True HP Aero For 2011

[Trichy Bastard]

Could you explain the difference between the red cloudtops and the bios nozzles? I wonder what makes them produce different types of root growth? I am not looking at plastic nozzles but it is still useful info for sure, thanks.

The biocontrol nozzles are impingement style- as in they have a larger orifice less prone to clogging, but stream a short distance to impale itself on a "impingement pin" that causes the water to fan out and break up. They have the correct droplet size (actually a bit bigger than cloudtops) and they afford much better coverage and throw of mist so you can use less nozzles yet achieve good coverage while keeping your gpm down. The spray pattern also tends to coax the roots downward as opposed to floating uptop and this causes the roots to not ball-up high and choke themselves off from the spray inside the middle of the rootball like the other nozzles are notorious for doing. tree farmer has tried many many nozzles, and still swears by them as basically being his nozzle of choice at any price- and if your familiar with his results you'll know we're all just basically trying to follow his lead as a starting point for "amazing".
Don't discount them just because they're plastic- the best nozzles are the best nozzles, and have a feeling you're just trying to have the "best" right? Bete makes rather similar ss ones for 40$ a piece, but tf claims the bios still performed better for him if I remember correctly...

 

[Trichy Bastard]

I am really interested to see if anyone has experience with these. For the price it can't be beat for SS, I wonder what could be the issue? I assume it is hydraulic pressure only...

These nozzles have been available on Alibaba.com for a long time for even cheaper - and are probably where this person got them from. The issue was waiting forever for them to be shipped from China, and arranging payment. I bet they actually are the Bete nozzles directly from the plant that manufactures them in China. I'd like to order one or two just to compare to the bios- might just do that- thanks- good score Aeropuff!

 

[Trichy Bastard]

Actually, taking another look at the spec sheet, it looks like they have some with larger orifices' but the flow rates get up there pretty quick.

Bio .016" = 1.125 gph
Bio .025" = 2.25 gph

Bete .015" = 3.54 gph
Bete .024" = 9.6 gph

To get similar throughput as the bio's you'd have to run the .008" - .012" PJ's. Personally, I would just go with the bio's. I know I've slammed them in the past, but I also never traded my shitty ones back to them.

A hole and a pin is a hole and a pin I'd tend to think... The difference in flowrate is likely due to being tested at different pressures (higher pressure=higher flowrate at same orifice size), so if you could get the exact same orifice diameter in these ss ones, they'd probably be a damn better version of the bios I am thinking...

 

[Aeropuff]

These nozzles have been available on Alibaba.com for a long time for even cheaper - and are probably where this person got them from. The issue was waiting forever for them to be shipped from China, and arranging payment. I bet they actually are the Bete nozzles directly from the plant that manufactures them in China. I'd like to order one or two just to compare to the bios- might just do that- thanks- good score Aeropuff!

hehe no problem TB, glad to help. I really hope they are not crap.

Ok so I went ahead and ordered a garden hose to 1/4 tube adapter, I have some 1/4 tubing laying around, 1/4 tube filter strainer, a 1/4 tube to 1/4 npt adapter and my regular ebay 1/4 npt solenoid valve, I already have some Biocontrol plastic nozzles and I will order a few of these SS ones from Ebay...

I was thinking of just doing a simple side by side test, splitting the the 1/4 tubing in 2 ways...have two solenoids at each end...one with the Bios and one with the SS ebay nozzle...use my GoPro 2 camera to record video at 120fps...have the solenoids open for lets say 1 second and use some video software to slowdown the video and compare the results...would be cool to see in slow motion how the mist builds up, the reaction time of the solenoids...and even how long the mist from each nozzle stays floating in the air...how far the mist travels...and many other things too.

What do you think? I already have everything mentioned above and I just ordered the 1/4 to garden hose adapter, which was only a few bucks. It would be a simple way to compare the two nozzles at the same pressure...not sure what my garden hose water pressure is at but I could easily find out...

 

[jamesvagabond]

They are certainly cheap enough to do a side by side test with the BETE nozzles. Only issue is I am interested in the XA air assisted series, so it will be comparing apples to oranges. The bright side is that I will have plenty of backups in case of clogging or upscale. I am slowly waiting on my bank account to get some zeros in it, then I will be ready to make the leap. I hate doing a little at a time, I am an all or nothing guy otherwise my attention span won't keep up.

 

[Trichy Bastard]

Just wanted to post the link to this NASA PDF on their style of aero... http://www.nasa.gov/pdf/164449main_spinoff_06.pdf (PAGE 64)
I've been pondering trying that Beyond stuff from Agrihouse/Bio-Controls in my aero and will probably give it a shot soon, especially after reading this...

 

[jamesvagabond]

All this is inspiring me to go back to grad school just so I can use the lab equipment for actually useful stuff. It goes hand in hand with my algae research; I just really get dragged down from all the hoops and trained monkeys. Gotta pay dues I guess...

Anyone on here offer fellowships ha?!

 

[Trichy Bastard]

Very nice work there, nuggly! I too plan to build a HPA on top, RDWC on bottom setup. Trying my hand at straight RDWC for now. Messing with the PH constantly is quite the pain. This bush should be finished in 10-15 days. I hope you start a thread on your hybrid setup.
View attachment 2520870View attachment 2520871

Mikey- r u still uing the Dyna? It's ph is super stable if you use the Pro-tekt silica with it in proper amounts. Use near equal amounts of silica and gro (maybe just slightly more gro and basically use your silica/gro balance to achieve the perfect ph as opposed to using ph+ and ph-) and you should get near 5.8 ph that won't fluctuate much due to the silica's buffering abilities...

 

[Trichy Bastard]

hehe no problem TB, glad to help. I really hope they are not crap.

Ok so I went ahead and ordered a garden hose to 1/4 tube adapter, I have some 1/4 tubing laying around, 1/4 tube filter strainer, a 1/4 tube to 1/4 npt adapter and my regular ebay 1/4 npt solenoid valve, I already have some Biocontrol plastic nozzles and I will order a few of these SS ones from Ebay...

I was thinking of just doing a simple side by side test, splitting the the 1/4 tubing in 2 ways...have two solenoids at each end...one with the Bios and one with the SS ebay nozzle...use my GoPro 2 camera to record video at 120fps...have the solenoids open for lets say 1 second and use some video software to slowdown the video and compare the results...would be cool to see in slow motion how the mist builds up, the reaction time of the solenoids...and even how long the mist from each nozzle stays floating in the air...how far the mist travels...and many other things too.

What do you think? I already have everything mentioned above and I just ordered the 1/4 to garden hose adapter, which was only a few bucks. It would be a simple way to compare the two nozzles at the same pressure...not sure what my garden hose water pressure is at but I could easily find out...

Sounds great, would like to see the differences in spray- plus now you have all you need to make an hp cloner off mains pressure ...

 

[Mike Young]

Mikey- r u still uing the Dyna? It's ph is super stable if you use the Pro-tekt silica with it in proper amounts. Use near equal amounts of silica and gro (maybe just slightly more gro and basically use your silica/gro balance to achieve the perfect ph as opposed to using ph+ and ph-) and you should get near 5.8 ph that won't fluctuate much due to the silica's buffering abilities...

I am still using it, and silica. I had a spell of dropping PH, but I attribute it to my well water. Other than that, I'm pleased with it's results & ease of use. I chopped yesterday. Pretty soon I'll start working on the next system. When I can pull myself away from other hobbies. Been distilling moonshine in my kitchen. Super easy, and you can't beat the price!

 

[Trichy Bastard]

I am still using it, and silica. I had a spell of dropping PH, but I attribute it to my well water. Other than that, I'm pleased with it's results & ease of use. I chopped yesterday. Pretty soon I'll start working on the next system. When I can pull myself away from other hobbies. Been distilling moonshine in my kitchen. Super easy, and you can't beat the price!

View attachment 2543320View attachment 2543321

Wow- lookin nice man- nice thick stalk! I'd love to learn more about your moonshine technique- jus be careful, quite a few people have gone blind or died by accidentally over-producing methyl-alcohol instead of ethyl-alcohol in their home alcohol production. :O

 

[localhero]

the trick is to dump the first cup of distilled alcohol as the methanol evaporates off first hahah I love the mmj culture, you get to learn so much random shit. I was making moonshine for ethanol extractions and purifying bho as ethanol is more selective than butane and you can get out the waxes that the butane strips off.

 

[Aeropuff]

Sounds great, would like to see the differences in spray- plus now you have all you need to make an hp cloner off mains pressure ...

Didnt even think about that...great idea! thx TB

 

[jamesvagabond]

Can anyone point me to the post that Atomizer laid out comparing a single drop of water vs the same volume atomized to 50um? I have found it a couple times but it is evading me this time and I am in the middle of writing to BETE about nozzles. I figured out my maximum saturation for a 9x12 chamber is 2.42 oz per misting cycle, but I can't remember the math I did to get that figure. The guy needs gallons per minute, and I am unsure how to get that figure. It seems like I'd need the flow rate of the nozzle to determine that, but I am brain farting today.

 

[jamesvagabond]

Can anyone point me to the post that Atomizer laid out comparing a single drop of water vs the same volume atomized to 50um? I have found it a couple times but it is evading me this time and I am in the middle of writing to BETE about nozzles. I figured out my maximum saturation for a 9x12 chamber is .303 oz per misting cycle, but I can't remember the math I did to get that figure. The guy needs gallons per minute, and I am unsure how to get that figure. It seems like I'd need the flow rate of the nozzle to determine that, but I am brain farting today.

Nevermind I found it. But I still don't know what to tell the guy when he wants the units in gpm?

 

[konagirl420]

Go TB Konagirl is now officially a CaliGirl again hehehe !! Yay sailing smooth

 

[BflexNJshore]

Hey trich I'm back. Checking in on me...has motivated me to get the ball rolling. The root balling and sprayer placement conundrum has detered me from even starting an experiment. My obsessiveness to get this right the first time and that has blinded me. I want to save space, I think we all do when it comes to the root chamber design, amount of coverage and mister placement. Maybe we have been looking at this the wrong way, maybe someone else has tried it but I can find any data on root taming. So I'm going hybrid. I took trip to action park this past summer, water slides got me thinking. A constant stream of water. Yeah yeah I know this is aeroponics, but what if, just what if I direct the roots into a pattern which keeps an area open for the proper atomization?

 

[LivingCanvas]

Hello fellow HP Aero geeks!!

I'm finally getting close to finishing my Flojet + Accum control module.
Unfortunately I am running into pressure and pump control issues that are confusing me and could use some advice.

Edit: Just found out that the Relief valve spring wasn't applying any pressure. (Wtf?) So I am going to get a small #10 bolt and thread it to adjust the relief pressure. We'll see how that goes...

Anyone know about how long it should take to fully charge a 2 gal accumulator?

My pump has a flow rate of 1.6gal/Min so I figure if pressure isn't achieved within ~1min, then the tank isn't full.
But a 2gal tank shouldn't have more than a 1.6gal drawdown, right?

This is really frustrating me. Any help or guidance would be greatly appreciated!

To Trichy, Fatman, Rom30, Atomizer, Petflora, Treefarmer, and others, thank you all for you wisdom in this
exciting area of growing! I wouldn't be this far without meticulously reading and re-reading your threads!

 

[Trichy Bastard]

Nevermind I found it. But I still don't know what to tell the guy when he wants the units in gpm?

use a online calculator to convert litres and gallons... I think it was 1 liter of nutes per 100 litres of air, however I'm not sure right now and it's best to backtrack to his formulae. Remember, it's only a guideline and you might end up saturating heavier than that in your real world application, but it's a guiding light to start from...

 

[Trichy Bastard]

Hey trich I'm back. Checking in on me...has motivated me to get the ball rolling. The root balling and sprayer placement conundrum has detered me from even starting an experiment. My obsessiveness to get this right the first time and that has blinded me. I want to save space, I think we all do when it comes to the root chamber design, amount of coverage and mister placement. Maybe we have been looking at this the wrong way, maybe someone else has tried it but I can find any data on root taming. So I'm going hybrid. I took trip to action park this past summer, water slides got me thinking. A constant stream of water. Yeah yeah I know this is aeroponics, but what if, just what if I direct the roots into a pattern which keeps an area open for the proper atomization?

Using the biocontrol nozzles should sort out any issues- just try it and save yourself the other troubles...