Auto White Widow and Autopilot XXL

DarkLordMelkor · Apr 24, 2022

Hey. New grower here. I am still trying to fix heat issues in my grow tent. I decided to share pics of my whole grow. I hope i can make some good weed

Light: 1000w HPS
Light Schedule: 20/4
Nutrients: Advanced Nutrients Grow, Micro, Bloom (feeding schedule same as chart)
Heat in tent: Max. 30C at hottest hours of day. 24C at night (when lights off)
Humidity: Between 40% to 60% lights on/off.
pH of water: 6.3

This is Autopilot XXL. Day 19 from breaking soil.

This is Auto White Widow #1, day 9 from breaking soil.

This is Auto White Widow #2, day 9 from breaking soil.

Autopilot XXL seems like little to me.
First white widow growing faster than second one. Second one looks like stopped growing but i don't know why. I treat both of them with same conditions. I hope she will be fine.

And this is Auto Blue Amnesia which is my first grow and first fail. She is pretty small for weed plant but she smells so strong

And this is Auto Cheese NL which is my first grow with Blue Amnesia. I failed with both of them. Pretty small. Not much smell.

Is it too early to start LST for Autopilot XXL? If so, when should i start?

So, any comments, suggestions, ideas are appreciated.

TrichDaddy · Apr 25, 2022

I wouldn't call those fails, mate. Apart from being small and lacking in smell, they look quite well grown for a new grower, especially under a hot 1000w hps.

How big is your tent and what's the ventilation setup look like? Best of luck for the grow.

VincenzioVonHook · Apr 25, 2022

tbh, it looks like you are not watering properly. Watering a paltry amount around the stem is only going to trap roots in one spot and create hydrophobic patches in Your medium. Roots don't chase dry medium, and need moisture to branch out.

This was taken day 20 (purple punch/Durban auto) as a reference to you 19 day old plant. In a 5 Gal pot (30cm diameter), and was watered to runoff day one. I then water to saturation every three or four days.

Exactly one week later

You really need to get the first three weeks down pat or autos will generally yield next to nothing if stunted from the get go. I see a lot of pics where the medium looks straight barren these days.

I was dealing with well above 30c temps in the tent for the first week or so, and there's was no issues with heat stress, so I'd say the issue is watering tbh.

DarkLordMelkor · Apr 25, 2022

VincenzioVonHook said:
tbh, it looks like you are not watering properly. Watering a paltry amount around the stem is only going to trap roots in one spot and create hydrophobic patches in Your medium. Roots don't chase dry medium, and need moisture to branch out.

This was taken day 20 (purple punch/Durban auto) as a reference to you 19 day old plant. In a 5 Gal pot (30cm diameter), and was watered to runoff day one. I then water to saturation every three or four days.
View attachment 5124023
Exactly one week later
View attachment 5124025

You really need to get the first three weeks down pat or autos will generally yield next to nothing if stunted from the get go. I see a lot of pics where the medium looks straight barren these days.

I was dealing with well above 30c temps in the tent for the first week or so, and there's was no issues with heat stress, so I'd say the issue is watering tbh.

could be. i am watering stem spot first and then around the stem. i just push my finger through soil and 10 cm away from stem and its wet.

do you guys watering your plants until you get water from bottom? if so, i gave 200 ml water to autopilot for last watering. but as said, 10 cm away and 10 cm deep from stem is very moist right now.

VincenzioVonHook · Apr 25, 2022

Yep, the whole medium needs to be moist. The idea is that the top will dry out, and the lower you go, the more moist the medium is. If you only water the top and around the stem , the roots aren't going to dig deep and chase the moisture at the bottom of the pot, they will just stay in the small area you water.

Best bet is to water once to saturation, and then water again when the top inch or two of the medium is dry.

I gave over a gallon to to the medium before the seed had even been put into the pot, and put roughly two or so through every three or four days which will give me 100ml or so of runoff.

200ml of water is a joke. .I put over 15 times that through the pot the day I planted the seed alone.

Here was the 20th or March. Saturated from head to toe.

20th of April.

This is pretty average growth for an auto, and I can guarantee the 200ml feed is the reason your hasn't taken off. It's probably dehydrated to the max and has a very underdeveloped root stock due to the small amounts of water around the stem.

Give it one good water, and then don't feed it for a while. As it dries from the top down, the roots will chase the moisture developing a decent root stock in the process.

DarkLordMelkor · Apr 25, 2022

VincenzioVonHook said:
Yep, the whole medium needs to be moist. The idea is that the top will dry out, and the lower you go, the more moist the medium is. If you only water the top and around the stem , the roots aren't going to dig deep and chase the moisture at the bottom of the pot, they will just stay in the small area you water.

Best bet is to water once to saturation, and then water again when the top inch or two of the medium is dry.

I gave over a gallon to to the medium before the seed had even been put into the pot, and put roughly two or so through every three or four days which will give me 100ml or so of runoff.

200ml of water is a joke. .I put over 15 times that through the pot the day I planted the seed alone.

Here was the 20th or March. Saturated from head to toe.
View attachment 5124030
20th of April.
View attachment 5124034
This is pretty average growth for an auto, and I can guarantee the 200ml feed is the reason your hasn't taken off. It's probably dehydrated to the max and has a very underdeveloped root stock due to the small amounts of water around the stem.

Give it one good water, and then don't feed it for a while. As it dries from the top down, the roots will chase the moisture developing a decent root stock in the process.

then thats my issue. underwatering. i will give water tomorrow slowly until water comes out from bottom of fabric pot.

should i use nutrients for that saturation?

arter saturation, i will check 2inch from top until its gets fully dry and then water again til water comes out. i think thats what you say.

i didnt know watering is that much complicated lol

VincenzioVonHook · Apr 25, 2022

DarkLordMelkor said:
then thats my issue. underwatering. i will give water tomorrow slowly until water comes out from bottom of fabric pot.

should i use nutrients for that saturation?

arter saturation, i will check 2inch from top until its gets fully dry and then water again til water comes out. i think thats what you say.

i didnt know watering is that much complicated lol

Watering is indeed a bit of a complicated one. Once you get it down pat though, its a walk in the park. The crux of the matter is that the roots will always travel towards the moisture, and when that moisture is all at the top of the medium you have a problem. Watering only small amounts at the top of the pot is also a recipe for hydrophobia further down the pot when you do decide to give it a good soak. If your medium is still moist at the top of the pot, you can always bottom water to even up the moisture content and the go back to top watering once the medium dries up.

When it comes to nutrients, it depends on the medium and what it already contains. I'm only feeding tap water as my medium has slow release organic nutrients mixed in.

Best bet is to water it to saturation and feel the weight of the pot. After a few days when the medium has dried up enough at the top, you feel the weight and compare. Gives you a general idea on when to water.

VincenzioVonHook · Apr 25, 2022

Don't feel discouraged or stupid either. You did a good job keeping the first run healthy as a newb. I struggled first time round and my first plant, albeit a good size, looked like ass by the seventh week of flower.

DarkLordMelkor · Apr 25, 2022

well. tonight is saturation time then. you are right. if medium or lower side of pot is dry then how roots gonna grow. but as i said i overwatered my two mature plants when they was young. droopy and yellowing leaves, stunned growth. so i am always afraid to overwater after that. but i will try your method now.

DarkLordMelkor · Apr 25, 2022

VincenzioVonHook said:
Don't feel discouraged or stupid either. You did a good job keeping the first run healthy as a newb. I struggled first time round and my first plant, albeit a good size, looked like ass by the seventh week of flower.

Okay. Saturated all plants. It took around 2,5 liters of water for each pot to water comes from bottom. Most water around stem to edges of pot. So i tried to give the water to each diameter equally. I gave nutrient solution to Autopilot XXL. Gave white widows only water at pH 6.3.

Now i will wait until 2 inch deep of top of soil gets dry and then i will water with nutes.

Lets see if there wil be any difference

thanks for help. i will keep sharing photos every few days.

DarkLordMelkor · Apr 26, 2022

Okay there is no overwatering signs. Looks like they liked it. Also saturating with nutrients didn't leave any overfeeding signs on autopilot. But looks like bit stressed of heat. One of her leaf curling up.

Autopilot XXL day 20:

White Widow #1 day 10 (i think she is going good. taller than autopilot and probably will be thicker than soon)

White Widow #2 day 10. she is smaller than her sister. also leaves was bit droopy after saturation but she is fine today.

VincenzioVonHook · Apr 26, 2022

good to hear. Hope it all works well. Autoflowers can be finicky if you don't get that first few weeks sorted. I was quite annoyed mine pre-flowered around day 18 or 19. Here's to hoping yours gives you a bit more time to beef up.

Over watering is usually caused by watering too often, not too much volume wise as the medium will drain excess regardless. It's usually excess frequency that does the damage.

DarkLordMelkor · Apr 26, 2022

I am checking them everyday. Saturating them really work well. I can see difference very well after 10 hours. It didn't disturbed them. I wish i were saturate white widows with nutes too.

Also heat issues going well for now. It's hitting 30C outside now but it's 28C in grow room with 45% RH. Yeah RH bit too low but humidifier running all day long. That's best i can do for now.

Even with wrong pH (8.3 for few weeks), overwatering, heat stressing and 10% humidity, my Blue Amnesia and Cheese NL pre flowered at day 28-30. I hope this ones will do same.

That's the difference in one day with White Widow #1. First pic day 9 and second pic day 10.

Day 9

Day 10

isn't it very obvious?

almost doubled.

Same with #2.

Day 9

Day 10

Also forgot to mention. This is 3 days old White Widow

everything going well for now. thanks for all support to all. especially @VincenzioVonHook you are hero!

DarkLordMelkor · Apr 28, 2022

Okay this is 3rd day after saturation. I put my finger inside the soil and it was a little moist like 3-4cm deep. So i watered again all around the pot. It took 2 liters to run off.

This is autopilot xxl day 22. Her leaves curling down from tips. Too much nitrogen?

This is W.W. #1 day 12. Also her leaves a bit curling down from tips.

This is W.W. #2 day 12. She is still too much smaller than her sister.

This is W.W. #3 day 5

Also moved light a bit higher. Now it's looks like that.

VincenzioVonHook · Apr 28, 2022

if your taking those photos straight after watering, there's a chance they might droop a bit for an hour or so, especially if they are relatively young. They don't look too bad to me though. Is there any direct wind? That can also cause clawing and so can under/over watering. Here's a few pics of nitro tox, its normally abrupt at the tip to begin with, followed by waxy/dark green appearance and then heavy downwards canoeing. .
Minor

Bad

Wind burn

Both overwatering and underwatering cause droop as well so it can be hard to decipher.

Id say just a minor issue with VPD/moisture and environment.

VincenzioVonHook · Apr 28, 2022

Im on the opposite end of the spectrum, N deficiency. First time going fully organic water only and it definitely shows. End of week five now (day 40) and yellowing quickly.

I just assumed I could get at least 8 weeks without re-amending, which made me realise how much I relied on salts previously.

DarkLordMelkor · Apr 28, 2022

Leaves curling up since yesterday night. I watered them hour ago. Just watered, took pics and post here.

Yes, there was direct wind with 8 inch fan on them but not on full speed. But still it was shaking plants. Now i raised it and they are not shaking anymore. It's 28C inside tent right now with 50% humidity.

Is light really still too close to plants? Should i move it higher?

DarkLordMelkor · Apr 28, 2022

Moved a bit higher light and fan. Now that's what my grow room looks like. In few hours i will connect my carbonfilter to exhaust fan. Blue Amnesia really smells

VincenzioVonHook · Apr 28, 2022

DarkLordMelkor said:
Leaves curling up since yesterday night. I watered them hour ago. Just watered, took pics and post here.

Yes, there was direct wind with 8 inch fan on them but not on full speed. But still it was shaking plants. Now i raised it and they are not shaking anymore. It's 28C inside tent right now with 50% humidity.

Is light really still too close to plants? Should i move it higher?

The fan should be circulating air around the tent, not directly at the plants. When it comes to light intensity, something like a uni-T UT383 lux Meter is cheap and is ore calibrated to 2700k, so close to HPS. Light stress usually started at around 75k lux, and for my autoflowers I run 50k lux 18/6.

This set me back about $25 and is very handy.

As long as your air temps at canopy level are adequate, and your plants aren't showing light stress or bleaching I wouldn't worry, but keep in mind early stage light stress causes dropping as well. This pic was taken (the one on the 17th) when I went from 150w at 18" to 300w at 24" and the plants were a bit unhappy for a few days, looked like over or under watering.

Notice the plant on the top left, wasn't liking the light intensity at that stage.

DarkLordMelkor · Apr 28, 2022

Wow really amazing plants. There is really not much source about light distance. I really did read many threads about 1000w HPS light distance but there was many answers between 30cm to 100cm. So that's why i kept it that much close. Now it's few cm higher.

I really owe you big thanks. I fed with my bad watering schedule my 9th week plants and have small girls. But watering them properly streching them now. Cheese NL is much bigger now.

And autopilot's stem is thicher than 9th week old plant.

Now i will try to LST with Autopilot

I hope i am not going to break it or something lol.

Auto White Widow and Autopilot XXL

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