Maverick’s Timber 4vs Grow Journal

horribleherk said:

I'm starting to like

this light paired up with the 4x4 a lot the next month should really tell the story I've no experience with anything in this grow the strain hasn't been ran nor the tent & the light in a 3x3 only so I've got a few first time things going on View attachment 4714739View attachment 4714740

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Looks like it’s covering that canopy from wall to wall by that pic. Sweet!!!

I honestly think that, with the Orca the 4VS could Flower a 4x4 decently, just based on my observations this run. It’s rated to a 3.5 x 3.5 without it and the PAR numbers I tested at 24” significantly exceeded the published Specs on Timber’s site taken at 18”. The lowest reading I found at that height was mid 800’s in the corner under my tent pole fan. The rest were 900 to just over 1,000 right in the middle.

And, I took them with a Hydrofarm PAR meter, which from the side by side tests that I’ve seen tends to under estimate PPFD compared to the Apogees, so the numbers may even be higher than what I gathered.

At 30” I was reading a pretty consistent 600 to almost 800 PPFD and I bet at that height, with the Orca it would be maybe high 500’s on the edges and corners in a 4x4. The 24” height may even be able to do better, but not sure if the angle the photons are coming out if the light from would cause too much drop off on the edges at that height.

Would have to buy a 4x4 and retrofit it with Orca, or buy one of the Secret Jardin Orca 4x4’s and test it and know for sure; and I have no plans to do either any time soon.

LCPGrower1980 said:

Looks like it’s covering that canopy from wall to wall by that pic. Sweet!!!

I honestly think that, with the Orca the 4VS could Flower a 4x4 decently, just based on my observations this run. It’s rated to a 3.5 x 3.5 without it and the PAR numbers I tested at 24” significantly exceeded the published Specs on Timber’s site taken at 18”. The lowest reading I found at that height was mid 800’s in the corner under my tent pole fan. The rest were 900 to just over 1,000 right in the middle.

And, I took them with a Hydrofarm PAR meter, which from the side by side tests that I’ve seen tends to under estimate PPFD compared to the Apogees, so the numbers may even be higher than what I gathered.

At 30” I was reading a pretty consistent 600 to almost 800 PPFD and I bet at that height, with the Orca it would be maybe high 500’s on the edges and corners in a 4x4. The 24” height may even be able to do better, but not sure if the angle the photons are coming out if the light from would cause too much drop off on the edges at that height.

Would have to buy a 4x4 and retrofit it with Orca, or buy one of the Secret Jardin Orca 4x4’s and test it and know for sure; and I have no plans to do either any time soon.

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at one point I was considering a 1 meter square tent which I think is about 39x39 in. but went ahead with the 4x4 my light housing is 19x19 so I've got the cobs spread out something I always liked about the timber 4vs like yours

horribleherk said:

at one point I was considering a 1 meter square tent which I think is about 39x39 in. but went ahead with the 4x4 my light housing is 19x19 so I've got the cobs spread out something I always liked about the timber 4vs like yours

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Nice. I didn’t even know you could get 1 Meter Square tents in the US (although maybe you aren’t lol)!

And yeah, if the light can handle it, I’d always err on the side of a little bigger of a tent as that allows you to grow the same amount of plant matter without having it be overcrowded (something I know about all too well at this point lmao).

Plus, you have more options as far as containers to grow in (a bunch of companies make 4x4 raised beds, Geopots was the only one I found that made 3x3’s and from what I can tell even they seem to have discontinued them).

I also agree that having the COBs spread out like Timber does is great. It would be interesting though to get 4 Daisies and arrange them in the tent and see where they provided the best light spread and numbers. I’ve often wondered if spreading out the COBs just a little would produce maybe a slightly lower center measurement, but more even numbers on the sides.

Like, could you arrange the COBs in such way that you got maybe four 900 “hot spots” under each COB and then like 700-800 everywhere else (without the Orca)? I wonder if this is something that Timber tested out?

LCPGrower1980 said:

Nice. I didn’t even know you could get 1 Meter Square tents in the US (although maybe you aren’t lol)!

And yeah, if the light can handle it, I’d always err on the side of a little bigger of a tent as that allows you to grow the same amount of plant matter without having it be overcrowded (something I know about all too well at this point lmao).

Plus, you have more options as far as containers to grow in (a bunch of companies make 4x4 raised beds, Geopots was the only one I found that made 3x3’s and from what I can tell even they seem to have discontinued them).

I also agree that having the COBs spread out like Timber does is great. It would be interesting though to get 4 Daisies and arrange them in the tent and see where they provided the best light spread and numbers. I’ve often wondered if spreading out the COBs just a little would produce maybe a slightly lower center measurement, but more even numbers on the sides.

Like, could you arrange the COBs in such way that you got maybe four 900 “hot spots” under each COB and then like 700-800 everywhere else (without the Orca)? I wonder if this is something that Timber tested out?

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They have the 39 x 39 tents on Ebay I'm running a 3x4 tub in my tent with a 15 gal. reservoir

horribleherk said:

They have the 39 x 39 tents on Ebay I'm running a 3x4 tub in my tent with a 15 gal. reservoir

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Nice!

Day 78 since Flip, Final Harvest.

Been checking these girls daily with my loupe and the Lambsbread is showing 30%+ Ambers while the Jamaicans are showing 20%+ Ambers. So, it’s time to put this one into the record books.

This was definitely my best run yield wise and probably quality wise as well, but being my first run in the 3x3 bed and Living Soil I also definitely made some mistakes that I will use next time to improve and hopefully make next run even better.

I’ve already dried and jarred about 5 oz’s of the Lambsbread and would guess I’ve still got 1.5-2 Oz here. All of the Jamaican Shipwreck is still hanging, but just comparing them visually to the Lambsbread I would guess I have at least 7 Oz from each, maybe more. Unfortunately the Acapulco wound up being a total dud, and I’d be surprised if I got much more than an Oz off of her. Even still I think I should surpass the 20 oz mark and may even get surprised and get close to double my last run.

Don’t want to count my chickens before they hatch though, so will wait till I get the final dry weight to see for sure. Still, no way I don’t get over 2 grams per Watt on this run as I was only running the Timber at 263 Watts so as to avoid burning the top buds (which still fox tailed quite a bit as they got so tall/close).

And just like that, Boom! Round 2 in Living Soil is under way.

Decided to go with Mazar I Sharif in the back left, Skunk No1 in the front left, and Prayer Pupil on the right.

These girls got pretty big Vegging under my Mars Hydro, so probably won’t be long till I flip them. The PP is also supposedly a big stretcher (like the Lambsbread) so I wanted to have plenty of room to tuck her branches as she grows to control her height. Definitely don’t want a repeat of what happened last round.

Not expecting to match my yield from last round either. This one is more about seeing what these girls can do, starting to add some more KNF inputs, and seeing if I can get through a run without that crazy humidity and the issues it brought with it last time.

Oh yeah!

Round 2 is definitely going slower than Round 1 so far. Not that surprised as these are all slower growing plants than the Lambsbread or Jamaican Shipwrecks.

I did try Upper the power on the Timber (had it all the way down at 10% when I first put them in) and they didn’t seem to like it, so dropped it back down.

Decided to put the SCROG in anyhow though so I can train them into it and fill it. Really had to flatten out the Mazar as she was quite big and the Skunk somewhat too but not as much. Pupil was the smallest of the bunch so was easy to just spread her out somewhat.

Thinking that maybe the Soil Food Web might have somewhat slowed down, which would explain their slower growth and seemingly less happy appearance, so brewed them an AACT and gave them a Foliar and Root Drench application. That plus the Cover Crop, which is starting to sprout, should get the soil cranking again and get them back into high gear growing.

Day 10 of Veg in the Living Soil.

Have upped my PPFD a couple times now and the girls seem to be adapting to it at slightly different rates. Interestingly the Mazar seems most happy while the Skunk and Pupil less so. Figure it’ll just take them a couple days though (similar to “hardening” them off like when you place winter “starts” outside at the beginning of the outdoor growing season).

Not knowing how much these girls are gonna stretch, I’m thinking I’m gonna Flip them as soon as I can get them used to the full intensity that I’m gonna run them at (300 Watts, currently sitting at around 250) in Flower and just tuck/weave them as they stretch.

Girls made it 16 days in Veg before they filled the SCROG as much as I dare let them go. The Skunk and Mazar have never stretched for me like the Jamaican and Lambsbread, but those had never stretched like they did last time either, so want to make sure they stay at least 18, preferably 24” away from the Timber when they are done stretching.

Today marks Day 3 of Flower/Transition. The AACT I gave them has them cranking along, super happy and healthy, and has seemed to knock out the slight amount of PM I was seeing.

Day 7 of Flower/Transition and the girls are looking beautiful! Gave them a second AACT yesterday and they exploded with growth between then and today. Also looking like the Pupil is indeed gonna be the biggest stretcher of the 3, so good thing I decided to give her a whole side of the net as it has allowed me to divert her growth laterally and keep the canopy pretty even so far. Hopefully I can keep it that way.

Day 14 of Flower/Transition. So far the Stretch is WAY more manageable this time around, lol! Having run 2 out of 3 of these girls before I also know that the Skunk and Mazar are not going to stretch too much more, even though there is still another week to 2 weeks where they will probably stretch some. If they double in height that would be a pretty sizable stretch for them.

The Pupil on the other hand is the wild card as I’ve never grown her before. Still have some net left though if she starts to get out of hand and I need to start weaving her out more.

Day 22 of Transition/Flower.

Decided that some defoliation was necessary as there was basically zero light or airflow getting through into the lower canopy. Didn’t go quite as aggressively as I’ve done in the past (Schwazzing), but did need to remove most of the large fan leaves in order to allow light and airflow to penetrate into the canopy.

Hopefully the combination of this defoliation, continuing to apply LABs and AACT through this week (and “spot applying“ the LABs if needed to the leaves as needed through the remainder of the grow), plus adding a space heater to run at night (which is when the temps are dropping considerably and RH is rising considerably) will keep any more from germinating.

Node stacking is also looking really good on the Skunk and Mazar (a couple colas on the Mazar look like they are gonna be awesome!) and pretty decent on the Pupil, at least towards the tops.

Gonna also start to lower the Timber over this week and finish with it 24” off the center of the canopy so that I can get optimal light levels to these girls and allow them to fill out their Flowers to their full abilities.

Day 29 of Flower.

Stretch has all but stopped and the girls are starting to put their energy into their flowers. One of the the Prayer colas still managed to shoot up above everything else though. Good thing I wound up giving her a full half of the screen because she definitely would have been way taller than the other two had I not.

Also added a heater overnight to keep the temps up and RH down. Hopefully that plus the LABs will keep the fungal issues from coming back.

Day 36 of Flower update.

Stretch is over and Girls are continuing to put on weight and frost. Also starting to smell really good in the tent!

PM remains a pesky nuisance. Using LABs to keep it at bay, but even with the addition of the space heater I’ve been unable to wipe it out entirely.

Day 42 of Flower update.

PM remains a pesky nuisance. LAB foliar sprays are keeping it at bay on the uppers, but the canopy is so dense that it’s very difficult to get to the lowers without completely soaking down the flowers (which I am obviously hesitant to do for fear of courting Botrytis/Bud Rot).

Have a space heater running overnight which is keeping it he Temps and humidity more within reason, but it’s been single digit temps overnight and below freezing during the day, so my temps are still about 10 degrees cooler than I’d like and as such my RH is about the same amount off where it should be.

Unfortunatey, with COVID still in full swing the budget is still a lot tighter than normal, so still can’t really afford a proper Dehumidifier or Heater, but that’s gonna be my first two purchases once things get back to normal.

Frustrating, but still feel like I have learned some valuable things from this run which will only serve to make future grows better once I get the environment where I want it.

On a positive note the Skunk and Mazar are starting to get some nice color on them and the smell in the tent is lovely!

Day 49 of Flower update.

LABs foliars finally have the PM all but taken care of. Still the occasional blip here and there, but I actually really have to look to find it, which is a dramatic improvement over this time last week.

Starting to see some definite fade starting and also getting some purples starting to show up on all 3 girls now. Looks like they are about to start their final senescence phase. Hopefully will wind up with some nice Fall colors by Harvest time. Should be about another couple weeks based on how they look and also Breeder projected Flowering times.

Day 60 from Flip update.

The fade is on! Getting some really nice Fall colors coming in on al 3 girls. Planning to Harvest at least the Skunk and Mazar this Weekend. Will be a last minute call as to whether the Pupil is also ready. If not I’ll let her go a little longer till she is done.

Day 62 since the flip.

Today will be the final day for these girls and tomorrow morning they will be harvested.

Overall I’d say it was a successful grow and a solid Round 2 in Living Soil. Still ran into some issues and hiccups, but was pretty much able to solve them and finish strong.

Things I learned this round:

-LABs are the bomb when it comes to dealing with PM!

-Some strains/cultivars are well suited to growing big skyscraper colas and others are far more suited to a true SCROG style grow. The Mazar is more of a SCROG strain

-Always flip earlier than you think you should, otherwise you may run out of room altogether like last run or at least run out of room to tuck should you wind up with an outlier cola like I did this run

Onwards and upwards!

Harvest Day.

So far I got the Skunk and Mazar cut down, washed, and hung. Didn’t have time to get to the Pupil yet though. Couple pics of the tent, Skunk, and Mazar.