In defense of the bailout and the Federal Reserve

FLoJo

Well-Known Member
and as a matter of fact i have a person in my family who was attacked by the irs and won in court... you can get in trouble for falsifying your 1040 but have a pretty good chance of beating it if you simply dont file...

there are almost more people in the us that dont file than do. they cant get everyone
 

TheBrutalTruth

Well-Known Member
and as a matter of fact i have a person in my family who was attacked by the irs and won in court... you can get in trouble for falsifying your 1040 but have a pretty good chance of beating it if you simply dont file...

there are almost more people in the us that dont file than do. they cant get everyone
The problem is that not filing only works if you aren't trapped in the system by having a salaried position at a corporation where how much you make is reported to the government. The very fact that corporations pay taxes makes it nearly impossible to escape the tax system from inside a corporation, because the corporations take deductions on salary, so full reporting of salary is in their best interests.

Not filing of course, works if you have your own business, and are reasonably sure that you can afford to go to court, and have a sizable stock pile of cash reserve in the event your assets are frozen, or can continue to do business with your bank accounts frozen.
 

medicineman

New Member
The problem is that not filing only works if you aren't trapped in the system by having a salaried position at a corporation where how much you make is reported to the government. The very fact that corporations pay taxes makes it nearly impossible to escape the tax system from inside a corporation, because the corporations take deductions on salary, so full reporting of salary is in their best interests.

Not filing of course, works if you have your own business, and are reasonably sure that you can afford to go to court, and have a sizable stock pile of cash reserve in the event your assets are frozen, or can continue to do business with your bank accounts frozen.
Exactly. They have computer programs that can look through all those in the system for aberrations, Like comparing your companies tax pay ins to the filings by SS numbers etc. If something is out of sync, it pops up in the check this column. Once you have filed, you're in a word, screwed.
 

FLoJo

Well-Known Member
The problem is that not filing only works if you aren't trapped in the system by having a salaried position at a corporation where how much you make is reported to the government. The very fact that corporations pay taxes makes it nearly impossible to escape the tax system from inside a corporation, because the corporations take deductions on salary, so full reporting of salary is in their best interests.

Not filing of course, works if you have your own business, and are reasonably sure that you can afford to go to court, and have a sizable stock pile of cash reserve in the event your assets are frozen, or can continue to do business with your bank accounts frozen.
exactly, couldnt have said it better myself. this is exactly why so few people fight and win... but legally and constitutionally it is not a requirement
 

TheBrutalTruth

Well-Known Member
exactly, couldnt have said it better myself. this is exactly why so few people fight and win... but legally and constitutionally it is not a requirement
Yeah, I certainly agree that filing is voluntary, but when not filing means sacrificing several hundred dollars it is more expensive to not file than to file. Of course, if one gets into a cash business (or any business) it becomes more possible to ... tickle the numbers...
 

medicineman

New Member
Yeah, I certainly agree that filing is voluntary, but when not filing means sacrificing several hundred dollars it is more expensive to not file than to file. Of course, if one gets into a cash business (or any business) it becomes more possible to ... tickle the numbers...
If one could do all of his transactions in cash, it may work, but more and more, companies are demanding cashless transactions. In the near future, cash will be irrelevant. Once you can no longer trade with cash, it will be worthless and you will have to have a points account and a points card, your employer will add points and you will use them to survive. That will take the illegal drug trade to a standstill. How can someone in Columbia use points? I'm sure some ingenious solution will arrive, but it would certainly slow it down. Hey, I'll give you 20 points for the OZ.
 

FLoJo

Well-Known Member
they wont be able to phase out cash until they pass national id cards with the rfid chips with all of our info on em... if we can continually shut them down it may be held off, but honestly i feel like they are letting identity theft run rampant so that there will be an excuse to pass it.

if they do go to a point system, i would think that the drug trade would go back to a barter system.. may be harder for big timers cuz you cant really say hey ill give you these kilos for a mansion in colombia, a 50 ft speedboat, 3 lambos and a full armani wardrobe... but on the smaller scale i could def. see it revert back to the barter system... hey ill give you x bud for x food or water or whatever
 

TheBrutalTruth

Well-Known Member
they wont be able to phase out cash until they pass national id cards with the rfid chips with all of our info on em... if we can continually shut them down it may be held off, but honestly i feel like they are letting identity theft run rampant so that there will be an excuse to pass it.

if they do go to a point system, i would think that the drug trade would go back to a barter system.. may be harder for big timers cuz you cant really say hey ill give you these kilos for a mansion in colombia, a 50 ft speedboat, 3 lambos and a full armani wardrobe... but on the smaller scale i could def. see it revert back to the barter system... hey ill give you x bud for x food or water or whatever
I can see that being a problem, as it would be clear that a person is purchasing more food than is necessary to support their family, so it would create a paper trail that would lead to the "criminals," or people that know who the "criminals" are.

Though of course the only way to escape a system such as that would be to use fake identities if you don't want to let your real identity be known. Though I can see other solutions, such as transfers of "credits" between people for no reason, but once again it would provide that noticeable trend that leads to "criminals" who have more secondary income from people than truly possible.

Of course, RID would also further move to create a two class system. You are either chipped or not chipped, and if you aren't chipped then you are SoL... of course, I'd sooner become a corpse than get chipped, tracked and monitored like a farm animal, so guess that means I'm SoL.
 

FLoJo

Well-Known Member
As am I... but i dont think it would be that noticable, some ppl eat more than others but with the way they monitor shit now they will know every time you take a shit lol...
 

bobharvey

Well-Known Member
Gold and platinum, that's what I'm invested in. Of course, they're not all that stable, which underscores my point that a gold-based currency would be a bad idea, but they do keep their values remarkably well in a weak economy.

The last few years, interest rates in savings accounts have been lower than usual. I'd like to blame Bush somehow because it's the thing to do, but it probably wasn't his fault. My bank's savings account interest has been around 3% since I've had an account there though.

And yeah, inflation will probably make it hard for savings accounts to quite keep up with inflation, which sucks but is a small price to pay considering the shit we're in and the alternatives.
I think that the free market should be based on solid, sound money. Gold is way better than fiat currency because it is a lot harder to manipulate. Man has always thristed for power and what better way to control people than to control money? The American dollar is a symbol of debt not wealth. THe more money you have the more debt you have. Fractional reserve banking creates money out of thin air. There are regulations but its not like the average american even understands how money works in the first place. America is fucking stupid and we are all about to pay one heavy price for our ignorance. How can the FDIC insure peoples saving if the dollar crashes and is no more? Unless you are invested in something like oil or gold you could be ruined. But Gold is going up so goddamned high no one can afford it but the CEO bankster crooks on Wall Street. The kicker is that most people were against the bail out bill and they still took our money. Oh well.
 

Doctor Pot

Well-Known Member
I think that the free market should be based on solid, sound money. Gold is way better than fiat currency because it is a lot harder to manipulate. Man has always thristed for power and what better way to control people than to control money? The American dollar is a symbol of debt not wealth. THe more money you have the more debt you have. Fractional reserve banking creates money out of thin air. There are regulations but its not like the average american even understands how money works in the first place. America is fucking stupid and we are all about to pay one heavy price for our ignorance. How can the FDIC insure peoples saving if the dollar crashes and is no more? Unless you are invested in something like oil or gold you could be ruined. But Gold is going up so goddamned high no one can afford it but the CEO bankster crooks on Wall Street. The kicker is that most people were against the bail out bill and they still took our money. Oh well.
Gold is harder to manipulate, and that's part of the problem. Its value jumps around all over the place on its own, and the government has a harder time keeping the dollar's value stable. Plus, it's vulnerable to the sorts of commodity bubbles that recently hit oil, housing, food prices, etc.

Hey, here's a relevant newspaper article. This guy won a Nobel prize in economics by the way:

http://www.nytimes.com/2008/12/01/opinion/01krugman.html?em
 

max420thc

Well-Known Member
the nobel committee is run by members of the socialist and communist party's..so much for the cred of the nobel committee...2000 years ago..gold could buy you a suit of cloth's
a belt sandals wallet..today..a ounce of gold will buy a suit a belt shoes and wallet..did the value of gold change over the course of 2000 years>?NO....IT DIDNT.IT WILL STILL BUY TODAY WHAT IT PURCHASED 2000 YEARS AGO..when money is backed by gold there is no inflation...gold does not have inflation...a ounce of gold is a ounce of gold..doc..why are liberals socialist communist;s so fucking stupid?
 

Doctor Pot

Well-Known Member
the nobel committee is run by members of the socialist and communist party's..so much for the cred of the nobel committee...2000 years ago..gold could buy you a suit of cloth's
a belt sandals wallet..today..a ounce of gold will buy a suit a belt shoes and wallet..did the value of gold change over the course of 2000 years>?NO....IT DIDNT.IT WILL STILL BUY TODAY WHAT IT PURCHASED 2000 YEARS AGO..when money is backed by gold there is no inflation...gold does not have inflation...a ounce of gold is a ounce of gold..doc..why are liberals socialist communist;s so fucking stupid?
2000 years ago, an ounce of gold would buy you a hell of a lot more than a suit of clothes. Hell, it could probably buy you a house.

But that's beside the point. Why do you think low inflation is so terrible? And if the value of gold is so stable, then explain this:

 

max420thc

Well-Known Member
you are not looking at the value of gold..you are looking at the value of money compared to gold.....eventaly all currencys must succumb to the power of gold=alan greenspan....the more money that is printed the less it is worth..and the more of it it takes to purchase a ounce of gold..or a barrel of oil.or ..just name your commidity ..you really should spend a little time watching bloomburgs and listening to a few fed reserve presidents..or maybe a billionaire or two..about what is going on..
 

Doctor Pot

Well-Known Member
you are not looking at the value of gold..you are looking at the value of money compared to gold.....eventaly all currencys must succumb to the power of gold=alan greenspan....the more money that is printed the less it is worth..and the more of it it takes to purchase a ounce of gold..or a barrel of oil.or ..just name your commidity ..you really should spend a little time watching bloomburgs and listening to a few fed reserve presidents..or maybe a billionaire or two..about what is going on..
Two months ago, my car was worth four ounces of gold. Two weeks ago, it was worth five and a half. Did my car increase in value? That's your own logic, mind you.
 

jfgordon1

Well-Known Member
Sorry doc... im going to have to disagree with u on this subject... the federal reserve system doesnt work... it jst digs us into deeper debt
the billionaires running the reserve want us to barley keep our heads above water
they dont want us to drown... they dont want us laying comfortably on a raft drinkin a margarita
 

medicineman

New Member
today..a ounce of gold will buy a suit a belt shoes and wallet..

You need to change where you shop. I can certainly get a suit, a belt, shoes, and a wallet for less than 800 semolians, try Mens Wharehouse.
 

FLoJo

Well-Known Member
today..a ounce of gold will buy a suit a belt shoes and wallet..

You need to change where you shop. I can certainly get a suit, a belt, shoes, and a wallet for less than 800 semolians, try Mens Wharehouse.
LOL now thats funny!

Doc.. what he is trying to say is you are looking at the value of gold in relation to the dollar.. now due to market forces, and speculators the value of gold may not always stay stable simply because it is used as a buffer against inflation which can give it spikes from time to time... and your a smart guy im sure you know this so its unfair to take the spikes out of context like your car analogy.

what he is saying is if you look historically, what an ounce of gold could buy you in relation to GOODS stays relatively stable over the course of a long period of time (especially pre fed. reserve) the only thing that changes is the valuation against the dollar which changes every other goods value in relation to the dollar.. in other words back in the early 1900s a gold coin would buy you same goods it would today relatively speaking, minus a few upgrades in technology.

and a ounce of gold would not buy you a house back then doc, in the bible (if you believe it) it talks about an ounce of gold buying a nice tunic belt, robe, and sandals. ill see if i can find the verse.
 

medicineman

New Member
and a ounce of gold would not buy you a house back then doc, in the bible (if you believe it) it talks about an ounce of gold buying a nice tunic belt, robe, and sandals. ill see if i can find the verse.

Would that be shopping at Herrods discount mart?
 
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