Harrekin
Well-Known Member
You realise without critical mass no reaction occurs?
Fukushima, No Cause for Alarm
- Thread starter Doer
- Start date
Harrekin
Well-Known Member
You realise a "melt-down" is called that for literal reasons also?
The point is the reactor itself breaches containment and starts to melt downwards into the crust.
Natural radiation by itself is fine, but when you force these materials to undergo fission you realise a shitpile more radiation than could ever occur naturally (on this planet).
You righties are so dumb, unless you're in the radiation suit business.
Also "magma" is "lava" that hasn't reached the surface yet.
The average Republican's education level is quite low it seems.
Doer
Well-Known Member
I love that part.
"if the magma was under pressure...." Well. let's say it was and it is. A bar of pressure = 14.7 pound/sq inch.
So, a magic hole of just one inch wide, to the mantle will produce 14.7 x 9600 = 70 tons of pressure per square inch
So, if we realize that the "hole" will be quite large, many feet across at least, we see from the pressure gradient our problems start long before it gets to the mantle. And before we get anywhere close to mantle it will already be a SuperRadio Stratospheric Volcano.
Distribution of pressure within the Earth
Example: what is the pressure at the base of 40-km of granite crust
= 9.6 kbar
For the Earths crust, the relation between pressure and
depth is roughly 1 GPa or 10 kbar per 35-40 km.
"if the magma was under pressure...." Well. let's say it was and it is. A bar of pressure = 14.7 pound/sq inch.
So, a magic hole of just one inch wide, to the mantle will produce 14.7 x 9600 = 70 tons of pressure per square inch
So, if we realize that the "hole" will be quite large, many feet across at least, we see from the pressure gradient our problems start long before it gets to the mantle. And before we get anywhere close to mantle it will already be a SuperRadio Stratospheric Volcano.
Distribution of pressure within the Earth
Example: what is the pressure at the base of 40-km of granite crust
= 9.6 kbar
For the Earths crust, the relation between pressure and
depth is roughly 1 GPa or 10 kbar per 35-40 km.
NLXSK1
Well-Known Member
Why hasnt this happened before then?
LOL!!!
Where is all this pressure coming from?
Do you think if you pierce the earth it will deflate like a balloon? LOL!
This just illustrates how dangerous a little knowledge is...
Doer
Well-Known Member
You mean how stupid you sound.
Still don't get it, huh? Happened before? You mean a nuke meltdown? No, not yet.
High pressure magma vented to the surface, is building a new Island off Hawaii, right now. The caldera when active at Yellowstone, ejects enough magma to burn all of North America and winterize the North Hemi. And in Geo time that happens constantly and is due again. Every 600,000 years.
So, don't act like a joke and you won't be one. Stupid is as stupid does.
Winter Woman
Well-Known Member
My brother does work for companies that run nuclear reactors. This event shook him to the core. No pun intended. A meltdown was not all that unthinkable. What he said to me at the time was that if the nuclear material was no longer cooled and burned through the containment vessel that all bets would be off. His belief is that it would burn to the mantle and that could mean Armageddon-a nuclear winter. But no one really knows since it has never happened. This is a very simplified version of my conversations with him.
He, also, said those men that gave their lives to get control of the power plant were some of the bravest men on the planet. Their deaths were probably horrifying.
He, also, said those men that gave their lives to get control of the power plant were some of the bravest men on the planet. Their deaths were probably horrifying.
Doer
Well-Known Member
Yeah, at least they knew what they were up against. Some of the guys firefighting on the roof of Chernobyl where walking dead the first minute.
NLXSK1
Well-Known Member
You havent explained why the magma just doesnt keep blowing out of these massive holes from all the pressure you describe.
The meltdown they are worried about is the nuclear material melting through the contaiment vessel causing further pollution.
Lets say that the fuel could melt through rock. Is it hot enough to completely vaporize rock? If not, what happens to the melted rock below the fuel? If the fuel keeps sinking in the molten rock then it would eventually cover the fuel and harden forming a crust over the fuel as it decended to the center of the earth.
NOTHING IS GOING TO HAPPEN!!! Other than the obvious local pollution they are dealing with.
You never addressed how millions of people can survive and thrive in and around Hiroshima and Nagasaki yet...
This is a local pollution problem, not an extinction event...
Doer
Well-Known Member
It isn't me that is saying it. It is already a melt down. It has already broken containment and is threatening to blow.
At present, three of the reactors at Fukushima Daiichi station are seriously crippled. Units 1 and 3 have experienced explosions that destroyed exterior walls, apparently from buildups of hydrogen gas produced by the zirconium in the fuel rods reacting with coolant water at extremely high temperatures—but the interior containment vessels there thus far seem to be intact. A third explosion was reported March 15 at reactor No. 2, and the situation there appears direr. Pressure in the suppression pool—a doughnut-shaped water vessel below the reactor—dropped after the explosion, indicating that the containment vessel had been compromised.
50, 000 Hiroshimas....are you being dense on purpose? It is happening and it is out of control. And there is no plan.
Samwell Seed Well
Well-Known Member
agree with all you said as well , but this rings so true ^....those men are legends in my mind . . .the sacrifice they made was uncanny
Winter Woman
Well-Known Member
That event happened in 2011. It is my belief that they have been flooding the reactor ever since, but that is just a guess. But it can happen and if it does it will ruin vast amounts of farm land here in the USA. Yes, people will die but it is the birth defects in animals and humans that are the real problem.It isn't me that is saying it. It is already a melt down. It has already broken containment and is threatening to blow.
At present, three of the reactors at Fukushima Daiichi station are seriously crippled. Units 1 and 3 have experienced explosions that destroyed exterior walls, apparently from buildups of hydrogen gas produced by the zirconium in the fuel rods reacting with coolant water at extremely high temperatures—but the interior containment vessels there thus far seem to be intact. A third explosion was reported March 15 at reactor No. 2, and the situation there appears direr. Pressure in the suppression pool—a doughnut-shaped water vessel below the reactor—dropped after the explosion, indicating that the containment vessel had been compromised.
50, 000 Hiroshimas....are you being dense on purpose? It is happening and it is out of control. And there is no plan.
heckler73
Well-Known Member
Doer,
The fault I see in your argument is one of "fallacy of composition".
Yes, the sum total of all the material at Fukushima has potential to do XYZ...
However, look at the individual rods first. What is their makeup? You can't calculate critical mass until you know what you are dealing with.
Second, how are they currently positioned? Is there any form of physical external shielding?
[HR][/HR]Each "fuel assembly," roughly 15 feet long, is a unit containing 82 fuel rods full of the reactor's fuel: uranium oxide pellets. During periodic refueling shutdowns, workers typically replace 20 to 30 percent of the fuel assemblies.
Once extracted from the reactor, the used assemblies are housed in close-fitting steel containers that are treated with boron, to ensure they don't resume the chain reactions necessary to generate electricity.
[HR][/HR]http://www.csmonitor.com/USA/2011/0315/Meltdown-101-What-are-spent-fuel-pools-and-why-are-they-a-threat
http://www.oecd-nea.org/sfcompo/Ver.2/Eng/Fukushima-Daiichi-3/index.html
How do these facts integrate into your hypothesis?
The fault I see in your argument is one of "fallacy of composition".
Yes, the sum total of all the material at Fukushima has potential to do XYZ...
However, look at the individual rods first. What is their makeup? You can't calculate critical mass until you know what you are dealing with.
Second, how are they currently positioned? Is there any form of physical external shielding?
[HR][/HR]Each "fuel assembly," roughly 15 feet long, is a unit containing 82 fuel rods full of the reactor's fuel: uranium oxide pellets. During periodic refueling shutdowns, workers typically replace 20 to 30 percent of the fuel assemblies.
Once extracted from the reactor, the used assemblies are housed in close-fitting steel containers that are treated with boron, to ensure they don't resume the chain reactions necessary to generate electricity.
[HR][/HR]http://www.csmonitor.com/USA/2011/0315/Meltdown-101-What-are-spent-fuel-pools-and-why-are-they-a-threat
http://www.oecd-nea.org/sfcompo/Ver.2/Eng/Fukushima-Daiichi-3/index.html
How do these facts integrate into your hypothesis?
Winter Woman
Well-Known Member
Problem is these rods are not housed.
Doer
Well-Known Member
But, they do just keep going, these mantle breeches. And don't morph it to say, I expect the Syndrome out of Fuk. I don't. But, if was able to get a plume connected the mantle, then that is it. It is more or less a permanent feature in the crust.
Doer
Well-Known Member
That was before the disaster. The fuel rods are melted, and they have melt thru the bottom of the containment.
http://www.world-nuclear-news.org/RS-Fukushima_fuel_melt_confirmed-1605115.html
Flaming Pie
Well-Known Member
NLXSK1 is just saying that the lives of the japanese and eastern coast of asians don't matter.
Flaming Pie
Well-Known Member
He seems to have forgotten that EVERYONE within the city limits of Hiroshima and Nagasaki died. And people on the edge died from radiation poisoning.
Winter Woman
Well-Known Member
No he isn't. I don't think he means that at all.
Flaming Pie
Well-Known Member
But all that radiation if it escapes into the air or sea in Fukushima won't cause any AMERICAN deaths so it is ok.
Right NLXSK1?
heckler73
Well-Known Member
AHHHHHHHHHHhhhhhhhhh... okay.
Now at least I understand what you are concerned about in particular.
So you are worried about the corium?
Then you need info about how much material is in there...
All those other numbers quoted earlier are irrelevant.
THE DEEPENING CRISIS AT FUKUSHIMA is explained by GORDON EDWARDS, President of the Canadian Coalition for Nuclear Responsibility. Gordon is one of the world's leading expert on atomic power and Fukushima. He makes it clear that the terrifying outflow of contaminated water pouring through the Fukushima site is a clear and present threat to all living things in the Pacific Ocean and to human life in general. The crisis is clearly beyond the ability of Tepco, the Japanese government or perhaps the world nuclear as a whole. Join us at the Green Power &
Wellness Show to explore the horrors of this utter breakdown of the nuclear folly.
http://greenpowerwellnessshow.podbean.com/2013/08/12/green-power-and-wellness-080813/
And Tepco's Sept 2013 presentation (but they aren't talking about the cores).
http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=ac7_1379630713
Using Muons to map the cores????
http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2013/08/130807115624.htm