do these plants look ok? few concerns

jaiismokesalot said:

The yellowing could be due to a bit to much nitrogen
WRONG
I'd flush your system take the plants out and sit them in a 50/50 mix of water and hydrogen pro oxide
WRONG
remix your water for your hydro with a bit of hydrogen pro oxide as well.
How MUCH H202 and at WHAT concentration? Also applies to above statement.
Mine are 2 weeks and are super healthy and I don't even have a ph tester .
Hydro without a PH Tester = Failure. AN PH perfect-STILL a gamble without a meter.
They are already 5 to 6 ". Chalk it up to luck. Problems are around the corner.

Click to expand...

Just saying...
It's great to offer advice if you know what you're doing, but if he would have followed all your advice he could have killed kis plants QUICK.

You need an RO system. No ifs and buts about it. Also,,of your on a well and you have a water softener system that is a no no as well. It adds to much salts or something, can't remember right now.

No water softner but am having an increase in problems yellow has continued with the top leaves.. stillghave green veins but now leaves are shrinking as well i should also state i have had 3 clones in system that all look great.. just seedlings having problems.. cleaned out system been 2 days now re-fillex with mostly spring water and some tap ppm of spring water was 267 overall after tap around 300 boostend up to 625 with nutes calmag/ pure pro grow so 325 ppm of nutes dunno whats going wrong here. will re post pictures soon any ideas??

@ Tavisdude ph shouldent b an issue i chrck it regular and keep it in 5-6 range

one of the clones a few pics so you can see difference



any ideas of whats going on here?
also if this was a lockout due to tap water (high calcium) wouldent i have been having problems from the get go? i can post pictures of start they all looked great and i was using tap water the whole time untill two days ago
i agree from what i read seems to be due to mag.. not positive this is why im posting and asking questions. but it would seem to me that i would of had problems the whole time of grow if thiws was due to tap water and lockout issues again i check the ph and keep it inbetween 5-6 i dunno just thought i would ask get an opinion my ppm is 325 of nutes i could prolly add more calmag.. overall im at like 625 any opinions on this idea? worth trying am i just screwed here?

You NEED to be using RO water. Not RO mixed with tap to save a few bucks. Any of the gallon sidtilled water you buy from walmart will be under 10 ppm. Then you can actually add the right amount of nutrients. I still think 625 without knowing what's in your water is pretty damn hight for a plant that size. If you've got a lot of calcium in your water, and you're adding calmag on top of it with a mag lockout due to calcium you see how it can get screwy. You need to be starting with RO/Distilled water. It's like 5 bucks for 5 gallons. You don't want the spring drinking water shit because they add minerals and salts to it for taste which is bad for your plant.
Looks like your plants are getting bad quick. I'd get some epsom salt(magnesium sulfate), mix a teaspoon in a gallon of water and use it as a foliar spray. I keep some on hand, but I've learned that the best way to treat calmag problems is to not let them happen in the first place. The problem won't always show up right away. In fact, Magnesium problems generally take a while to show up(sometimes not until flower) but when they do they can be more of a bitch to correct. That will buy you some time to figure this out.
You've also got some burnt tips which definitely looks to be nute burn...

I would Flush for a day(run pure PH'd RO water and nothing else), refill with store bought RO water, Cal-Mag and proper ratio's of nutrients and wouldn't go any higher than 300 ppm for a day or two and see if anything gets worse. That will give them plenty enough nutes to live and heal without making shit worse until you figure out what happened. Don't expect your plants to just bounce back and start growing right away either, they've taken the beat pretty good and it might take a few days. It's very possible that they have just been overfed at some point, and they are experiencing lockout. If that's the case then theres nothing you can add to it to fix it. You've just got to flush, and try to draw out the nutrients from the plant that are causing lockout before the plant will be able to uptake all the shit they need in the right quantity and balance.
Also, try not to disproportionately feed the plants calmag. Keep the ratios right in line with the rest of your nutrients.

I really hope you get it sorted quick Man.
Peace.
Tav.

yeah, I wold foliar feed them for now until you get your water figured out. They definitely want nutrients that is for sure. Things that tell me that are the color (obviously, the upcurled leaves,and also the necrotic portions of the leaf). So lets look at things.. you have a number of different deficiencies going on at once. nitrogen and mag being two of them. So this tells me that the plants are having a hard time uptaking nutrients or the solution is too weak.

When this happens I look at PH.. this just happened in my cloning early veg set up. Plants looked like shit.. 4.3 ph...no fucking wonder. Anyways, you say PH is in check, so the nutrients are available. So lets look at the roots. Are there many out? are the white or very light brown.. seem firm if you touch them?.. if yes, then it is not the roots.

So... it has to be either too low of nute concentration or some kind of salt or excess nutrient lock up. Given the very high concentration of salts in your water, I would bet that has something to do with it. Those plants are really small to need more than 300ppm of available nutrients.

I would give them all a good foliar. Add a drop of dish soap or dr. bronners if you have it as a surfactant. spray top and bottom of the leaves.

Then get some decent water, mix fresh nutes and start with a PH of around 5.5 and let it drift to like 6.2 or 6.3 over the course of the week. If that doesn't fix it, the plants are fucked and the have been so stressed and beat up, its not worth it to try and save them unless you have no other source of clones I would ditch them and start over.

Ya thinking i may be beat here changed water with the spring water was gunna pick up somedistilled but due 2 this hurricane theirs nun in stock anywhere.. i just dont get how they were fine with tap water bfr first 2/3 weeks good green leaves and such then all of a sudden shit hit fan thinking it was calmag i added like u said tap could of allready had high ammounts I'm gunna change again hopefully tomorrow if i can find distilled water was able to drop over all ppm 2 500 added more drinking water poland springs i had in fridge i know not the best thing 2 add but with a ppm of 234 its better than the 400 of my tap

Would rainwater b ok? I havent collected any but with the way its pouring i could fast? Anyone have opinions on this?

pics of roots r in first post

also would a britta water filter b sufficent on my well water 4 this application? I r

Was able 2 find 5 gallons of distilled!! Not enough 2 cover pump though any thoughts on rain water i c a guy on utube using it but would like some more opinions

I have enough crap 2 make a small bubble dwc tub would this b wise i could use the 5 gallons 4 that should b enough.. if i did this though sjould i just foilar feed 4 a day or 2 then add nutes with new water after initial day or 2 flush?


thanks 4 ur guys time youve been quick in response and informative i appreciate everything yall have done so far

So this is what happened to my setup! My base water fluctuates but is around the 250 mark out of tap. After reading many conflicting recommendations I started out with adding my nutes using the base as a the starting point. If I wanted 500 I would add till I got to 750 and all seemed great for a few weeks then all hell broke loose, discolored leaves and curling like a rams horn. Now I mix adding the base to the final number and all is good. In saying that try to keep your nutes on the lower end of the recommended limits as it is easier to fix issues that way. Also not sure about rain water where you are but PH real high here due to big smoke stacks in the states blowing up here....lol. You need to get water test no matter what you do to find out whats in water. And yes RO filter is a great investment but water test is still required to see what system is needed. Good luck and dont get to dicouraged, once dialed in its easy as growing grass lol. Also I found that I have to change res's every 2 weeks even if things seem good, there not and it will show by the next week in the stunted growth.

ya i changed everything out drained and rinsed res. re-filled with distilled water. after that i sprayed with 1tbs/per gallon epsom salt. gunna wait c if they look worse tomorrow (hopefully not) but if all looks good after 2 days and they are still alive ill add nutes back to res in the mean time ill prolly spray again tomorrow when i wake up and bfr i go to bed with mix.. hope this will pan out if not i guess its time to start over.. my clones all still look decent new growth and its green one had a few burnt tips due to that brief exposure to high almost 700 ppm but hope this works !! would suck to loose the rest.. 

Actually I have been running around 750 throughout the grow and no issues, when I let it rise before refill it got to 900 and then yes had some issues. I know that is high but seems to work with the strain I'm currently runningl. They are 12/12 now so in a week I'll bump it a bit after refill.

waterdawg said:

Actually I have been running around 750 throughout the grow and no issues, when I let it rise before refill it got to 900 and then yes had some issues. I know that is high but seems to work with the strain I'm currently runningl. They are 12/12 now so in a week I'll bump it a bit after refill.

Click to expand...

Dude, that's too high. When you notice that you aree burning your plants, you are in fact REALLY burning them. Its not a difference of 150-200 PPM between burning and not burning.. its more like 300-400. If you flip now, AND increase your nutes, the increase transpiration is going to really burn them. Beginner growers always due this, they try to to the line between the most nutrients possible and burning the plants. The line you ACTUALLY want to be toeing is between too little nutrients and just enough. You will get better growth rates and higher quality flowers when your not trying to shove nutrients down their throat. I plant DOES NOT increase its uptake of nutrients in response to an increase in the availability of nutrients above what they need to continue chemical reactions based on life cycle time.

I don't know what your volume of nutrient solution is or how big your plants are, but I am willing to bet that your observed raise in nutrient PPM is too high given those two factors. This is because your plant is using more water than it is nutrients. Thus the volume of water goes down and there is less of a reduction in nutrient strength. I would also suspect that your PH is relatively steady, also a sign of over feeding.

Anyways, just food for though dude.

legallyflying said:

Dude, that's too high. When you notice that you aree burning your plants, you are in fact REALLY burning them. Its not a difference of 150-200 PPM between burning and not burning.. its more like 300-400. If you flip now, AND increase your nutes, the increase transpiration is going to really burn them. Beginner growers always due this, they try to to the line between the most nutrients possible and burning the plants. The line you ACTUALLY want to be toeing is between too little nutrients and just enough. You will get better growth rates and higher quality flowers when your not trying to shove nutrients down their throat. I plant DOES NOT increase its uptake of nutrients in response to an increase in the availability of nutrients above what they need to continue chemical reactions based on life cycle time.

I don't know what your volume of nutrient solution is or how big your plants are, but I am willing to bet that your observed raise in nutrient PPM is too high given those two factors. This is because your plant is using more water than it is nutrients. Thus the volume of water goes down and there is less of a reduction in nutrient strength. I would also suspect that your PH is relatively steady, also a sign of over feeding.

Anyways, just food for though dude.

Click to expand...

dam couldnt have said it any better myself, you want to balance out your nute strength to tailor your plants needs (less is more), you want the strength of nutes to stay about the same as water level drops, i have 12 in veg now for almost 6 weeks and they are only taking 750 at this point and as you can see they are doing great. leagally is right you want to border the less to perfect mark and your plants will thank you immensely.

Dude, that's too high. When you notice that you aree burning your plants, you are in fact REALLY burning them. Its not a difference of 150-200 PPM between burning and not burning.. its more like 300-400.

Click to expand...

Actually I have found that it is perfect given my base is so high. As I said find out what your plants need, as my water goes down my nutes go down but salt goes up. PH does go up a bit but they seem happy so I'm not going to screw with it at this point. I cant seem to post pics to this thread so I'll try again in a bit and show how they look, dont look burnt!

These were turned to 12/12 on the 12th october when pic was taken and this was taken about 4 days ago . The only issue I had was letting them veg for 3.5 weeks and now I 've ran out of hieght. I really dont think there is a hard and fast rule as to where to keep nute levels within reason. These girls like it high and I have another tray growing that seems to like it around the 500 range. And again I have read that the optimum levels are anywhere from 200 to 1500 on this and other sites so who's right??? And again I am new to this so all these conflicting suggestions are really confusing.

And yes your are right I did start high and worked down to get it stabilized somewhat...lol.

Actually guys you may want to look at general hydrophonics's charts re: TDS levels and you'll find that they are a little higher than what you recommend. All I'm saying is IMO it is best to find what works for your strain and setup. BTW the girls in the pic are White Russian.