10.0 Uvb Light
- Thread starter weedyoo
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BloodShot420
Well-Known Member
yeah - you can run it for 12... it shouldnt hurt - just keep an eye on them.
murtymaker
Well-Known Member
Wait soooooo, should I get the cfl looking 10.0 bulb or the long flouro style ones? or both? I plan on hanging them next to my 1000w hps draping over the side of the reflector
weedyoo
Well-Known Member
its all up to what you want to get but this is the one i use its easy to move aroundhttp://www.petdiscounters.com/Repti-Glo-100-UVB-Compact-Fluorescent-Bulb-26-Watt-p8334.html
Topfuel is the information in this thread;
So just put in a massive wattage and effiency bulb right? Wrong. UVB is very directional. If the theory holds up, it should be a lot better for your plants if you buy a couple of lower wattage lamps and spread them out. Otherwise, the top buds will absorb loads and anything undereathe will get zero.
I've been wondering about CFL versus strips myselfs and I think strips win, because they spread the light better. CFL's (with reflectors) will tend to produce a cone shaped light pattern, which is only good if you have one over every plant.
It's not only the light power you have to think about - all reptile lights put out a decent amount of UVB, get a reasonably high power one and put two foot over your grow and you have sun+ UVB. Out in the wild, cannabis might grow in individual bushes and it has all the soil it can want at it's roots, so it'll grow taller than us and really bushy - letting the UV hit it all over. Indoor grows, we tend to use smaller pots and keep it short and dense. That prevents the light getting deep inside the foilage, and so the buds won't be getting exposed - you need to move the light or plant around. I seriously doubt the UVB will make it through a single layer of leaves.
I think by far the best idea is to drop some vertical strips through the grow, or cfl's without reflectprs amd sure the plants are turned all the time. That way, each bud will be getting bombed with UVB. You can pull the ballast and bulb connectors out a normal fluoro fitting, then hook the light up minus the metal casing so there's nothing to create a shadow.
Light movers are good, but it'll still be mainly the canopy that's getting the UVB. The UVB won't go through the leaves. Where ever there's a leaf, the UVB will be getting destroyed and it won't go through to lower leaves / buds.
What he's saying is that a 20w 10.0 UVB bulb will emit about 16x more UVB than the sun. The only difference is, the UVB emitted from the sun is measured at human height (hundreds of millions of miles from the sun) - whereas the UVB emitted from the bulb is measured quite close to it. As you get further away, the intensity drops off quite quickly. You should have about sun intensity on your canopy if you use this kind of bulb on the top of your tent - around your HID, probabaly a bit higher.
So just put in a massive wattage and effiency bulb right? Wrong. UVB is very directional. If the theory holds up, it should be a lot better for your plants if you buy a couple of lower wattage lamps and spread them out. Otherwise, the top buds will absorb loads and anything undereathe will get zero.
I've been wondering about CFL versus strips myselfs and I think strips win, because they spread the light better. CFL's (with reflectors) will tend to produce a cone shaped light pattern, which is only good if you have one over every plant.
It's not only the light power you have to think about - all reptile lights put out a decent amount of UVB, get a reasonably high power one and put two foot over your grow and you have sun+ UVB. Out in the wild, cannabis might grow in individual bushes and it has all the soil it can want at it's roots, so it'll grow taller than us and really bushy - letting the UV hit it all over. Indoor grows, we tend to use smaller pots and keep it short and dense. That prevents the light getting deep inside the foilage, and so the buds won't be getting exposed - you need to move the light or plant around. I seriously doubt the UVB will make it through a single layer of leaves.
I think by far the best idea is to drop some vertical strips through the grow, or cfl's without reflectprs amd sure the plants are turned all the time. That way, each bud will be getting bombed with UVB. You can pull the ballast and bulb connectors out a normal fluoro fitting, then hook the light up minus the metal casing so there's nothing to create a shadow.
Light movers are good, but it'll still be mainly the canopy that's getting the UVB. The UVB won't go through the leaves. Where ever there's a leaf, the UVB will be getting destroyed and it won't go through to lower leaves / buds.
HOHO
New Member
i think there is little shading at all with my setup...the uvb bulb that i have puts off alot of uvb at about a 45 degree angle from the bulb and at around 12 inches from the bulb that would cover about 2 1/2 feet and penetrate about 2 feet effectively from the bulb....the mover mixed with the 45 degree angle covers more than u think...remember people have grown great pot with out any uvb for years indoors..you add perfect conditions with any uvb and its going to be better than none...
and when you shape your plants like this, it can really be affective cuz ALL my buds are less than 2 feet from my bulbs..
and when you shape your plants like this, it can really be affective cuz ALL my buds are less than 2 feet from my bulbs..
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moodster
Well-Known Member
did you strip everything off the lower branches while in veg or just going into flower?? thanks m8i think there is little shading at all with my setup...the uvb bulb that i have puts off alot of uvb at about a 45 degree angle from the bulb and at around 12 inches from the bulb that would cover about 2 1/2 feet and penetrate about 2 feet effectively from the bulb....the mover mixed with the 45 degree angle covers more than u think...remember people have grown great pot with out any uvb for years indoors..you add perfect conditions with any uvb and its going to be better than none...
and when you shape your plants like this, it can really be affective cuz ALL my buds are less than 2 feet from my bulbs..
HOHO
New Member
i have to 2 different aged set of clones,1 was vegged for 3 weeks then topped and vegged for 3 more weeks..and the others were vegged for 10 days then topped and vegged for 10 more days and the ones in the buckets were mothers...then on 10th day flower topped some that needed it again and trimmed all of them.
mindphuk
Well-Known Member
Good chart prepared using a UVB meter
http://www.reptileuvinfo.com/docs/mercury-vapour-lamps-long-distance-output.pdf
It appears the professional/zoo bulbs might be a good choice for us. Ones like these
http://www.reptileuv.com/megaray-sb-160-watt-self-ballasted-flood-zoo-lamp.php
http://www.reptileuv.com/megaray-eb-60-watt-flood-zoo-lamp-kit.php
are made to be placed further away.
http://www.reptileuvinfo.com/docs/mercury-vapour-lamps-long-distance-output.pdf
It appears the professional/zoo bulbs might be a good choice for us. Ones like these
http://www.reptileuv.com/megaray-sb-160-watt-self-ballasted-flood-zoo-lamp.php
http://www.reptileuv.com/megaray-eb-60-watt-flood-zoo-lamp-kit.php
are made to be placed further away.
Sorry HOHO, that sounded harsher than it should have done - I was just trying to think up the best possible way the light could be distributed. It obviously depends a lot on your plants and setup and I would agree that having plants like yours, a 45 degree bulb on a mover would create excellent light distribution.
1 square meter = 10.7639104 ft^2
10 000 cm^2 per m^2, so 1 square foot = 10,000 / 10.7639 = 929 cm^2
Topfuel says;
"so we need .23211 watts per Sqr. ft. of UVB"
.23211 W = 232,110 uW / ft^2
Since there are about 929 cm^2 in each ft ^2, that's... 249 uW / ft^2
I checked the number afterwards with http://www.reptilesdownunder.com/reptile/reptilesAsPets/enclosure/uv/uvSA ;
"Outside on a sunny day, UVB readings are around 250 µW/cm2."
Comparing it with the document you've posted, it would seem to suggest the big bulbs are the way to go for some.
At first I thought they'd be way too much - but looking at the rate the UVB intensity falls off you can see how they'd be good if your high power bulb is a foot or two away.
You see that the intensity is roughly halving for every extra foot?
UVB wattages you see for the fluoro's are assuming you're going to have them close to your reptiles - the output of the bulb is actually measured right up against the glass.
Now apply the document you found, intensity halving every foot away, to CFL / fluoro.
What I found was these two sites;
http://www.reptilesdownunder.com/reptile/reptilesAsPets/enclosure/uv/uvSA
http://www.uvguide.co.uk/phototherapyphosphor-tests.htm
To put the numbers into context, even with something like a 26w 10.0 CFL, you're only meeting the sunlight requirement around 6" from the bulb.
With other bulbs, moving to a foot away produces something around 150 uW / cm^2 or less.
So two important things to note are that unless the CFL / fluoros are close the amount of UVB won't be the same as bright sunlight.
And, the intensity falls off so quickly that a foot further down the plant it'll be a lot less than sunlight UVB levels. HOHO's plants (with all the buds near the canopy) would help solve that, but for people with buds all over the place at different heights, illuminating from above with a UVB will mean you not only risk shadows but also having a low UVB level further down due to the light spreading out.
The other risk is, if you buy one huge wattage mercury UVB lamp, that might get the sunlight level UVB lower down but the intensity will be huge at the canopy and might stress the cola.
The short of it seems to be, if you buy CFL / Fluors you'll want 10.0 20W+ versions and they'll need to be around a foot or less from bud / tric heavy sites.
The big mercury bulbs produce lots more, but they also don't spread it very well using those reptile designs - they'll produce a cone of bright UVB. We could do with a standard mercury UVB that looks like a HID, to spread it out more.
From the link earlier in the thread, there's a picture of light distribution from the big mercury reptile lamps and you can see it's much stronger in a kind of V shape directly under the bulb.
Maybe we could modify the reptile bulbs by putting a cone shaped reflector under the bulb to spread the light out into a fan or smoother profile? Photographers and camera drews do the same when they light things with bright lamps. There's a reflector directly in front of the bulb to spread out the bright patch the glowing bulb makes - so you don't get sharp reflections in the images.
You can also buy UV mercury bulbs that look like this (and these may give a better spread);
It'll depend a lot on your situation. If you have insanely well trained plants and a light mover like HOHO, you could go for one or two higher power lamps and sweep them over the sites.
Say HOHO has his HID 2 foot from the canopy, from the document mindphuk linked to, something like the MegaRay 60w EB would produce almost exactly sunlight UVB levels at the canopy. His light mover is critical to keeping the light distributed through and the more uniform budding height means they'll all be getting about the same UVB.
http://www.megaray.co.uk/index.php?page=60w Zoo EB
If the UVB's were run closer, a foot or less, CFLs / Fluoros might work and would probably give a nice spread (the fluoros definitly would).
In the document mindphuk posted they list the age of the bulbs. Some of them drop off in intensity by almost 75% over a year. Others are a lot less.
BloodShot420
Well-Known Member
the professional/zoo bulbs require a phone call to order, and they will only sell to zoos or professional reptile fuckers...
those produce DANGEROUS levels of uv... some of them are designed to be 8' away from the reptiles.
i mean, a uv index of over 100 at 18" would be a little crazy... considering that on earth, a uv index of 10 or 11 is "strong"...
good info though...
those produce DANGEROUS levels of uv... some of them are designed to be 8' away from the reptiles.
i mean, a uv index of over 100 at 18" would be a little crazy... considering that on earth, a uv index of 10 or 11 is "strong"...
good info though...
There's almost certainly someway to pick them up - an online retailer that doesn't bother with phone calls. Even if you are calling just say you're aware of the UV issue and come up with some ingenious reason for why you need it (Epoxy based glues and paints can be UV cured)the professional/zoo bulbs require a phone call to order, and they will only sell to zoos or professional reptile fuckers...
those produce DANGEROUS levels of uv... some of them are designed to be 8' away from the reptiles.
i mean, a uv index of over 100 at 18" would be a little crazy... considering that on earth, a uv index of 10 or 11 is "strong"...
good info though...
UV curing lamps might actually work better, since they're usually a kind of HID shape instead of a normal bulb shape
Yeah... no fucking round with these dirty whores. You want them 100% off whenever the room is open or you'll end up with cataracts - I don't even like spending long right under 1000w halides.
Halides work in the same way as the UV lamps, they just have a special coating that blocks the UV. It may even be possible to convert a normal halide to a UV lamp by just smashing the outer cover - I'll have to check
mindphuk
Well-Known Member
Has anyone tried to contact them and let them know that they would not be used with animals but a plant? They won't sell to hobbyists without a UV meter because they are concerned about the well being of the animals. If you aren't going to use it with a reptile, they shouldn't have a problem selling you one.the professional/zoo bulbs require a phone call to order, and they will only sell to zoos or professional reptile fuckers...
those produce DANGEROUS levels of uv... some of them are designed to be 8' away from the reptiles.
i mean, a uv index of over 100 at 18" would be a little crazy... considering that on earth, a uv index of 10 or 11 is "strong"...
good info though...
Good thinking.
Although, one to word carefully.
"Yeah, I need the sickest huge bulb you've got for growing... er.... something..."
Curing paint would be good since it's not connected and can't harm anything. When they tell you it's not designed for that just say it's knowledge passed down from painter to painter, like a rare gemstone
You guys think these things are big, you should check out the ones that actually are used for curing paint - they're rated in kW
It's also correct that really bright UV lamps will produce Ozone, which'll break down odor molecules.
BloodShot420
Well-Known Member
thats pretty awesome...
i've worked around some uv curing ovens... thats definitely not the kind of uv you want for plants
they are scary... you can turn them up so that if you throw something in the oven, it will catch on fire before it lands.... it cures paint fast, but you would die if you tried to walk through it... and the heat up time is like, the speed of light... EEEK!
i've worked around some uv curing ovens... thats definitely not the kind of uv you want for plants
they are scary... you can turn them up so that if you throw something in the oven, it will catch on fire before it lands.... it cures paint fast, but you would die if you tried to walk through it... and the heat up time is like, the speed of light... EEEK!
mindphuk
Well-Known Member
You should tell them you have a herbivorous species like a green iguana. Beardies don't need as much UV since they are omnivores.