Abolish private healthcare insurance

blu3bird · Nov 17, 2019

Aussieaceae said:
I couldn't really give a damn about someone else's finger to be honest. 9k for the bill though? Thats fucking outrageous, have to say.

Most immediate healthcare in Australia is covered by Medicare, and we don't pay a single dime for Medicare. We just sign the form and get a replacement membership card every few years. I've had the same membership since childhood and I don't think I've ever had to sign another form, besides change of address etc.
Here Medicare is considered a persons right to have and truthfully I couldn't imagine life without it.

Personally I think private health insurance should be here to stay, but not without public health cover staying as well. Public health cover given to you by the Government elected. Having quality, government controlled public healthcare is a fantastic thing and very healthy for the market.
It sets the bar in terms of quality care and coverage. Making private health insurance companies forced to compete by offering better services for the premiums paid.

Last time I had to go to hospital was for fucking up my ankle. I didn't pay for any of it and wasn't expected to. I did pay $20 for the crotches though. Because they were meant to be returned but people always kept them. That payment was not an obligation either, but they do ask.

The point I'm trying to make, is if I had no Government cover as a citizen, then I may well have been billed 9k for my ankle as well.

Being legally obligated to have Government cover is one thing and in my opinion is the right thing. But being forced to buy private healthcare or pay for the whole bill seems absurd to me.
Where's the social security?

It's not free though. Your Medicare is paid for with taxes (if you work and have taxable income). So if you don't work, someone who does paid taxes for that Medicare. It might have been "no cost to you" but it definitely wasn't free. Whether you work or not is none of my business and I don't care.

I'm not judging you, but it's absurd to me that you believe you shouldn't have any responsibility to provide your own healthcare or pay the medical bills you incur.

I guess I'm the exact opposite, I don't feel like anyone, especially the government is responsible to provide for me

Aussieaceae · Nov 17, 2019

blu3bird said:
It's not free though. Your Medicare is paid for with taxes (if you work and have taxable income). So if you don't work, someone who does paid taxes for that Medicare. It might have been "no cost to you" but it definitely wasn't free. Whether you work or not is none of my business and I don't care.

I'm not judging you, but it's absurd to me that you believe you shouldn't have any responsibility to provide your own healthcare or pay the medical bills you incur.

I guess I'm the exact opposite, I don't feel like anyone, especially the government is responsible to provide for me

That's exactly right, we do pay for it through taxes. Is that not fair?

Let's forget about you and me for a second. What about the ones who can't pay and / or don't work? Infants, elderly, injured, the sick etc etc.?
Shit happens all the time.
Why shouldn't they have cover and why shouldn't the government have a responsibility to cover them? Especially healthcare of all things and education is a very close #2.

I absolutely do have responsibility for my own healthcare. Through voting at election, working and paying taxes. Just so happens some of it goes towards everyone else's healthcare as well.

Seriously what is wrong with cover for all?

Obamacare was much the same principle as Australia, but was blocked by the Republicans countless times. Look at the hot mess it was when they were done with it and it's still a benefit to some.

I'm not judging either, but how much tax dollars go towards the military budget every year? Surely "some" of that massive budget could towards something more meaningful for every citizen?

hanimmal · Nov 17, 2019

ChiefRunningPhist said:
Really? Not sure if you're being sarcastic there lol.

Just because you contribute to the economy doesn't mean you deserve a subsidy. Garunteed if yacht subsidies were dropped you'd see ~0 impact in the much needed yacht market lol (sarcastic) also, not much employment there either, not much impact on GDP, or really anything I wouldn't think.

If employing yacht workers is subsidy worthy? What does that mean for other small businesses?

I understand subsidies to be intended for things that we as a collective find necessay for the well being of the people or country.

I could see something about a nations need to have a thriving boat industry being important to have. But do disagree with them using this excuse as a way to give the wealthy yet another luxury tax break.

Aussieaceae said:
That's exactly right, we do pay for it through taxes. Is that not fair?

Let's forget about you and me for a second. What about the ones who can't pay and / or don't work? Infants, elderly, injured, the sick etc etc.?
Shit happens all the time.
Why shouldn't they have cover and why shouldn't the government have a responsibility to cover them? Especially healthcare of all things and education is a very close #2.

I absolutely do have responsibility for my own healthcare. Through voting at election, working and paying taxes. Just so happens some of it goes towards everyone else's healthcare as well.

Seriously what is wrong with cover for all?

Obamacare was much the same principle as Australia, but was blocked by the Republicans countless times. Look at the hot mess it was when they were done with it and it's still a benefit to some.

I'm not judging either, but how much tax dollars go towards the military budget every year? Surely "some" of that massive budget could towards something more meaningful for every citizen?

I think most people would actually like to have universal healthcare, but a big road block is a lot of unions and employers have used their ability to provide healthcare as a way to offset income increases for the employees and they do not trust the government to set it up well enough that they don't lose out on what they have been negotiating for a long time. Couple that with Republicans demonizing any program not aimed at helping Wealthy White Heterosexual Males as socialism it will be actively used to oust Democrats.

And when that happens we don't have another Jon McCain in the Republican party to step up and save our healthcare a second time.

Budley Doright · Nov 17, 2019

blu3bird said:
I'm going to be an owner operator sooner or later. I sure as hell am not going to hire/contract someone to drive my truck for me. First, I'm not a candy ass that's afraid of work. Second, I don't want someone in my truck that I've paid a lot of money for that doesn't care if they beat the shit out of it because they didn't pay for it.

Hey @PJ Diaz, why are you scared of work? Does it have anything to do with being a Bernie supporter?

So your not successful either. If you don’t hire someone it seems your an unsuccessful failure in the assholes world of success. I know he’s a success because he’s mentioned it over and over again. I’m enjoying watching him flail about trying to justify his assholish statements. Thank god the line of fools just keeps coming as others finally leave.......boy I miss tty lol

Budley Doright · Nov 17, 2019

blu3bird said:
It's not free though. Your Medicare is paid for with taxes (if you work and have taxable income). So if you don't work, someone who does paid taxes for that Medicare. It might have been "no cost to you" but it definitely wasn't free. Whether you work or not is none of my business and I don't care.

I'm not judging you, but it's absurd to me that you believe you shouldn't have any responsibility to provide your own healthcare or pay the medical bills you incur.

I guess I'm the exact opposite, I don't feel like anyone, especially the government is responsible to provide for me

Just throwing this out there but let’s just say ......... you show up at work, oh my, the gates locked and there’s a notice on the gate that their in receivership. Now your out of work, no problem you say, you’ll get a job quickly. New employer hires you but new benefits have a 30- 180 day wait period. Kids, wife (god forbid) gets sick, real fucking sick, now you have no insurance, need to stay home with kids, no work............. see where this is headed? Not a pretty picture. And yup I saw it happen to a friend of mine in the states ......... tragic.

hanimmal · Nov 17, 2019

Budley Doright said:
Just throwing this out there but let’s just say ......... you show up at work, oh my, the gates locked and there’s a notice on the gate that their in receivership. Now your out of work, no problem you say, you’ll get a job quickly. New employer hires you but new benefits have a 30- 180 day wait period. Kids, wife (god forbid) gets sick, real fucking sick, now you have no insurance, need to stay home with kids, no work............. see where this is headed? Not a pretty picture. And yup I saw it happen to a friend of mine in the states ......... tragic.

It happens a lot, and is totally a reason Obamacare tried to stop it by having emergency sign up periods for displaced workers. That coupled with the Federal law that your employer must allow you to keep your insurance for up to 18 months after you are canned.

Budley Doright · Nov 17, 2019

hanimmal said:
It happens a lot, and is totally a reason Obamacare tried to stop it by having emergency sign up periods for displaced workers. That coupled with the Federal law that your employer must allow you to keep your insurance for up to 18 months after you are canned.

But does the 18 months apply when the company goes into receivership? I’m thinking with my buddy it happened much faster than that, and it was a few years ago. He lost his wife and he went blind, it was really a horror.

hanimmal · Nov 17, 2019

Budley Doright said:
But does the 18 months apply when the company goes into receivership? I’m thinking with my buddy it happened much faster than that, and it was a few years ago. He lost his wife and he went blind, it was really a horror.

It would allow them to sign up right away, but in a situation like that I know I would likely just take the gamble and go without spending that money if I could too. It sucks, sorry to hear about your friend. I personally would love universal coverage, but also accept reality of us getting it in this 4 years with what is at stake with Trump. Let the Democrats lay out all the Trump/Russia trolling mess to the nation, getting the positions around the government filled up with qualified people, fixing our Alliances after the trade wars, and all that without going to war with Russia/NorthKorea/Iran/Syria... And hopefully fix DACA because I don't think they will be able to fix the immigration crisis without losing the senate/house unfortunately.

Then 4 years later, let Biden retire and then have the big Democratic issues that desperately need big solutions like environmental issues, gun legislation (maybe do what Harris wanted and executive order AR15 banning new sales and mail order from out of country purchases). But who knows, what will happen will happen.

Sorry for tangent, not sure how I got on it.

Budley Doright · Nov 17, 2019

hanimmal said:
I could see something about a nations need to have a thriving boat industry being important to have. But do disagree with them using this excuse as a way to give the wealthy yet another luxury tax break.

I think most people would actually like to have universal healthcare, but a big road block is a lot of unions and employers have used their ability to provide healthcare as a way to offset income increases for the employees and they do not trust the government to set it up well enough that they don't lose out on what they have been negotiating for a long time. Couple that with Republicans demonizing any program not aimed at helping Wealthy White Heterosexual Males as socialism it will be actively used to oust Democrats.

And when that happens we don't have another Jon McCain in the Republican party to step up and save our healthcare a second time.

I did a (little) bit of reading and from what I gather it’s a state thing re sales tax limits to entice people to choose say New York over Florida to purchase the boat. I think State sales tax should be kept the same (no limits) on higher end as small items. Perhaps even an added luxury tax given the resources used to build maintain larger items. It gets way more complicated than my brain to figure out lol.

Budley Doright · Nov 17, 2019

hanimmal said:
It would allow them to sign up right away, but in a situation like that I know I would likely just take the gamble and go without spending that money if I could too. It sucks, sorry to hear about your friend. I personally would love universal coverage, but also accept reality of us getting it in this 4 years with what is at stake with Trump. Let the Democrats lay out all the Trump/Russia trolling mess to the nation, getting the positions around the government filled up with qualified people, fixing our Alliances after the trade wars, and all that without going to war with Russia/NorthKorea/Iran/Syria... And hopefully fix DACA because I don't think they will be able to fix the immigration crisis without losing the senate/house unfortunately.

Then 4 years later, let Biden retire and then have the big Democratic issues that desperately need big solutions like environmental issues, gun legislation (maybe do what Harris wanted and executive order AR15 banning new sales and mail order from out of country purchases). But who knows, what will happen will happen.

Sorry for tangent, not sure how I got on it.

I agree that you guys are going to be divided on this for many years to come......So your talking about signing up for no wait time private insurance? And I appolagize as I know nothing about how your system works, it is filled with horror stories though. But in my scenario your not working because you have to now be with the kids while mom’s not available. Also your last paycheque is not there, it’s behind the closed gate

. I’m really just saying that yes it’s fine when everything is running smooth but with out universal health insurance shit could go bad pretty quick.

hanimmal · Nov 17, 2019

Absolutely it is such a devastating thing when people get sick here until really Obamacare stopped the insurance companies from being able to just dump people who get sick. It was actually how Elizibeth Warren got her start in politics, she was a great voice back when this was really hammering people into bankruptcy.

And yes, now you can immediately sign up for coverage, but idk if they would be able to get it for free, so a lot of people would just not get it and hope they don't get sick, which is how it was here forever. When it gets really bad, the emergency rooms will take you in and treat you for everything, but the bill will bankrupt people generally. It is pretty shitty setup and needs to be fixed. But naming all the things that desperately need to get done turns into a REM song.

hanimmal · Nov 17, 2019

hanimmal said:
Absolutely it is such a devastating thing when people get sick here until really Obamacare stopped the insurance companies from being able to just dump people who get sick. It was actually how Elizibeth Warren got her start in politics, she was a great voice back when this was really hammering people into bankruptcy.

And yes, now you can immediately sign up for coverage, but idk if they would be able to get it for free, so a lot of people would just not get it and hope they don't get sick, which is how it was here forever. When it gets really bad, the emergency rooms will take you in and treat you for everything, but the bill will bankrupt people generally. It is pretty shitty setup and needs to be fixed. But naming all the things that desperately need to get done turns into a REM song.

Like an idiot I used the wrong video, it was bothering me and I had to find the right one.........

UncleBuck · Nov 17, 2019

PJ Diaz said:
I don't do independent contractor gigs as a laborer.

You don’t do independent contractor gigs in any form you fraud

you don’t even know how fica or workman’s comp work

knucklehead bob · Nov 17, 2019

I bet he knows how to keep his dick skinners out of the line of fire from a nail gun . . . . . :bigjoint:

Budley Doright · Nov 17, 2019

knucklehead bob said:
I bet he knows how to keep his dick skinners out of the line of fire from a nail gun . . . . .

Shit happens, I slipped and screwed a sheet metal screw in my finger and had to reverse the drill and unscrew it

.

UncleBuck · Nov 17, 2019

knucklehead bob said:
I bet he knows how to keep his dick skinners out of the line of fire from a nail gun . . . . .

I’m not sure we’d keep getting million dollar contracts from the top two architecture firms in boulder county if we sucked so bad at it but maybe this dim bulb racist knows something the rest of us don’t

UncleBuck · Nov 17, 2019

Budley Doright said:
Shit happens, I slipped and screwed a sheet metal screw in my finger and had to reverse the drill and unscrew it .

I was setting up drip irrigation this spring, drilling 1/16th holes into 1/2” pvc when the bit slipped over the pvc and into my finger behind it, which was stabilizing the pipe as I drilled

thing went straight through my finger. Had to reverse it too. Luckily it only caught tissue

seems like a bunch of soft handed know nothings who’ve never worked a day in their lives know the trades better than tradesmen do

DIY-HP-LED · Nov 17, 2019

UncleBuck said:
I was setting up drip irrigation this spring, drilling 1/16th holes into 1/2” pvc when the bit slipped over the pvc and into my finger behind it, which was stabilizing the pipe as I drilled

thing went straight through my finger. Had to reverse it too. Luckily it only caught tissue

seems like a bunch of soft handed know nothings who’ve never worked a day in their lives know the trades better than tradesmen do

I worked as a skilled tradesman for many years and have the scars to prove it, though over a decade in the office got rid of the calluses. Sometimes when I was stuck behind my desk sitting on my ass I used to wish I was still out on the shop floor moving my ass! When ya do physical stuff ya get hurt, so do athletes, the only man who does not make a mistake is a man who does nothing. When ya use power tools for a living mistakes often hurt and not just your mistakes either!

Budley Doright · Nov 17, 2019

DIY-HP-LED said:
I worked as a skilled tradesman for many years and have the scars to prove it, though over a decade in the office got rid of the calluses. Sometimes when I was stuck behind my desk sitting on my ass I used to wish I was still out on the shop floor moving my ass! When ya do physical stuff ya get hurt, so do athletes, the only man who does not make a mistake is a man who does nothing. When ya use power tools for a living mistakes often hurt and not just your mistakes either!

Working on the railroad I’m amazed you still have all your digits lol.

Budley Doright · Nov 17, 2019

UncleBuck said:
I was setting up drip irrigation this spring, drilling 1/16th holes into 1/2” pvc when the bit slipped over the pvc and into my finger behind it, which was stabilizing the pipe as I drilled

thing went straight through my finger. Had to reverse it too. Luckily it only caught tissue

seems like a bunch of soft handed know nothings who’ve never worked a day in their lives know the trades better than tradesmen do

I’ve been to emerg a few times in my working career, working around the farm is an accident waiting to happen lol.

Abolish private healthcare insurance

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