Led Users Unite!

goofy81 said:

First run with some kingbrites. Struggling with nodes spacing being too close

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If nodes too close dim light a bit, l only use 100% in flower, 50% in veg is ample. Its about dli. Or you could bud them out and get tighter bud structure.

yo southren,

i been looking at going over to led from hps.

heat is my issue for me now that its summer time here , so with hps i wont start up again till sept.

do you have to vent out the heat from the leds?

wascaptain said:

yo southren,

i been looking at going over to led from hps.

heat is my issue for me now that its summer time here , so with hps i wont start up again till sept.

do you have to vent out the heat from the leds?

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I vent for 2 hrs a day, 1 hr before lights out to 1 hr after, to get humidity down from 80rh, nope fine at 90 degrees, have 16 inch fan to circulate air. Seems to work well and no pm, 2nd flower cycle, one plant 80 days in, had ph problem, meter broke was feeding 6.4 but was 3.4 with descrepancies. Using drops for ph now and back on track. They love hot and humid, just like a greenhouse. At 65rh l grow pm its rampant in my area. At 80rh none.

wascaptain said:

yo southren,

i been looking at going over to led from hps.

heat is my issue for me now that its summer time here , so with hps i wont start up again till sept.

do you have to vent out the heat from the leds?

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If you don't use an AC you will have to vent the heat at some point.

But keep in mind if you are relying entirely on venting for your cooling then when it's 90 in the summer it's gonna be 90+ whatever heat the lights and other equipment put off 3.41btu/watt.

Also your rooms humidity will be very close to whatever the outside humidity is while venting.

MidnightSun72 said:

If you don't use an AC you will have to vent the heat at some point.

But keep in mind if you are relying entirely on venting for your cooling then when it's 90 in the summer it's gonna be 90+ whatever heat the lights and other equipment put off 3.41btu/watt.

Also your rooms humidity will be very close to whatever the outside humidity is while venting.

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Yes but in house with central air. So cool down fast when vented. I do vent but only for 2 hrs. 1 hr b4 and after lights out. Lights on temp at 90, off same as house. Which has been around 70 all winter, l keep it cool in summer. So nightime temps will drop. Better than hps which l had to vent on full when lights were on. Even that was futile.

My tent is vented every 3/5 minutes depending on the season, without ventilation humidity will be to high even if the temperature is acceptable.
Bud rot, powdery mildew and insects thrive in warm humid tents/rooms.

MidnightSun72 said:

If you don't use an AC you will have to vent the heat at some point.

But keep in mind if you are relying entirely on venting for your cooling then when it's 90 in the summer it's gonna be 90+ whatever heat the lights and other equipment put off 3.41btu/watt.

Also your rooms humidity will be very close to whatever the outside humidity is while venting.

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I need to vent humidity at the expense of temperature, leds certainly burn cooler, to cool for the most part where I am in the world.

Árboles verdes said:

has anyone used the blackdog phytomax 2 led the 600,400 or 200watt and is it worth the price? thanks

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Black Dog is Not worth the price.
These are.
HLG
Timber Grow Lights
Spider Farmer
There ar3 more.

hillbill said:

Black Dog is Not worth the price.
These are.
HLG
Timber Grow Lights
Spider Farmer
There ar3 more.

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The usual suspects will lol @ you very soon

hillbill said:

Black Dog is Not worth the price.
These are.
HLG
Timber Grow Lights
Spider Farmer
There ar3 more.

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I completely agree black dog are over priced. And so are Timber cobs.
Their efficacy is outrageously bad considering the price. Still I know they grow good weed. Just not really up to "PAR" pun intended.

MidnightSun72 said:

I completely agree black dog are over priced. And so are Timber cobs.
Their efficacy is outrageously bad considering the price. Still I know they grow good weed. Just not really up to "PAR" pun intended.

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Hi @MidnightSun72

Efficacy and efficiency are different topics. I would argue that our lights are quite effective - COBs are not as efficient as mid power diodes, nor are they designed to be. That said we use high voltage COBs that use less current and also thermal management that is over the required manufacturer specifications in order to maximize both PPF output as well as overall LED longevity.

With respect to pricing, again I wholeheartedly disagree. If you are comparing our lights to a DIY build, there are many things you are missing including, but not limited to the following:

1. Cost of overhead
2. Expenses involved in running a company and employing people at good living wages
3. Freight expenses (especially post COVID) and material shortages/price increases for raw materials
4. Laboratory testing
5. Proper electrical management including safety precautions such as fuse protection, waterproof/mil grade electrical connections and top grade components.

While I appreciate your opinion, I believe the aforementioned items are of concern to customers that are unable/reticent to building their own lights.

Respectfully,
Dan

RainDan said:

Hi @MidnightSun72

Efficacy and efficiency are different topics. I would argue that our lights are quite effective - COBs are not as efficient as mid power diodes, nor are they designed to be. That said we use high voltage COBs that use less current and also thermal management that is over the required manufacturer specifications in order to maximize both PPF output as well as overall LED longevity.

With respect to pricing, again I wholeheartedly disagree. If you are comparing our lights to a DIY build, there are many things you are missing including, but not limited to the following:

1. Cost of overhead
2. Expenses involved in running a company and employing people at good living wages
3. Freight expenses (especially post COVID) and material shortages/price increases for raw materials
4. Laboratory testing
5. Proper electrical management including safety precautions such as fuse protection, waterproof/mil grade electrical connections and top grade components.

While I appreciate your opinion, I believe the aforementioned items are of concern to customers that are unable/reticent to building their own lights.

Respectfully,
Dan

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Hi Dan,

My apologies I was referring to the photon efficacy.

And having built my own lights I recognize there is a fair amount of labour, and checking and testing to do.

you guys make a great looking light and USA made I recognize is usually an indicator of quality. It looks it in the photos no question. Like I said I've seen lots of pictures of timber's growing nice weed.

This is the timber Fatty. It's $1200 to get 2.2umol/J led light.2097 umol/s @950W

For the exact same price $1200 I can get a new gavita 1930e which only uses 780W to make 1930umol/s and comes in at 2.5umol/I

Gavita has a longer warranty and arguably more overhead (paying European employees lol).

Or for $100 less @ $1100 you could buy an HLG light that uses only 630W @ 2.8umol/J and 1770ppf. Which I admit is short of the 2097. But needs much less wattage and has proven to flower the same or similar area.

I won't even bother comparing any Chinese/Ali Baba lights because the $$$/PPF would just make the rest blush. Never mind building your own.

Again I wasn't ragging on your company at all. I just think that's a lot of money for a fixture that has lower than avg (for current led offerings) photon efficacy. I do appreciate that it's USA made and you have a great reputation fir standing behind your product. And recognize that definitely worth a cost/price.

But the other companies have offerings just as good with same or longer warranties, more efficient, for similar or less money.

I appreciate the kind sentiments, however it is pretty clear that the PAR spread @ canopy height for a 45"x36" light like the Fatty with the LEDs spread over the actual frame area will give more consistent and even PAR map readings than a center mount light like the 650R and the 1930E.

Also, operating height will be lower with the Fatty - especially important in height compromised areas, and there are no additional cords/controllers required. Also our lights are customizable with respect to dimmer connectivity, color temperature mixing and overall build characteristics.

hillbill said:

Black Dog is Not worth the price.
These are.
HLG
Timber Grow Lights
Spider Farmer
There ar3 more.

Click to expand...

thank you, i will look into these

RainDan said:

I appreciate the kind sentiments, however it is pretty clear that the PAR spread @ canopy height for a 45"x36" light like the Fatty with the LEDs spread over the actual frame area will give more consistent and even PAR map readings than a center mount light like the 650R and the 1930E.

Also, operating height will be lower with the Fatty - especially important in height compromised areas, and there are no additional cords/controllers required. Also our lights are customizable with respect to dimmer connectivity, color temperature mixing and overall build characteristics.

Click to expand...

Not to sound like a fanboy, Timbers are more than numbers.
Midnight Sun do you own a Timber light? Have you ever tried one?
After trying numerous LED grow lights since 2014. I can honestly say that Timbers are an outstanding choice. Just showing efficiency numbers does not tell the whole story.
Timber lights also included multiple drivers for redundancy and prevention of catastrophic light failure.
For even a neophyte, Timbers can be fixed at your grow location. Their modular design allow for individual parts to be swapped out fairly easily. Try doing that with a Gavita.
Additionally, every component of the light is top shelf. The aluminum used is heavy gauge. The wiring and couplings are done with great attention to detail.
Regarding pricing, Timber offers various coupon codes that offer as much as 10% off. So, the $1,200 figure is flexible.
Finally, you'd be hard pressed to find a less self promoting person than Dan. He's all about putting out a quality product for a fair price. Anyone that's dealt with him would most likely agree. As such, ride by assessments which seem to dismiss their products as quaint or just lacking are an inaccurate perspective.
You are certainly entitled to your opinion.
However, it's just that, an opinion.

I just finished putting together two Chilled Growcraft x6 DIY kits and for $900 a pop I think they were worth it. $750 a pop would have been nice but the parts used in the x6 are top notch and solidly built. Keeping the driver out of the tent is a very nice option as well. I'll be putting them to use in 2 weeks.

Almost all my tents are LED now. Got one @ 5 weeks in flower and the other @ 3 weeks. So far they have a little bit more frost than my hps buds and they seem just as dense. My Black Banana Cookies will be done under hps in 10 days. I have about 3 of them @ 5 weeks under LED and they look just as fat and frosty as they do with the hps. I really can't tell the difference yet.

race winslow said:

Not to sound like a fanboy, Timbers are more than numbers.
Midnight Sun do you own a Timber light? Have you ever tried one?
After trying numerous LED grow lights since 2014. I can honestly say that Timbers are an outstanding choice. Just showing efficiency numbers does not tell the whole story.
Timber lights also included multiple drivers for redundancy and prevention of catastrophic light failure.
For even a neophyte, Timbers can be fixed at your grow location. Their modular design allow for individual parts to be swapped out fairly easily. Try doing that with a Gavita.
Additionally, every component of the light is top shelf. The aluminum used is heavy gauge. The wiring and couplings are done with great attention to detail.
Regarding pricing, Timber offers various coupon codes that offer as much as 10% off. So, the $1,200 figure is flexible.
Finally, you'd be hard pressed to find a less self promoting person than Dan. He's all about putting out a quality product for a fair price. Anyone that's dealt with him would most likely agree. As such, ride by assessments which seem to dismiss their products as quaint or just lacking are an inaccurate perspective.
You are certainly entitled to your opinion.
However, it's just that, an opinion.

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Like I've said multiple times before. I've seen lots of fantastic looking timber grows.

You can call this an opinion as much as you want.

Fact is other lights grow just as good of weed. For less watts (and thus heat) and less $$$$. Oh and they have longer warranty (5 years) than Timber (3 years).

But ya other than those points what a fantastic American made light.

MidnightSun72 said:

Like I've said multiple times before. I've seen lots of fantastic looking timber grows.

You can call this an opinion as much as you want.

Fact is other lights grow just as good of weed. For less watts (and thus heat) and less $$$$. Oh and they have longer warranty (5 years) than Timber (3 years).

But ya orher than those points what a fantastic American made light.

Click to expand...

Fact is other lights grow just as good of weed. How do you know? Did you compare them? For less watts (and thus heat) and less $$$$. Oh and they have longer warranty (5 years) than Timber (3 years). Is this a fact because you say so?

As I asked, have you grown with one? If not, your perspective is opinion. When I bought the Timber I also bought an HLG R spec Scorpion. I used them side by and preferred the Timber. So, I have experience with both lights. While, I understand that watts equals heat, I will also tell you that there didn't seem to be much difference in heat generation and that the Timber did a better job of dispersing it. The HLG at 600 watts, the Timber at 950. It was a toss up. The canopy penetration and light dispersion was superior with the Timber.
Timber doesn't need my help. However, I think comparing a Timber to a Black Dog is kind of a low shot at Timber. There are many happy customers using them.
Timber is a grower's centric company and trying to put out a decent product. I'm not sure why you're damning them with faint praise. Is it because of efficiency? If they grow excellent weed as you point out, what's the problem?

You're looking at a math equation and projecting results. Yet, you have no direct experience in using them.

Finally, wtf does a warranty have to do with growing good buds....nothing

A warranty is only as good as the company backing it up. HLG was great in accepting my return. Timber has been great with customer service. What experience do you have in returning a 5 year old light?

Tell us, what great light are you using?

God these light dudes are awful

race winslow said:

Fact is other lights grow just as good of weed. How do you know? Did you compare them? For less watts (and thus heat) and less $$$$. Oh and they have longer warranty (5 years) than Timber (3 years). Is this a fact because you say so?

As I asked, have you grown with one? If not, your perspective is opinion. When I bought the Timber I also bought an HLG R spec Scorpion. I used them side by and preferred the Timber. So, I have experience with both lights. While, I understand that watts equals heat, I will also tell you that there didn't seem to be much difference in heat generation and that the Timber did a better job of dispersing it. The HLG at 600 watts, the Timber at 950. It was a toss up. The canopy penetration and light dispersion was superior with the Timber.
Timber doesn't need my help. However, I think comparing a Timber to a Black Dog is kind of a low shot at Timber. There are many happy customers using them.
Timber is a grower's centric company and trying to put out a decent product. I'm not sure why you're damning them with faint praise. Is it because of efficiency? If they grow excellent weed as you point out, what's the problem?

You're looking at a math equation and projecting results. Yet, you have no direct experience in using them.

Finally, wtf does a warranty have to do with growing good buds....nothing

A warranty is only as good as the company backing it up. HLG was great in accepting my return. Timber has been great with customer service. What experience do you have in returning a 5 year old light?

Tell us, what great light are you using?

Click to expand...

race winslow said:

Fact is other lights grow just as good of weed. How do you know? Did you compare them? For less watts (and thus heat) and less $$$$. Oh and they have longer warranty (5 years) than Timber (3 years). Is this a fact because you say so?

As I asked, have you grown with one? If not, your perspective is opinion. When I bought the Timber I also bought an HLG R spec Scorpion. I used them side by and preferred the Timber. So, I have experience with both lights. While, I understand that watts equals heat, I will also tell you that there didn't seem to be much difference in heat generation and that the Timber did a better job of dispersing it. The HLG at 600 watts, the Timber at 950. It was a toss up. The canopy penetration and light dispersion was superior with the Timber.
Timber doesn't need my help. However, I think comparing a Timber to a Black Dog is kind of a low shot at Timber. There are many happy customers using them.
Timber is a grower's centric company and trying to put out a decent product. I'm not sure why you're damning them with faint praise. Is it because of efficiency? If they grow excellent weed as you point out, what's the problem?

You're looking at a math equation and projecting results. Yet, you have no direct experience in using them.

Finally, wtf does a warranty have to do with growing good buds....nothing

A warranty is only as good as the company backing it up. HLG was great in accepting my return. Timber has been great with customer service. What experience do you have in returning a 5 year old light?

Tell us, what great light are you using?

Click to expand...

Hey my dude. Why so riled up? I am not married to the lights I use. I use HPS, I use CMH and I use LEDs. I certainly won't let a brand name blind me (pun intended) to fact that they are just bridgelux cobs. i can grow weed with literally any light. Mine don't gotta say Timber on them.

happy you are enjoying your lights. Did they come with the dildo to shove up your ass or did you buy that on your own?