups can use a complete base nutrient and grow healthy plants. There are additives that will help here and there, but i always advise sticking with tried and proven basics and nutes and learni g to grow, then experimenting with additives and advanced techniques later down the road if desired. But you will see soil noobs dumping all the same bullshit on their gardens.

TonightYou · Dec 6, 2013

Hydro certainly isn't more forgiving... Not sure where ya got that from. Seen plenty of people fuck up both, shit I've fucked up soilless.

Hydro isn't rocket science, but it does over complicate an otherwise simple process.
Soil/soilless buffers, not hydo. You fuck up on hydro and don't catch it quickly, the lovely fried plants appear.

Uncle Ben · Dec 6, 2013

lilroach said:
One last note on this hydro thing:

A friend of mine grows a large number of plants in hydro....it's his livelihood.. and went away for Thanksgiving for three days.

When he got home he found a dark grow-room and realized that the circuit breaker must have blown shortly after he left. It was the same breaker that also ran his pumps and coolers. Guess how well his 32 plants survived?

They didn't.

If he was growing in soil, he'd have some saggy plants that would have quickly revived once the power came back on.

Yep!

I have friends who are into the alternative growing thing - aquaponics, huge op, commercial. Their pump system alone is expensive, much less the acre of greenhouse and tilapia fish tanks. They don't know or I guess don't care what the NPK values are. Never had it tested. I don't think they will make it, it's just not practical and the inputs are just way too cumbersome. They use tilapia waste. We're going down into the upper teens tonight. One 6 hr. power outage and their op is toast.

Malevolence · Dec 7, 2013

you guys are right... I guess you do have to be a bit of stud muffin mc'fuckin mad scientist to setup and run a hydro op. you have to stay on your game but it's pretty hands-off once you get dialed in.

Malevolence · Dec 7, 2013

The misses would love an outdoor natural garden one day, but indoor hydro for life :joint:

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Root rot is typically the most common and the most deadly issue we see in deep water culture... but you have a good 36 hours - 3 or 4 days to do something about it depending on how healthy/big/mature the root ball. Who doesn't look at their plants every day or two? Shit does not just fuckin die over night or in 6 hours unless you pull an uncle boner. Even a power outage is fine if you mix up the water by hand to oxygenate it two or three times a day, which I have done more than once when moving, etc. Other active hydro methods would simply require hand watering and transplanting aero to buckets of water which would takes like 10 minutes in a personal setup... 30 if you smoke a bowl.

I no longer use the hydroton; it is not needed. Just 2" net pots and neoprene collars as in the first pics.

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I use Dyna-Gro grow/bloom, pro-tekt (veg), and pond-zyme (keeps water clean, $15 at petco/petsmart treats thousands of gallons).

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Direct access to roots, speed of growth, initial setup cost, simplicity, less inviting to pests, ability to instantly change res and correct mistakes, and no purchasing/storing large bags of dirt are why I chose this method.

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I think growing weed is a lot like cooking in that both of them take more than just reading a book or following a recipe, it takes experience and skill. Growing shit does not come naturally to me and I have a long way to go but hydro is just so much cleaner and easier.

I like how this thread has nothing to do with topping or experts :dunce:

lilroach · Dec 7, 2013

Malevolence said:
The misses would love an outdoor natural garden one day, but indoor hydro for life
View attachment 2919986 | View attachment 2919991

View attachment 2920009 | View attachment 2919992

View attachment 2919988 | View attachment 2919987

Root rot is typically the most common and the most deadly issue we see in deep water culture... but you have a good 36 hours - 3 or 4 days to do something about it depending on how healthy/big/mature the root ball. Who doesn't look at their plants every day or two? Shit does not just fuckin die over night or in 6 hours unless you pull an uncle boner. Even a power outage is fine if you mix up the water by hand to oxygenate it two or three times a day, which I have done more than once when moving, etc. Other active hydro methods would simply require hand watering and transplanting aero to buckets of water which would takes like 10 minutes in a personal setup... 30 if you smoke a bowl.

I no longer use the hydroton; it is not needed. Just 2" net pots and neoprene collars as in the first pics.
View attachment 2919984 | View attachment 2919983

I use Dyna-Gro grow/bloom, pro-tekt (veg), and pond-zyme (keeps water clean, $15 at petco/petsmart treats thousands of gallons).
View attachment 2919989 | View attachment 2919990

View attachment 2919995 | View attachment 2919996

Direct access to roots, speed of growth, initial setup cost, simplicity, less inviting to pests, ability to instantly change res and correct mistakes, and no purchasing/storing large bags of dirt are why I chose this method.
View attachment 2919997 | View attachment 2919994

View attachment 2919985

I think growing weed is a lot like cooking in that both of them take more than just reading a book or following a recipe, it takes experience and skill. Growing shit does not come naturally to me and I have a long way to go but hydro is just so much cleaner and easier.

I like how this thread has nothing to do with topping or experts

Nice looking grow (assuming those are your photos).

Uncle Ben · Dec 7, 2013

Malevolence said:
you have to stay on your game but it's pretty hands-off once you get dialed in.

I "dialed in" with the first cannabis plants I grew indoors, one of the best gardens I've had in fact. 3 gallon pots of soil, Walmart food and a 250W HPS from start to finish. Seeds from Mexican bagweed that produced beautiful plants with excellent yields.

Need a topping experts advice!!!

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