Flush rant

breakdancer0003 · Jan 20, 2016

monkz said:
Complex sugars can't count for nitrogen, potassium, phosphorous, manganese, etc, etc.

That is actually the aim / reason why people flush to remove the excess nitrogen, potassium, phosphorous, manganese ect. from the actual structure of the plant. When it lacks the nutrients from the grow medium it still absorbs H20 it needs bringing the sugar with it and it breaks down the fan leaves and lower branch larf for those nutrients it's lacking. the flush itself doesn't remove anything from the plant it just shocks the plant into using its reserves

you wouldn't want this to go on for a long time but the plant can survive / thrive for the week or two that it is in the flushed soil. / DWC ect.

VSFLESHnBONE1 · Jan 20, 2016

SPLFreak808 said:
The problem is, they were never "extra" nutes. The plant still needs them. if you feed too much towards the end that is a grower error. If you have not went borderline toxic or fed the wrong shit during the ripening stage, they will cure just fine, they will smoke just fine. When you flush in flower, not only do you remove a good amount of nutrients, you also deprive the root zone of oxygen, it will stress the plant out. The only time ive had nasty buds were harvested from plants with crazy toxicities,imbalanced feeding ratio's or a rushed/lazy dry & cure.

TRUE.

breakdancer0003 · Jan 20, 2016

Jimmy Sparkle said:
Do you think professional growers of anything flush? Rose growers, orchid growers , potato growers shit come to think of it NO professional growers do this flushing horseshit . Do plants that grow in nature flush. Your answer is No and neither do I and neither should you. Saying that I think that I've made a good point, so how much info now must you have to realize that this practice is idiotic?

1. Plenty of professional cannabis farmers flush and plenty of them don't

2. The other industries that you mentioned above are either edible goods / pretty plants to look at that are not subjected to fire / consumed as smoke so the methodologies / optimum production procedures for preparing them are going to differ greatly

3. In terms of the plants in nature, you are correct they don't flush, however my objective here is to grow in optimum or perfect conditions to produce certain unnatural results such as higher THC, more terpenes, bulk yields cleaner smoke ect. If you don't flush solely because it's not what's done in nature then how is it justified to grow indoors / with chemical nutrients or hydro systems ect. These are all done to optimize the grow and there is evidence to back it up, so the question here is does this optimize the production or not and that is something that debating instead of experimenting and researching into it isn't going to give us any good answer.

4. The "info" I am looking for is any evidence based / scientifically tested information that wasn't hearsay / "good points" that need to be defended / supported by saying the other way is "shit" or "idiotic" instead of focusing on why there methodology is correct
:roll:

Jimmy Sparkle · Jan 20, 2016

I'm wasn't talking about commercial Cannabis farmers wich in my opinion doesn't count because they are subject to the same urban legend nonsense as well. Again, look at real farmers for real answers.

chuck estevez · Jan 20, 2016

breakdancer0003 said:
1. Plenty of professional cannabis farmers flush and plenty of them don't

2. The other industries that you mentioned above are either edible goods / pretty plants to look at that are not subjected to fire / consumed as smoke so the methodologies / optimum production procedures for preparing them are going to differ greatly

3. In terms of the plants in nature, you are correct they don't flush, however my objective here is to grow in optimum or perfect conditions to produce certain unnatural results such as higher THC, more terpenes, bulk yields cleaner smoke ect. If you don't flush solely because it's not what's done in nature then how is it justified to grow indoors / with chemical nutrients or hydro systems ect. These are all done to optimize the grow and there is evidence to back it up, so the question here is does this optimize the production or not and that is something that debating instead of experimenting and researching into it isn't going to give us any good answer.

4. The "info" I am looking for is any evidence based / scientifically tested information that wasn't hearsay / "good points" that need to be defended / supported by saying the other way is "shit" or "idiotic" instead of focusing on why there methodology is correct

grab yourself some salt and burn it, grab some sugar and burn it, then tell me which one smells more like chem weed. Thank you, that is all.

Richard Drysift · Jan 20, 2016

VSFLESHnBONE1 said:
Next grow I'm ditching plastic bottles, but @ the moment I am using bottled organic nutrients/myco.
Am I able to water throughout my grow without flush?

That depends upon what you are using...a lotta crap out there says "organic" on it. I'm saying if you use only dry amendments & compost there's no need to flush because you basically just give them water the whole grow anyway; have no clue about soup style organics but I'm thinking you've got to stop giving them npk in the final 14 days before harvest...that would be considered flushing imo

jarvild · Jan 20, 2016

Mother nature has spent 10,000+ years perfecting her craft. Science has done nothing in the past 200 years but fock it up.

ryan1918 · Jan 21, 2016

We need someone that is willing to do a side by side comparison of the same exact clone or strain and flush one and not flush the other and see the actual results because this has been debated so many times and its starting to make sense that your taking away things from your plants when you only use water, also it would be good to see the taste difference as long as they are both cured good.

chuck estevez · Jan 21, 2016

ryan1918 said:
We need someone that is willing to do a side by side comparison of the same exact clone or strain and flush one and not flush the other and see the actual results because this has been debated so many times and its starting to make sense that your taking away things from your plants when you only use water, also it would be good to see the taste difference as long as they are both cured good.

You have been appointed, let us know what you find out :roll:

Connoisseurus Rex · Jan 21, 2016

Jimmy Sparkle said:
I'm wasn't talking about commercial Cannabis farmers wich in my opinion doesn't count because they are subject to the same urban legend nonsense as well. Again, look at real farmers for real answers.

I assume you're talking about produce farmers?

MickFoster · Jan 21, 2016

I just don't understand why people deny their plant food during the most important time of flower production. The last 2 weeks of its life is when it packs on the weight.

Cobnobuler · Jan 21, 2016

monkz said:
I will say this one last time,.

No...when it comes to the topic of flushing, there is no "last time" It never goes away, it never gets a rest.

Jimmy Sparkle · Jan 21, 2016

Connoisseurus Rex said:
I assume you're talking about produce farmers?

I'm talking every farmer that produces ANYTHING other than cannabis. The reason I say other than cannabis is because this ridiculous practice of flushing seems to only haunt the cannabis realm. Wich again is why I say now and always will. Ask a real farmer of anything and get real answers. Unfortunately there is so much urban legend in this culture that it tends to make newer growers sound stupid and arrogant and its not their fault they just don't know any better. Tired of people that never grew a squash or anything else arguing about flushing. Open bottles, pour in toilet now flush! It's basically the same

Connoisseurus Rex · Jan 21, 2016

Jimmy Sparkle said:
I'm talking every farmer that produces ANYTHING other than cannabis. The reason I say other than cannabis is because this ridiculous practice of flushing seems to only haunt the cannabis realm. Wich again is why I say now and always will. Ask a real farmer of anything and get real answers. Unfortunately there is so much urban legend in this culture that it tends to make newer growers sound stupid and arrogant and its not their fault they just don't know any better. Tired of people that never grew a squash or anything else arguing about flushing. Open bottles, pour in toilet now flush! It's basically the same

Most farmers I know, grow in fields. If there's any flush, it's in the rain. However, they use synthetic pesticides/fungicides/insecticides... But that another topic I guess.

Most of the greenhouse owners I know DO flush for established plants, trees, or shrubs. Even non produce. They flush for salt buildup from synthetics every now and then. That's the only reason.

Jimmy Sparkle · Jan 21, 2016

Connoisseurus Rex said:
Most farmers I know, grow in fields. If there's any flush, it's in the rain. However, they use synthetic pesticides/fungicides/insecticides... But that another topic I guess.

Most of the greenhouse owners I know DO flush for established plants, trees, or shrubs. Even non produce. They flush for salt buildup from synthetics every now and then. That's the only reason.

I've had my hand in agriculture my whole life .I ve grown everything from Cannabis to mushrooms and everything in between. I've worked in and with hundreds of farmers and greenhouse growers.,House plants bamboo whatever and this flushing crap ls cannabis specific wich leads me to believe that people just don't understand plants , how they work or how to care for them. I'm not saying you in particular I'm just talking about growers in general. I would bet my house in what an old potato farmer told me rather than someone who's only ever grew cannabis and not very good at it.

Jimmy Sparkle · Jan 21, 2016

And I suppose tobacco farmers flush so you don't get sparks or whatever. It's called knowledge!!!! They know how to grow and CURE THEIR PRODUCT!!!!! Again forget what you think you know, re establish your knowledge foundation and proceed....

monkz · Jan 21, 2016

breakdancer0003 said:
That is actually the aim / reason why people flush to remove the excess nitrogen, potassium, phosphorous, manganese ect. from the actual structure of the plant. When it lacks the nutrients from the grow medium it still absorbs H20 it needs bringing the sugar with it and it breaks down the fan leaves and lower branch larf for those nutrients it's lacking. the flush itself doesn't remove anything from the plant it just shocks the plant into using its reserves

you wouldn't want this to go on for a long time but the plant can survive / thrive for the week or two that it is in the flushed soil. / DWC ect.

Your first paragraph contradicts itself.
If you're a responsible grower, there's no need to allow your plant to use its reserves, since you should be giving it adequate nutrition until the day you harvest.
Flushing is only reasonable if you're trying to get rid of excess nutrients, or correct an imbalance.

People fail because they don't cure their bud, and they blame it on flushing.

sunni · Jan 21, 2016

not this fucking thread topic again lol!

breakdancer0003 · Jan 21, 2016

monkz said:
Your first paragraph contradicts itself.
If you're a responsible grower, there's no need to allow your plant to use its reserves, since you should be giving it adequate nutrition until the day you harvest.
Flushing is only reasonable if you're trying to get rid of excess nutrients, or correct an imbalance.

People fail because they don't cure their bud, and they blame it on flushing.

I will reword what i am trying to say then and see if it comes across more clearly

-Pre End of life Flushing actively removes nutrients from the SOIL which in turn passively removes them from the plant itself.

-This is done for a completely different different reason than the standard flushing used to removed salt build up / true excess nutrients.

-The plant can no longer acquire these nutrients since they have been flushed out of the soil

-The plant through hormonal pathways puts complete priority on the buds and begins leeching NPK ect. out of the other plant structures such as leaves ( which is why they yellow )

-There is more then enough reserve of these nutrients inside the body of the plant as a natural defense mechanism to respond to natural low nutrient levels in the soil. So this lack of soil nutrition has already been accounted for and doesn't stress the plant enough to hermy.

-As these reserves are used up you would be surprised to here the levels of those elements are lowered inside of the plant

-Less of these nutrients present when combusting the material for consumption would support the idea presented of a more pleasant smoke (Inhaling higher levels of super heated NPK ect. < Inhaling diminished or lower levels of NPK )

This is the evidence i have come across for the support of flushing, from how i have interpreted the info it seems biologically and rationally sound. You can come to your own conclusions and please if you have more information for me to look at I am more then willing to reevaluate.

Also in response to "other commercial growers" ( non cannabis ) not flushing there products

-it's important to note, none / very few of those products are being consumed through burning / are potentially coming from plants that don't live out a single life cycle like the cannabis plant does

but again if you have more information for me to look at I am more then willing to reevaluate.

Dr.Pecker · Jan 21, 2016

It all boils down to, pot is finicky. People don't understand this, so they give it too much or too little of something and get a lock out problem. Best course of action with lock out is to wash the substrate. It seems people just don't care, feed it what ever and flush because they have to. These folks say it worked for me so it must be necessary and they spread this bs all over. If everything is dialed in and you know what you're doing you shouldn't have a problem. Grow responsibly and keep the environment clean. Try not to kill the honeybees. I prefer my plants a little faded. They taste better than breakfast the day after having sex with your mom. Organic not flushed