Let's talk serious SCROG

stelthy

Well-Known Member




Hi all, just a quick update.. just switched into Flower on 15/9/2011.. I am still using my 250W MH and 6500k Blue Spec CFL's throughout 'the stretch' until the buds start to form.. I have increased the UV-B lamps on time to : On for an hour, Off for half hour etc etc... throughout the plants day time.. so far there's no bad effects caused, burning etc.. :) :) I am also still using CANNA Veg nuits until those 1st buds appear.

Hope you like the pics, I am pleased my SCROG is going so well....touch wood! :) - STELTHY :leaf:
 

ak.fortyseven

Well-Known Member
Lookin really nice, a rail could be useful in this situation if you only plan on using one light. a 1k roaming back and forth would cover your bases but I think if you really wanted to blast that area with light you would do 2x600s, then you wouldn't need the mover and the crossover would give that extra "kick" to the spots that have both light sources on it. The downside to rails is the coverage, they can get the whole canopy exposed over the course of a few hours but they leave dim spots for longer periods of time, forcing the plants to stretch more than they normally would. Thats my take on rails at least, if you can make it work for your setup, awsome!
I'd go w/ 2 600's! Mailny cause w/ scrog, the additional light penetration you get w/ the 1k wouldnt be as usefull as the better coverage of the 600's .
 

profgrow

Active Member
Lookin great stelthy,

Looks like you did some choppin' to keep that cramped side under control and the left is filling out very nicely!

Interesting strategy by "pulsing" your lights, I know a guy who does this and swears by it.

Again, really nice setup, cant wait to see flowers!
 

rocknratm

Well-Known Member
By the way, the reason I suggest 600w vs 1k is about heat, 1k require so much more ventilation and need to be 3ft or so from the plant. 600 watt run a lot cooler and can be placed much closer to the tops to supply the same amount of lumens as a 1kw. most growers that i know that picked up a 1k watt used it until it became an issue then went back to 600s.
3 ft my arse. mine are about 18"
 

luv2grow

Well-Known Member
yeah the 600 hundos might be the tech. but a 30" wide reflector on a rail that only travels a true 33 " i think a single 1000 would run it nice nice 8) The 1000 is a freebie so id just be buying a rail and reflector... which in my book saves me cash.... and i like that lol. Plus with some babies on the ground the 1000 will keep the stretch down. I'll keep you posted as i start my journal and post away here for the advice that will be more than welcome!

Stealthy luv the cab.. its looking dank!
 

profgrow

Active Member
yeah the 600 hundos might be the tech. but a 30" wide reflector on a rail that only travels a true 33 " i think a single 1000 would run it nice nice 8) The 1000 is a freebie so id just be buying a rail and reflector... which in my book saves me cash.... and i like that lol. Plus with some babies on the ground the 1000 will keep the stretch down. I'll keep you posted as i start my journal and post away here for the advice that will be more than welcome!

Stealthy luv the cab.. its looking dank!
Well dang! you didn't tell us you had the 1k already, that changes the story. A 1k in a XXXL hood on a rail will work fine. I will say this, if you can find a rail with limiters that will be your best bet, some rails go all the way from one side to another and you can't control it but, if you can find one with edge limiters you can adjust the rail length so the 1k doesn't pass over the edge of the screen, losing light onto the floor or wall.
 

profgrow

Active Member
Quick update on the U shaped scrog.

17 days into flowering 2 afghan/skunk ladies (these are a 90 day flower so we got some time). To give an idea of the dimensions; each top is about a "dime" sized and the scrog its self is 12 sq ft (each screen being a 3x2). Still running an exposed 400w for this setup, not ideal but able to keep the temp around 80.



 

profgrow

Active Member
Here's a quick pic of my veg room with 2 Violator kush ladies in waterfarms, augmented with bubblers in the res (the other plants are afghan/skunk clones that I'm kinda sitting on at the moment)

 

luv2grow

Well-Known Member
oh looking good!!
Yeah the rail has adjustable limiters and delay settings for the edges. Yup got a bunch of gear, just trying to figure out the best combo for this room. 8)
 

profgrow

Active Member
So, I am officially a derp.

I headed out to my "local" hydro store (roughly a 45 min drive from my house) to pick up some supples for an aero-cloner that I plan to build, got my nft sprayers, 2in net pots and some rapid rooters just in case. I got all the way home (after chatting up the clerk for almost an hour) and realized i had forgotten to grab 2in neoprene plugs... I can pick up everything else at Home Depot to finish the project and had planed to start affixing the parts tomorrow afternoon. Without neoprene plugs to stop water from shooting out of the res I am stuck, and better yet, the hydro store isn't open tomorow... ya. So, lesson learned, don't forget your list when making parts purchases, you will feel like a boner and pay with wasted time.
 

lilindian

Well-Known Member
Bet u never seen a screen like this bad-boy. Check the sig for the rest of the journal.



I'm experimenting here, dont reeeeallly know what im doing!
 

grlsk8co

Member
Hey Profgrow, awesome thread! lots of great info here! However I did have a question :)

I know its a little bit of an issue between growers when talking about cutting off lower growth, (some say its fine, some swear against it). If the issue is just cutting off nutrients that are stored in the leaves, would it be acceptable to do a nutrient flush, and then cut off the lower leaves that show the most signs of "flushing"?
 

profgrow

Active Member
Now thats a fun scrog lol!

Thanks for showing us that, so from what we can see it looks like a tie-down method of growing the plant out from the center and from the looks of it, carefully training with twist-ties to maximize space use and avoid having an under-canopy to fuss with. The distance from the medium doesn't matter much because you don't really need to get under there.

This is an incredibly creative technique, I love seeing things like this, people making the absolute best of what they have to work with.

Thank you again, we will be watching your journal to see how it turns out. One question; how do you keep the ties from "strangulating" the branches?
 

profgrow

Active Member
Hey Profgrow, awesome thread! lots of great info here! However I did have a question :)

I know its a little bit of an issue between growers when talking about cutting off lower growth, (some say its fine, some swear against it). If the issue is just cutting off nutrients that are stored in the leaves, would it be acceptable to do a nutrient flush, and then cut off the lower leaves that show the most signs of "flushing"?
To trim or not to trim, that is the question, weather it is nobler in the mind to suffer the slings and arrows... wait what were we talking about? Oh ya!

Here's my official stance on trimming: Outdoor plants, standard grow plants, SOG grows and seed to 12/12 grows need not be trimmed. It's not that is damages the plants, its just not needed. 0utdoor grows get full light coverage if not obstructed by an outside source (tree/building) so trimming them is bad because you are stopping them from doing what they do naturally = make bug fat buds. Lsting outdoor plants is great but trimming, again, is unnecessary. Standard grows/SOG and seed to 12/12 all can be left alone as well and will do fine, minimal work aside from removing yellowing leaves is great for these "set it and forget it" grow styles.

Now lets talk about scrog and trained plant systems: In my opinion, SCROG and larger LST grows can benefit from a good trim, here's why; LST and SCROG both use the canopy to maximize flower development, they are slightly more work than standard grow styles because of the continued training through the vegging and early flowering stages. LST grows are super bushy making they're lower branches that are not exposed to much (if any) light a mold and fungus hazard. "Lolie popping" large LSTs by removing small lower branches and foliage is a preventative measure against these becoming issues during late flower. SCROG also benefits from this "stripping" of the lower limbs for similar reasons; mold/fungus prevention and also plant development, the screen is full, almost no light should be below it, any plant matter below the light level is not only hazardous but wasteful, the plant cannot gain anything from this "appendage" through photosynthesis but to keep it alive it must keep pumping nutrients to it, leaves/branches below the canopy are "bloodsuckers" for lack of a better term. When I SCROG I try to remove as much underbrush before flower as possible, after flower i may remove fan leaves above the canopy that block light from flower sites but for the most part we try to leave it be after flowering starts, veg can handle some damage but in flower its best to baby her.

The argument made by a lot of growers against trimming is it stresses the plant and slows growth, this may be true to some degree, I honestly have never run a side by side to test the theory but it's nominal at best. Any time lost in veg is gained in top end yield, I like big colas, not unripened "under-fruit".
 

profgrow

Active Member
I realize that I didn't answer your flush question.

Nutrient stored in lower branches stays in lower branches, flushing before trimming would most likely slow your grow down with no real positive effect.
 

cues

Well-Known Member
Profgrow, I have done Vk before. It's almost an entirely different plant! Massive main stems and stinks to hell and back, even under veg or clones! Also, so incredibly bushy under light that you end up ripping bucket-loads of leaves out from underneath if scrogging. It's the only way to keep air-flow going. I definately agree with taking clones off bottom branches ( or even just binning them) in this situation.
Two problems I had with VK.
First, it reeks. Badly. Even when cloning, let alone veg or flower.
Second, I built up a tolerance quickly. Mind you, It was all I smoked for a long time. Apart from BHO! Then I gave up! Nothing seemed to touch me any-more and it seemed like a good idea to take a break!
 

profgrow

Active Member
Profgrow, I have done Vk before. It's almost an entirely different plant! Massive main stems and stinks to hell and back, even under veg or clones! Also, so incredibly bushy under light that you end up ripping bucket-loads of leaves out from underneath if scrogging. It's the only way to keep air-flow going. I definitely agree with taking clones off bottom branches ( or even just binning them) in this situation.
Two problems I had with VK.
First, it reeks. Badly. Even when cloning, let alone veg or flower.
Second, I built up a tolerance quickly. Mind you, It was all I smoked for a long time. Apart from BHO! Then I gave up! Nothing seemed to touch me any-more and it seemed like a good idea to take a break!
Serious, these things are like cabbages! I have grown everything from bag seeds to nicely prepped clones and never before have i seen anything like this! I fimmed (quad topped) both my VKs and they didn't even notice, they were like: "Hey, we're gonna grow 100 tops with or without you so just calm down!"

Good call on thinning the underbrush, based on the bushiness of this strain I will most likely use a screen with larger openings, the plastic fence netting from luv2grow's setup looks about perfect (nod).

The stink really is an issue, I am a Legal grower and all but I'm not trying to drive my neighbors crazy and bring unwanted attn to my situation. At maybe 4 weeks from seed they smell like some strains do in full bloom, I will definitely be flowering in a closed system with a heavy duty carbon filter and maybe even an O-zone generator. Yesterday morning I opened up my veg room and gagged, it smelled like someone hit a skunk in front of my house and I had left the windows open!

If you have any pics of a scrogged Violator Kush we would love to check them out.
 
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