First Grow! Sealed/Closed Room, 2400 watts, CO2, Mini-Split AC, SmartPots, Dehum!

You'll be wasting co2 pushing 1500 ppm with 1200 watts in an area the size of the one your flowering in you don't have enough light if you can except ebooks I'll ebook you a book on co2 by ed rosenthal plants can use 1500ppm co2 don't get me wrong but it depends on size of room and the ammount of light hate to see you waste what you've paid for

Deerhunter617 said:

You'll be wasting co2 pushing 1500 ppm with 1200 watts in an area the size of the one your flowering in you don't have enough light if you can except ebooks I'll ebook you a book on co2 by ed rosenthal plants can use 1500ppm co2 don't get me wrong but it depends on size of room and the ammount of light hate to see you waste what you've paid for

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Id love to read the ebook if ya got the link. What max ppm do you recommend then. 1200?

Nice grow man, you really went all out for a first grow, I bet it's been a bit mind boggling tacking all at once. I don't see anything wrong with 1500 ppm unless it's really wasting your gas, but the gas is a minimal cost at $1/lb... People are wasting far more on a crazy amount nutrient additives (I'm just as guilty). I just got my CO2 so I really can't speak from experience but my research has led me to believe it should be started flower week 1, after most of the stretch is done until about 2 weeks prior to harvest. I plan to run around 1200 ppm to start and ramping up to 1500ppm by the end. Best of luck on your ventures though, I will be tuned.

Someguy15 said:

Nice grow man, you really went all out for a first grow, I bet it's been a bit mind boggling tacking all at once. I don't see anything wrong with 1500 ppm unless it's really wasting your gas, but the gas is a minimal cost at $1/lb... People are wasting far more on a crazy amount nutrient additives (I'm just as guilty). I just got my CO2 so I really can't speak from experience but my research has led me to believe it should be started flower week 1, after most of the stretch is done until about 2 weeks prior to harvest. I plan to run around 1200 ppm to start and ramping up to 1500ppm by the end. Best of luck on your ventures though, I will be tuned.

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Hey Someguy15, thanks for tuning in bud! I appreciate all the help I can get, it certainly IS overwhelming for a first timer. I think I have most of my ducks in a row by now though and although I have made some mistakes, or rather, have found I'd do it differently at different stages for my next grow, I have loved every minute of it.

Psychologists have proven time and time again that not only does gardening improve ones mood, but caring for another living organism gives one a feeling of self-worth and joy. I completely agree. I love my babies and love tending them, true its a fucking bitch at times, especially since I'm hand watering soil and not fully automated hydro, but thats the nature of my room. I can't get water into it and so am forced to go organic soil. At least until I move to a medical state! Which is hopefully not more than 2 years or so off...we're working on it...

Yeah opinions on RIU are like assholes. Everyone has one. I only listen to the ones I really trust that make sense to me, which is probably like 10% of the total population here. Not to diss anyone, but most people on here seem like they talk out their ass... I have made some good e-friends and have good mentors helping me so far with LegallyFlying, Illumination, and Shrubs. They have all been super super helpful and kind to me...put up with my stupid ass questions and dumb mistakes. Thanks guys!

Anyhow, glad to have ya onboard Someguy15!

I agree about the nutes...I think Deerhunter does have some validity to his point about not using 1500ppm in my room though...I did some googling last night and have found that most CO2 "experts" recommend 1500ppm CO2 supplementation ONLY IF your room is perfected at that point..ie 50-60 watts/square foot, etc etc. Which quite frankly I don't have. I need to measure the exact dimensions, but I'm really thinking I have more like 37.5-42.5 watts/square foot (depending on the exact measurements, this is only my estatimation at the moment) in my 1200 watt flowering chamber thats approx 4' wide x 7-8' long ( need to measure it exactly). SO....1500ppm CO2 might indeed be a waste. I do think that I am close to the 50 w/sq foot though and not terribly far off, so I'm thinking 1200 ppm CO2 would probably be about perfect. Besides, I'd read 1200-1500 is about perfect anyhow, and so if I save a bit of gas and use 1200 ppm, that'd be fine by me.

When you run your CO2, do you taper it off at the last 2-3 weeks of the cycle? Am I crazy or has anyone else read stuff about lowering CO2 levels down to 800-1000 ppm the last couple weeks before discontinuing using it. Or do you all just run 1500ppm through week 8-9 and chop and call it a day?!?!


PS -- Today I took the dehumidifier off the Sentinel CHHC-4 controller and set it back onto its own 20 amp circuit dedicated wall outlet. Due to the manufacturer's defaulting of the rH level to 60% when the Danby Dehumidifier powers on, I am not able to use it to the extent I want when controlled by the Sentinel CHHC-4 controller. I'll have to just let it run 24/7 and set the humidity to 45% rH as I was doing before I installed the controller...so the controller is pretty expensive just for CO2 controlling, but whatev...its nice! Upped the CO2 ppm to 1050ppm today and raised the mini-split AC temps to 78F (as measurec by the mini split on the wall)...the canopy temp (as measured by the Sentinel CHHC-4 controller's probe hung at canopy tops) is more like 82F. So I'm getting close to where I want to be...probably going for 85F and 1200PPM.

COMMENTS?

Thanks,

X

Forgot to mention that today is the start of week 4!! I hit them with their first taste of Bloombastic today...

Feeding Solution (gave each 3 gal smart pot 1/2 gallon a piece):

1 tsp Cal-Mag+
1 tsp Silica
2 tsp Fox Farms Grow Big (grow)
3 tsp Fox Farms Big Bloom (micro)
3/4 tsp Fox Farms Tiger Bloom (Bloom - cut in half since using Bloombastic for first time as I don't want burn..will up gradually back to 2 tsp if no problems with Bloombastic)
2.5 mL Atami Bloombastic (BLOOM MASTER PRODUCT -- ALL IN ONE)

1350 ppm TDS (EC x 0.5)
6.3 pH

Gonna add another 2 tsp of Mycorrhyzae granular spores to each 3 gal smart pot this week. This will be the last time I supplement myco this cycle (been doing it every 2 weeks since about week 2). Thanks LF!

I recommend dropping the TB altogether while using bloombastic or they will od on P and K

Illumination said:

I recommend dropping the TB altogether while using bloombastic or they will od on P and K

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I debated doing just that but after talking to a local friend that I trust, I decided to just cut the tiger bloom in half rather than cut it out entirely. This was after he swore up and down that I could continue using TB without problems even after adding the bloombastic.

What spurred this conversation on was the fact that Ididntwant to burn theshit outta these plants like i had done on my "experiment" plant before this by using gravity and not cutting my nutes down before using it. Burnt the holy shit outta it. Ruined her at week 6. I am determined to not do that with bloombastic. Anyhow he told me bloomastic isnt gravity. They work nothing alike. Gravity just forces mass nute uptake in short time period. Bloombastic he said was different. Didnt work like that and wasnt as susceptible to cause burning as a result.

So we decided to just cut TB in half or lower (as i did. Normal amt of tb as listed by ff is 2tsp/gal). So i hope that the 3/4tsp / gal of TB i gave wont hurt me, we shall see....my friend swore id be fine as my overall NPK numbers even with TB were acceptable for this bloom stage.

Ill post pics in 2-3 days and well see! I already feel like the CO2 frm last 3 days has had huge effect in a good way!

Thanks,
X

yes I hadn't thought it all the way through on the light...assumed you had 50/ft....I recommend 4 400 watt cmh's but I am partial...lol....just love mine and temp control is a breeze....alot easier to control the heat and get rid of it....1200 ppm sounds perfect....you can stop the TB as the bloombastic has more than enough p and k

Namaste'

Plants are looking very nice today! Can see the difference the co2 has made already! Gonna wait till wed. To post pics soi can give the bloombastic i fed yesterday a couple days to do something. Cant wait to see how good they look by then! Stay tuned!

Thanks,
X

In regards to the light and co2, it certainly is a valid point that you need to have other climate conditions in check to get the maximum out of your co2 inputs but keep in mind that watts per sq.ft. is a very general guideline. In the end,its all about PAR. But since nobody has a par meter, you have to look at lux. If you have your lights close to the plants (don't freaking burn them because the leaves can not recover) and your temps are in the upper 80's or low 90's, your going to have conditions suitable for increased metabolism and the utilization of co2. The size of your room has absolutely nothing to do with it, hell I would say the smaller the space the more important co2 is to max out yield. co2 can work wonders, my first round of veg looked like freaking lettuce they were so compact. I'm talking 1" internode spacing or less.

I read, and posted about reducing co2 concentrations in the last week. I did it this cycle and the buds certainly didn't shrivel up to nothing that is for damn sure. Its really that week 2-6 that you want to dose them heavy. Lastly, make sure you have plenty of fans blowing on your plants so you have good gas exchange at the leaf surface. You need to replenish the amount of co2 within the boundary layer of the leaf.

legallyflying said:

In regards to the light and co2, it certainly is a valid point that you need to have other climate conditions in check to get the maximum out of your co2 inputs but keep in mind that watts per sq.ft. is a very general guideline. In the end,its all about PAR. But since nobody has a par meter, you have to look at lux. If you have your lights close to the plants (don't freaking burn them because the leaves can not recover) and your temps are in the upper 80's or low 90's, your going to have conditions suitable for increased metabolism and the utilization of co2. The size of your room has absolutely nothing to do with it, hell I would say the smaller the space the more important co2 is to max out yield. co2 can work wonders, my first round of veg looked like freaking lettuce they were so compact. I'm talking 1" internode spacing or less.

I read, and posted about reducing co2 concentrations in the last week. I did it this cycle and the buds certainly didn't shrivel up to nothing that is for damn sure. Its really that week 2-6 that you want to dose them heavy. Lastly, make sure you have plenty of fans blowing on your plants so you have good gas exchange at the leaf surface. You need to replenish the amount of co2 within the boundary layer of the leaf.

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Great tips, I do plan on reducing my CO2 usage in week 8-9 as LSD is supposedly 60-65 days but I heard it runs long, so gonna run 1200 until at least week 8, then drop to maybe 900 for week 8 and then like 700 or something until they finish, however long.. Sound okay?

I added my additional Vornado tabletop fan pointed almost straight up today, just tilted just a hair towards the plants and not entirely straight up and down.....budlettes have grown a lot in the last 3 days! Pics tomorrow!

so I now have 3 fans in my 4' W x 8'L (estimate --at the max) area....

1) 1- tiny vornado outside the tarp (in veg chamber pointed into flower thru the zipper), blowing thru middle of the stalks..about mid-height of the plants...
2) 1- Large tabletop vornado on the ground in flower pointed nearly straight up to help with CO2 sinkage and re-dispersal..doesn't hit much plant, more for room/CO2 re-circulation..
3) 1- 16" EcoPlus Supreme Oscillating Fan mounted on the wall (disperses my CO2) for general room circulation, hits tops of the canopy..

In a 4'W X 8'L (at most) area....as measured by my Sentinel CHHC-4 over the last 36 hours..with those 3 fans, temps measured at 77F min/85F max, rH @ 35%min/45%max, and CO2 @ 1200ppm now..as measured at the canopy by the Sentinel CHHC-4 probe.

All under 3-400w Hortilux Super HPS lamps in Cool Sun 6" Air cooled hoods..(1200 watts flowering total)

Do you all think that will prevent mold, budrot? I'm worried now since your room had slight rot LegallyFlying.. Please ease my worries and let me know if you think those conditions will be adequate to prevent any flower problems!!! The room has a breeze in it, but its not like a friggin "windtunnel" or anything...seems comfortable for me to stand in..just slightly warm at these temps..

Thanks EVERYONE!

X

Been reading this thread for a few days now. Looks pretty good..in the future you may want to swap those 400s out for 600s. More suitable for your room imo. The last 2-3 weeks of flower you can drop your humidity even more to prevent any rot/mold troubles. I used to run last 3 weeks at 15-20% and never had issues.

Dradden said:

Been reading this thread for a few days now. Looks pretty good..in the future you may want to swap those 400s out for 600s. More suitable for your room imo. The last 2-3 weeks of flower you can drop your humidity even more to prevent any rot/mold troubles. I used to run last 3 weeks at 15-20% and never had issues.

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Theres a story behind that! My original design called for all 600s but the local shop guy who was helping guide my design at the time said to go 1000s or 400s only because 600 is a non standard wattage. Everything about them electrically and lamp wise is totally non standard and different. He said look around at greenhouses. They all run 400s or 1000s. No one runs 600s. So.... I agreed. We decided 1000s would be too much and could produce too much heat in my small room so he suggested multple 400s. Which i went with. I probably should have just done two 1000s in flower and let the mini split handle it but i didnt. Live and learn. At this point not wanting to buy all new ballasts and bulbs so gonna stick with what ive got. May add some supplemental side flouros or leds in the future tho. We shall see....

Thats interesting about the last 3 weeks humidity. Seems crqzy low but LF informed me low humidity helps to increase potency so makes sense i suppose.... Anyone else thoughts on low rH last 3 weeks? Would certainly crush any chance of mold/rot

Welcome aboard Dradden. I think youll be pleased with these new pics im gonna drop,

Oh ya and if any ballast ever dies you can bet your ass ill be buying a brand new Quantum 1000w digital ballast and using it in flower to replace the dead lumatek. Kinda wished id gone with 2 - 1000w quantums with adjust a wing with super spreaders and Hortilux dual arc lamps in flower. That way dual arcs plus uv-b enhancements from the adjust a wings lack of glass == more thc!

adding more 400's would be better imhho...also look into ceramic metal halide

Namaste'

Illumination said:

adding more 400's would be better imhho...also look into ceramic metal halide

Namaste'

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If I ever get to go big I'd go two 400W CMH's over a 1000W or even three 400W. I'm that impressed with the CMH. Looking forward to the pics.
Daniels

Hey man, if u have decent fan circulation you shouldn't have any problems with bud rot below 50% humidity. Ideally I would keep my rh 35% in flower but I can't always accomplish that with my current setup. Best of luck

UPDATE! Day 25 of Flowering, Day 85 Total....

Hi Everyone!

So today is day 25 of flowering for my LSDs and sole Jock Horror Auto...the plants as a whole are looking goood...though I have seen brown spotchy spots on the top leaves of a couple of them...thinking maybe a slight case of nute burn..you can see it in a couple of the pics on the leaves if you look close. Shouldn't be cal-mag def as I give 1 tsp Botanicare Cal-Mag+ to every gallon of RO water I make...along with the other goodies..thinking maybe slight burn..what you think? They look TREMENDOUSLY better than they did a mere 6 days ago ..CO2 makes a huge diff! ENJOY THE PICS!

Misc. LSD Plant Shots...various LSD plants..




Misc Group Shots...




Pic of my Vornado floor fan used to re-circulate the CO2 off the floor...




Jock Horror Shot...



COMMENTS, THOUGHTS, IDEAS??

THANKS RIU!!!

Looking great. Your climate is ideal and is definitely something others should aspire to. Sounds like plenty of fans. Maybe one more oscillator. Hard to say from here, I like all my leaves to rustle. If there are any that are stagnant....

Definitely looks like nute burn in some of those pics, tha6t one plant in picture 5 is hating it for sure. Dial back the ppm dude. Maybe 200 or so. Shouldn't ever really need more than 5ml/gallon of calmag. Too much cal mag can fucker things up. Mag doesn't play nice with phos, they can lock each other out. Mag deficiency would show up as spots.

Keep it up dude!

Looks good. Gonna be full soon.